Fram Testimony

[dlundblad]

Long story. Hope you guys enjoy reading..

I used to use strictly Purolator classic filters and QSGB in my Jeep until I switched to M1 TDT which lead to M1 filters. Fram never crossed my mind because of all the web stories. During the fall of 2012, my Jeep developed a terrible tick. It was very bad on start up, but became intermittent while the engine was warm. Nothing was changed. Same oil and filter. I'm still confused at what could have caused this...

I gave M1 HM oil a try along with an M1 (still noisy) and later a WIX filter which made the tick much quieter, but still existed nonetheless. I gave up on the synthetic oil and switched to PYB and a Mopar filter. No more tick.. But after dissecting my filter, I was disgusted with the quality.. especially for the price at WM. I have since learned that the oil and filter both play the role of quiet running engine.. Not just the oil.

My last oil change, I went to QS Defy and a WIX... What do you know? It had a very loud annoying tick. 100 miles later I took that off and tried an M1 from my stash. Same results.. That was when I bought the Fram TG8A. No more tick!

Silicon ADBV, 35ish% synthetic/ cellulose media blend, 99.9% efficiency (I still think this figure is a joke.. just like something killing 99.9% of germs.. it could be the .1% that breaks the camels back.. who knows!) and it is rated for 10,000 miles. Ill admit that it is an overkill for my 5000 mile OCI, but I am okay with that. I am very happy and will continue to use this product on all my future dino using vehicles.

I am fully okay with the fiber end caps. Its just a different design than metal ones.. There's no right or wrong way of doing it. IMO, from the TG photos I have seen here, they hold up exceptionally well. The only thing keeping me from trying the EG, and the Ultra for that matter, is the fact that I have found something that works for me and find no reason to switch.

Its just funny how my opinion has changed.. I tried so hard to like the WIX filters with my limited experience. Other Jeep (Renix era) guys seemed to have good luck with them so I figured I would have the same results. Heck I even recommended them for "picky" Jeeps. My mistake.

** No brand bashing intended here whatsoever. **

 

[Jimmy9190]

Fram is a decent filter, I used the Extra Guards a lot back in the 80's, 90's and early 2000's, never had any oil or filter problems at all with Fram. Now I am considering changing back to a Fram EG myself on my next oil change. I am currently using a Wix-made Napa Silver but I have noticed my oil pressure gauge does not read quite the same as it did with a Puro Classic. It may not be that important but I might try a Fram next time to see if it makes a difference.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad

Silicon ADBV, 35ish% synthetic/ cellulose media blend, 99.9% efficiency (I still think this figure is a joke.. just like something killing 99.9% of germs.. it could be the .1% that breaks the camels back.. who knows!) and it is rated for 10,000 miles.


It's actually 99% (not 99.9%, that's Purolator), which is based on actual ISO 4548-12 testing procedures. So it's believable because Fram wouldn't put themselves into the risk of a false advertising lawsuit if it wasn't able to be proven.

http://fram.com/oil-filters/fram-tough-guard-oil-filter.aspx

The TG seems to be a pretty decent filter. I'm still curious if the fiber end caps used in the TG are thicker than the ones used in the EG.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: dlundblad

Silicon ADBV, 35ish% synthetic/ cellulose media blend, 99.9% efficiency (I still think this figure is a joke.. just like something killing 99.9% of germs.. it could be the .1% that breaks the camels back.. who knows!) and it is rated for 10,000 miles.


It's actually 99% (not 99.9%, that's Purolator), which is based on actual ISO 4548-12 testing procedures. So it's believable because Fram wouldn't put themselves into the risk of a false advertising lawsuit if it wasn't able to be proven.

http://fram.com/oil-filters/fram-tough-guard-oil-filter.aspx

The TG seems to be a pretty decent filter. I'm still curious if the fiber end caps used in the TG are thicker than the ones used in the EG.


Ah my mistake. 99% is a bit more realistic.. more science and less marketing IMO.

 

[HM12460]

Currently have a Fram Ultra on my Dakota. First Fram in 20 years.

 

[Chris142]

my 4.0 developed a tick that would come and go. i traced it to the opda. i could actully feel the tick there. pulled the cam senser off and found the bushing in the top of the opda was wallered out.

 

[SilverC6]

I always used FRAM OCOD's on my Jeep TJ.

They did fine.

My work Jeep Cherokee ('97 4.0 6 cyl.) has had a lifter tick for the last 80,000 miles.

It may not be a lifter but like noted in another post, it comes and goes.

It has had Warren oil and Hastings filters at 3000 mile OCI's.

It will probably keep ticking for another 100,000+ miles.

 

[dlundblad]

When I first started Googling "4.0 lifter tick" there were guys with brand new TJ Rubicons (back in 2003) complaining about the same thing. They are definitely a bit more of a vocal engine.

 

[Camprunner]

My brother in law has a Jeep with the 4.0 straight 6 that has 450,000 miles and it ticks like crazy he says it has for the last 200,000 miles. I'm not sure what oil and filter he runs? Frankly I don't think he cares.

I had no noise and a quiet engine running Fram TG filters on my Toyota 4Runner V6 I can't say the same for other filters I tried. I have no problems at all with the fiber, plastic or whatever end cap it is made of. I have cut several open usually at around 7,000 miles and all looked great. I have decided this will be my filter of choice on my new 2012 Nissan Pathfinder.

 

[CHARLIEBRONSON21]

Like that saying about third world countries using a hemi as a clock because it's always ticking.


And FTR I don't hate on dodge, it's just fun sometimes to get a laugh.

 

[David1]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
Long story. Hope you guys enjoy reading..

I used to use strictly Purolator classic filters and QSGB in my Jeep until I switched to M1 TDT which lead to M1 filters. Fram never crossed my mind because of all the web stories. During the fall of 2012, my Jeep developed a terrible tick. It was very bad on start up, but became intermittent while the engine was warm. Nothing was changed. Same oil and filter. I'm still confused at what could have caused this...

I gave M1 HM oil a try along with an M1 (still noisy) and later a WIX filter which made the tick much quieter, but still existed nonetheless. I gave up on the synthetic oil and switched to PYB and a Mopar filter. No more tick.. But after dissecting my filter, I was disgusted with the quality.. especially for the price at WM. I have since learned that the oil and filter both play the role of quiet running engine.. Not just the oil.

My last oil change, I went to QS Defy and a WIX... What do you know? It had a very loud annoying tick. 100 miles later I took that off and tried an M1 from my stash. Same results.. That was when I bought the Fram TG8A. No more tick!

Silicon ADBV, 35ish% synthetic/ cellulose media blend, 99.9% efficiency (I still think this figure is a joke.. just like something killing 99.9% of germs.. it could be the .1% that breaks the camels back.. who knows!) and it is rated for 10,000 miles. Ill admit that it is an overkill for my 5000 mile OCI, but I am okay with that. I am very happy and will continue to use this product on all my future dino using vehicles.

I am fully okay with the fiber end caps. Its just a different design than metal ones.. There's no right or wrong way of doing it. IMO, from the TG photos I have seen here, they hold up exceptionally well. The only thing keeping me from trying the EG, and the Ultra for that matter, is the fact that I have found something that works for me and find no reason to switch.

Its just funny how my opinion has changed.. I tried so hard to like the WIX filters with my limited experience. Other Jeep (Renix era) guys seemed to have good luck with them so I figured I would have the same results. Heck I even recommended them for "picky" Jeeps. My mistake.

** No brand bashing intended here whatsoever. **



QS Defy uses extra ZINC... I told to much zinc can cause your catalytic converters to get to hot and make them go bad... Also QS DEFY does not have the API Donuts on it that says API SL.. it will just say it.

Im sure you know the API Circle / seal

looks like this

Not saying Quaker State DEFY is not good.... I used it before and it was fine and I have noticed other oils that do not have seals and they are top shelf oils like VALVOLINE Maxxlife for instance will say DEXOS 1 Approved but wont actually have the logo.

anyways.. just thought I would bring that up or show you it.

Catalytic converters are expensive and a not fun to fix.

If there is to much ZINC in the oil or if u use it for a long time and over the years it causes problems to the the catalytics... I mean who knows. Plus some people might use this and add STP OIL TREATMENT and that has ZDDP or some people might actually add extra ZINC... who knows.. my point.. they dont have the API seal that 99% of all oils I have used for years have had on them.

why this one dont.. I dunno

why didnt Quaker State get the API seal? Its not even on there site?

The Green bottle stuff has the seal.

Also FRAM TOUGH GAURD is a great oil filter.. the Silicone ADBV does help on some cars durring start up.

Also did you try...... Pennzoil Symi syn? its real 50 50 syn oil... the only 1 I know of that actually says on bottle.

50% synthetic oil.

just wondering.

 

[Merkava_4]

With my next OCI I'm staying with the same type of oil but switching to a WIX XP filter. If there's any unusual noise, I'll know it's the filter. This is the first thread I've read where WIX filters were said to cause noise.

 

[David1]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
With my next OCI I'm staying with the same type of oil but switching to a WIX XP filter. If there's any unusual noise, I'll know it's the filter. This is the first thread I've read where WIX filters were said to cause noise.



Or to save $ get MicroGaurd... its basically a WIX / NAPA SILVER

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: David1
Or to save $ get MicroGaurd... its basically a WIX / NAPA SILVER


That's the one with the ADBV/BY-PASS combination valve isn't it ?

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
With my next OCI I'm staying with the same type of oil but switching to a WIX XP filter. If there's any unusual noise, I'll know it's the filter. This is the first thread I've read where WIX filters were said to cause noise.


I've used the WIX/ Napa Gold filters in a few other applications without any issues as well. Its just my Jeep that doesn't seem to like them.

Does the noise have anything to do with wear? Who knows.. but I hate the sound.

 

[Merkava_4]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
I've used the WIX/ Napa Gold filters in a few other applications without any issues as well. Its just my Jeep that doesn't seem to like them.

Does the noise have anything to do with wear? Who knows.. but I hate the sound.


Well, it doesn't take much to get me scared when the subject is engine noise. I never will forget the day when the Cadillac blew an oil pressure switch and sprayed engine oil all over the engine compartment. Oil pressure dropped immediately and the hydraulic lifters went dry - all of them! The loud ticking noise was horrible and still resonates in my head till this very day.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: David1
QS Defy uses extra ZINC... I told to much zinc can cause your catalytic converters to get to hot and make them go bad... Also QS DEFY does not have the API Donuts on it that says API SL.. it will just say it.

Im sure you know the API Circle / seal

looks like this

Not saying Quaker State DEFY is not good.... I used it before and it was fine and I have noticed other oils that do not have seals and they are top shelf oils like VALVOLINE Maxxlife for instance will say DEXOS 1 Approved but wont actually have the logo.

anyways.. just thought I would bring that up or show you it.

Catalytic converters are expensive and a not fun to fix.

If there is to much ZINC in the oil or if u use it for a long time and over the years it causes problems to the the catalytics... I mean who knows. Plus some people might use this and add STP OIL TREATMENT and that has ZDDP or some people might actually add extra ZINC... who knows.. my point.. they dont have the API seal that 99% of all oils I have used for years have had on them.

why this one dont.. I dunno

why didnt Quaker State get the API seal? Its not even on there site?

The Green bottle stuff has the seal.

Also FRAM TOUGH GAURD is a great oil filter.. the Silicone ADBV does help on some cars durring start up.

Also did you try...... Pennzoil Symi syn? its real 50 50 syn oil... the only 1 I know of that actually says on bottle.

50% synthetic oil.

just wondering.


I have also wondered why it doesn't have the API circle. Could it be because its an API SL oil that is made during the times of the API SN oil?

As for the zinc, I used M1 turbo diesel truck for the extra zinc specifically for about 50,000 miles.. so if I was to get some cat damage, I think its already done. Who knows. Lol.

I have been wanting to try the Pennzoil synthetic blend for winter use, but I have some 5w 30 PYB and PP to use up first. I have too much oil as it is, but if I can scoop some up on sale, I will go for it.

 

[KCJeep]

My Jeep doesn't like the fancy Wix/Napa Golds either, but it starts and runs better on Napa Silvers than any filter I've tried (and that is a lot). Maybe you should put a Silver on your "to try" list.

I also get excellent results with the Tough Guards just as you have experienced.

They are a bit pricey for my normal OCI but when running a longer OCI (like I am now with full syn) they are my top choice.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: David1
Originally Posted By: dlundblad
Long story. Hope you guys enjoy reading..

I used to use strictly Purolator classic filters and QSGB in my Jeep until I switched to M1 TDT which lead to M1 filters. Fram never crossed my mind because of all the web stories. During the fall of 2012, my Jeep developed a terrible tick. It was very bad on start up, but became intermittent while the engine was warm. Nothing was changed. Same oil and filter. I'm still confused at what could have caused this...

I gave M1 HM oil a try along with an M1 (still noisy) and later a WIX filter which made the tick much quieter, but still existed nonetheless. I gave up on the synthetic oil and switched to PYB and a Mopar filter. No more tick.. But after dissecting my filter, I was disgusted with the quality.. especially for the price at WM. I have since learned that the oil and filter both play the role of quiet running engine.. Not just the oil.

My last oil change, I went to QS Defy and a WIX... What do you know? It had a very loud annoying tick. 100 miles later I took that off and tried an M1 from my stash. Same results.. That was when I bought the Fram TG8A. No more tick!

Silicon ADBV, 35ish% synthetic/ cellulose media blend, 99.9% efficiency (I still think this figure is a joke.. just like something killing 99.9% of germs.. it could be the .1% that breaks the camels back.. who knows!) and it is rated for 10,000 miles. Ill admit that it is an overkill for my 5000 mile OCI, but I am okay with that. I am very happy and will continue to use this product on all my future dino using vehicles.

I am fully okay with the fiber end caps. Its just a different design than metal ones.. There's no right or wrong way of doing it. IMO, from the TG photos I have seen here, they hold up exceptionally well. The only thing keeping me from trying the EG, and the Ultra for that matter, is the fact that I have found something that works for me and find no reason to switch.

Its just funny how my opinion has changed.. I tried so hard to like the WIX filters with my limited experience. Other Jeep (Renix era) guys seemed to have good luck with them so I figured I would have the same results. Heck I even recommended them for "picky" Jeeps. My mistake.

** No brand bashing intended here whatsoever. **



QS Defy uses extra ZINC... I told to much zinc can cause your catalytic converters to get to hot and make them go bad... Also QS DEFY does not have the API Donuts on it that says API SL.. it will just say it.

Im sure you know the API Circle / seal

looks like this

Not saying Quaker State DEFY is not good.... I used it before and it was fine and I have noticed other oils that do not have seals and they are top shelf oils like VALVOLINE Maxxlife for instance will say DEXOS 1 Approved but wont actually have the logo.

anyways.. just thought I would bring that up or show you it.

Catalytic converters are expensive and a not fun to fix.

If there is to much ZINC in the oil or if u use it for a long time and over the years it causes problems to the the catalytics... I mean who knows. Plus some people might use this and add STP OIL TREATMENT and that has ZDDP or some people might actually add extra ZINC... who knows.. my point.. they dont have the API seal that 99% of all oils I have used for years have had on them.

why this one dont.. I dunno

why didnt Quaker State get the API seal? Its not even on there site?

The Green bottle stuff has the seal.

Also FRAM TOUGH GAURD is a great oil filter.. the Silicone ADBV does help on some cars durring start up.

Also did you try...... Pennzoil Symi syn? its real 50 50 syn oil... the only 1 I know of that actually says on bottle.

50% synthetic oil.

just wondering.


QS Defy has API SL levels of ZDDP thus no API certification. There is a post on here from Quaker State that states that Defy meets or exceeds all other API SN/ISLAC performance requirements but it is over the limit of 800PPM of ZDDP. Unless you have a oil burner for a engine that causes converter poisoning I would not worry. If you have a engine that is burning enough oil to cause converter problems you will cause you catalytic converter to fail no matter what oil use you use.