Royal Purple or Pennzoil Platinum

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: wemay

From M1's website, concerning their AFE:

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_0W-30.aspx

Fuel Savings Worksheet

Cumulative Miles 50,000 100,000 150,000
Estimated Savings* $147.....$294.....$441

*Based on 20 MPG, $3/gal gasoline and a potential 2% fuel economy improvement (based on a comparison versus those grades most commonly used). Actual savings are dependent upon vehicle/engine type, outside temperature, driving conditions and your current motor oil viscosity.


Yup. RP doesn't give a percentage on their page:

http://www.royalpurpleconsumer.com/why-use-synthetic-oil/

They do give the following statements though:

Originally Posted By: Royal Purple

Simply labeling an engine oil as “synthetic” is not a reliable indicator of quality, as the overall formulation of the oil is the most important factor in the quality and efficacy of the lubricant. A well-formulated conventional engine oil can outperform a poorly formulated “synthetic” engine oil. With that said, beginning the formulation of a motor oil with high quality synthetic base stocks does allow for a superior product compared to an equal quality level conventional motor oil.


Originally Posted By: Royal Purple
Better Mileage. Because of the superior cold flow, greater lubricity, and cleaner operation of the engine, premium synthetic engine oils can also contribute to greater fuel economy.


The latter which ties into the point I've made, and the point that CATERHAM has made numerous times about higher VI (synthetic) oils yielding an increase in MPG (albeit a small one) during warm-up.

A 2012 Escape 3.0 V6 FWD is rated for 19 city, 25 highway. A 2% improvement to both numbers gives us 19.4 and 25.5. A 3Mpg gain would be a 12% increase in fuel economy highway and a 16% increase in city, FWIW.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
Your right. It is that either I am the first person that has ever seen an increase in fuel economy by switching to a full synthetic oil, Im lying; or, we all got together, had a meeting, and decided to help out big oil company _______ by spreading these rumors. Get a grip. Accept that switching to any full synthetic oil can increase fuel economy.

No one accused you of lying or engaging in a conspiracy or shilling a product. The fact remains that you (nor I nor anyone else here without some pretty specialized equipment) can determine fuel savings from one grade of oil to another, much less one brand of oil to another, within statistical significance. I posted a mathematically rigorous demonstration ages ago as to how I can't even determine the difference between the fuel economy of an ILSAC 30 grade in my G versus an HDEO. HTHS is far more important to fuel economy than is any nebulous difference between a synthetic and a conventional.

There certainly are differences though, and the differences add up. We simply can't measure them in normal vehicle usage.

Incidentally, I'm a Royal Purple fan myself, but have never seen any significant difference going from Delvac 1300 15w-40 to RP 0w-40 in my Audi.

 

[CharBaby]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
Originally Posted By: timeau
Originally Posted By: jk_636
I will be changing the oil in my wife's 2012 Escape 3.0 soon. .... if PP is the same as or better than the RP I'll save the $12 and go with PP.

Save more. Your Escape does not ask for synthetic. Use PYB, cheaper and at least not worse. Just curious, why do you use synthetic? What benefits are you expecting?


Factory spec is 5-20 Motorcraft Semi-synthetic. The day I put Royal Purple in it (its 4th oil change) it gained a considerable amount of fuel economy ( about 3 mpg +/-). Thats not the OLM, thats me calculating it at fill ups. We bought this car brand new, and it will replace my truck when the time comes. I plan on using the best oil I can, even if I dont run crazy extended oil change intervals in it.
Originally Posted By: jk_636
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
SuperTech full synthetic

The MPG difference with the RP could be the oil itself or just the whole drivetrain breaking in(4th OCI). Or a variety of other reasons such as tires wearing in nicely, as well and outside tempuratures. But, it is what it is!

There is also lots of information here about Super Tech Dino & Syn Oils. Certainly nothing to laugh at as the ST oils are a very good everyday value for the every person and their daily driver. I have used them(mainly dino) and have run my engines many 100K's of miles.

As stated here at BITOG over the years, the engine will outlast the rest of the vehicle with the mininum of OCI's set by the owners manual.

Much to learn as we all have over the years. IMHO today, we can use just about any recomended oil in our engines with good success. Even 45 years ago, I couldn't hurt an engine when I was using a hodge-podge of oils in my engines and running the snot out of them.

 

[slomo]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: EricF
I drank the PPU juice for my van and have been getting a noticable mileage increase.

I think past RP posts were saying the base oils are group 2+ ??
Was branded a boutique oil.

I'm switching away from VV synpower to PPU.



RP is PAO and Esters.



In the base oil or add pack? Please show me some proof.

 

[slomo]

Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
Last i checked the jug of RP at walmart was over $40 and the PP was $25. The API SN RP doesn't contain any synerlec and i would be surprised if it contained any PAO/Esters either.

PP is already overkill for this application, use the money you save and buy a Fram Ultra. If you can throw money around like it's nobody's business, go for the Amsoil Signature series.


Since you guys are all walmart lovers, get the purolator classic for about 2 bucks instead of any fram.

 

[slomo]

Originally Posted By: deven
Originally Posted By: jk_636
Originally Posted By: timeau
Originally Posted By: jk_636
I will be changing the oil in my wife's 2012 Escape 3.0 soon. .... if PP is the same as or better than the RP I'll save the $12 and go with PP.

Save more. Your Escape does not ask for synthetic. Use PYB, cheaper and at least not worse. Just curious, why do you use synthetic? What benefits are you expecting?


Factory spec is 5-20 Motorcraft Semi-synthetic. The day I put Royal Purple in it (its 4th oil change) it gained a considerable amount of fuel economy ( about 3 mpg +/-). Thats not the OLM, thats me calculating it at fill ups. We bought this car brand new, and it will replace my truck when the time comes. I plan on using the best oil I can, even if I dont run crazy extended oil change intervals in it.

You're not the first one to to report a mileage increase changing to RP. I am also one of them. PP is a Grp III synthetic and RP is a Group IV+V synthetic. This is why you pay extra money for it. Sometimes when they say that you get what you pay for is true. If you want the best oil then IMO Grp IV oils are better because they burn cleaner and have better oxidative stability.
But honestly you could use either oils and your engine will outlast the rest of the car.


Can you please show me some proof of the groups you listed? I can't find anything on RP's site that claims group 4 or 5. Same with Penzoil or any other brands basically. All we hear is the famous buzz word "synthetic" which no regulatory body exists for motor oils. All oil makers can label their snake oil "synthetic" and get away with it. Even though it's not a true group 4 or 5. Or maybe one part of the add pack is actually synthetic, and the rest is non synthetic and the base oil is group 2.

 

[slomo]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
SuperTech full synthetic

What's wrong with it? Please show us some links or actual proof against it. Oh I got it, it's labeled in a Walmart bottle and doesn't impress your friends like a group 2 Mobile 1.

 

[slomo]

Originally Posted By: wemay
https://m.facebook.com/OfficialRoyalPurple/posts/454145101315006

Royal Purple's Anthony Dickenson-
'Royal Purple uses a blend of synthetic Group IV and V base oils for our motor oil base stock but we do not use Group III Hydro-cracked...'




Must be true if Anthony said it, LOL. Was this a blanket statement for all their passenger car oils? Where's the actual proof RP is a group 4 or 5? Not some he said she said on Facebook.

 

[slomo]

Originally Posted By: jk_636

Originally Posted By: deven
Same as +3 mpg for RP. If this would be true, all manufatures would use it without any additional efforts. Just marketing...


You really cant believe that a brand new vehicle gained MPG when switiching from a semi-synthetic (Motorcraft) oil to a full synthetic oil? Come on now, this is getting a bit ridiculous.


With 3 to 4 more MPG no less..... Bet when you turn the key off it takes six minutes for the engine to wind down. LOL

 

[slomo]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: jk_636
Im not going to argue this point any longer. There is a plethora of research out there that proves that many, many people have increased their MPG when switching from dino to full synthetic oils. Perhaps you should do some research. Just because it didn't happen for you does not make it impossible.


See, that "research" is very subjective and claimed by people with an agenda usually. That agenda of course being that they are observing some sort of measurable benefit from the change. Going from 5w-30 conventional to 5w-30 synthetic isn't going to net anybody a 3Mpg gain. If it did, as I said, the OEM's would be all over it, as it is WAY cheaper than re-engineering an engine to run a grade thinner, which is the current approach.

That's not to say somebody won't pick up a fraction of a MPG or something, that's believable. A high VI synthetic, on a car that is short tripped I'm sure will have some form of small measurable increase in fuel economy. But 3Mpg is not a small increase and is the number I am contesting here.

If Royal Purple could claim that they net the average conventional user a 3Mpg gain in fuel economy with a switch to one of their synthetic offerings in the same grade you'd bet they'd be all over that too

Any oil maker would be. Instead, the claims are vague, like with Mobil one's "AFE" lineup, because the gains primarily occur during warm-up and really aren't that much.


This thread has nothing to do with oil weights. Why you keep bringing this up, I have no idea.

You cant believe that I gained considerable MPG on the highway when I switched to a high grade, full synthetic oil.

I cant believe you are on BITOG saying that Synthetic oils wont/dont/cant increase your gas mileage as compared to conventional oils.

I will let the rest of the members here decide which statement has more merit.





I see how these guys get 3+ more mpg. They drove with a tail wind pushing the vehicle and no A/C running in the winter. Way to go Royal Purple.

 

[kschachn]

No, there isn't.

Originally Posted By: jk_636
Im not going to argue this point any longer. There is a plethora of research out there that proves that many, many people have increased their MPG when switching from dino to full synthetic oils. Perhaps you should do some research. Just because it didn't happen for you does not make it impossible.

 

[barkingspider]

Originally Posted By: jk_636
I will be changing the oil in my wife's 2012 Escape 3.0 soon. I have been using 6 qts Royal purple 5w20 and various filters so far. I have heard a lot of good things about Pennzoil Platinum recently, and while at walmart I noticed that it is considerably cheaper than RP. I know one of these threads went around a couple years ago, but what is the final verdict? I used the RP because of the synerlec and have always had good luck with everything RP, but if PP is the same as or better than the RP I'll save the $12 and go with PP.


PP will be the same if not better than RP in your vehicle. PP will absolutely be better on your wallet. Make the switch, if u don't like it, switch back

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: wemay
From M1's website, concerning their AFE:

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_0W-30.aspx

Fuel Savings Worksheet

Cumulative Miles 50,000 100,000 150,000
Estimated Savings* $147.....$294.....$441

*Based on 20 MPG, $3/gal gasoline and a potential 2% fuel economy improvement (based on a comparison versus those grades most commonly used). Actual savings are dependent upon vehicle/engine type, outside temperature, driving conditions and your current motor oil viscosity.


You have to read that information very carefully. For example, note that like you said (my highlights):

Quote:
Comparison based upon 2% potential fuel economy improvement obtained by switching from higher viscosity oils to a 0W-20 or 0W-30 grade. Actual savings are dependent upon vehicle/engine type, outside temperature, driving conditions and your current engine oil viscosity.

and:

Quote:
Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy provides faster lubrication and less viscous drag than higher viscosity oils.


Nowhere in those two claims do they unambiguously state that the improvement is obtained by going from a 5W-30 to a 0W-30, for example. Or even from a 5W-30 to a 0W-20. It might be, but then again the way it is worded it might just as well be shown going from a 20W-50 to a 0W-20.

 

[snowflake]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
API SN RP does not have Synerlec. Only the HPS, non API versions of RP have synerlec.

RP is a great oil but for a daily driver, there is no reason to spend more.

their high mileage has it also.

 

[kschachn]

Maybe Mobile 1 is Group II oil, but Mobil 1 is not. Show us where you got that.

Originally Posted By: slomo
What's wrong with it? Please show us some links or actual proof against it. Oh I got it, it's labeled in a Walmart bottle and doesn't impress your friends like a group 2 Mobile 1.

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted By: slomo

Must be true if Anthony said it, LOL. Was this a blanket statement for all their passenger car oils? Where's the actual proof RP is a group 4 or 5? Not some he said she said on Facebook.


Just pointing out what one of their reps says...

Maybe it is a Grp IV/V, maybe it isn't. It is a very good oil though. Even the API.

Originally Posted By: kschachn

Nowhere in those two claims do they unambiguously state that the improvement is obtained by going from a 5W-30 to a 0W-30, for example. Or even from a 5W-30 to a 0W-20. It might be, but then again the way it is worded it might just as well be shown going from a 20W-50 to a 0W-20.


Agreed 100%. Garak put it best, no one is saying RP isn't a great product, just that those MPG claims are pretty sensational. Not even M1, who tout their 0w20/30 as AFE, makes claims such as that.

 

[Garak]

And, we either trust that it's Group IV/V, or we don't. If he's asking for proof, he's not going to get it, unless he amasses the expertise himself and rents whatever equipment is necessary to determine all that himself. Otherwise, he must trust someone else's assertions.

RP was a pretty good bargain for the Audi. For the F-150, not so much. It all depends on the application and to what one is comparing things. RP is a very good alternative up here to $55+ per jug M1 EP at Canadian Tire or $70+ a jug PU at NAPA. It's not a good alternative to M1 EP when that product is rolled back to $30 or so per jug.

If I were adamant or forced to use an ILSAC rated synthetic and I had to pay regular retail prices for it, RP would be near the top of my list, just behind QSUD at the wholesale club. But I'm not so inclined, so I don't.

 

[13Tacoma]

You should step up to amsoil ss. It's why better and more expensive. Maybe do a 3-4k oci and you'll be giving that ford the best of the best.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: wemay
https://m.facebook.com/OfficialRoyalPurple/posts/454145101315006

Royal Purple's Anthony Dickenson-
'Royal Purple uses a blend of synthetic Group IV and V base oils for our motor oil base stock but we do not use Group III Hydro-cracked...'




Anthony Dickenson is confused this is the end result of P.R. employee spouting off on social media.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: 13Tacoma
You should step up to amsoil ss. It's why better and more expensive. Maybe do a 3-4k oci and you'll be giving that ford the best of the best.


3 to 4K OCI on Amsoil SS? OK tiger.