Subaru engine reliability?

[Tegger]

My beloved '91 Integra has terminal cancer in an invisible-but-impossible-to-repair location, and I must regrettably begin considering replacing it with something from the odious, loathsome, rolling-rubber-room, NHTSA-designed malignancies currently polluting the new-car market.

I was originally considering only the Honda CR-V or the Toyota RAV-4, but somebody in another thread suggested to me the Subaru Forester. Well, the Forester does look inviting, if for no other reason that you can actually see out the back and back-sides without needing a camera: the Forester has actual windows and not just gun slits! Impressive! How'd they get away with that and still pass the NHTSA death-tests?

Then I bought the latest edition of Consumer Reports New Car Ratings and Reviews. That publication tells me that Subaru vehicles, after they reach about six-years of age, tend to develop serious engine issues, specifically with the head gaskets and other major engine components. My long-term browsing and lurking in BITOG tends to confirm what CR's survey says.

So. What I'm asking for here are dissenting opinions, preferably backed by personal experience. Let's see 'em.

 

[Donald]

If you want a long lasting engine, get a diesel.

 

[eagle23]

I don't own a Subie, though I have 4 family members who do and LOVE them.

One way to interpret the CR data is not that Subies at 6 yr of age are problematic, but that the Subies of 6 yr AGO were problematic, not the current ones.

I'll let actual, you know, Subie owners comment now

 

[TTK]

There were some years, in the early 2000s, where head gasket problems did show up too frequently. I believe those issues have been solved. I don't think you can get any real statistics from BITOG posts since the sample is too small for any assurance.
I recently purchased a 2014 Forester after test driving the CRV and Rav 4. The Forester was quieter, more solid, and seemed more stable on the highway. Generally speaking, Subarus have a good reputation as being tough vehicles. And you are right, the visibility while driving is remarkable. There is a Subaru "cult" out there who wouldn't drive anything else, and after driving mine, I can see why, especially in bad weather.
There are also maintenance on Subarus that have to be performed more frequently than on Hondas or Toyotas, especially the front and rear differentials, spark plugs, and they tend to leak oil if the valve cover gaskets are not replaced more frequently than the other cars you mentioned. If you can live with that, they are great vehicles with unique all wheel drive systems.

 

[VNTS]

My friend works in a performance machine shop and they handle all the Subaru heads from all the local Subie dealers since most shops screw em up. He is always working on them says they Are junk, and still sees newer vintage even though people claim Subie has corrected their problems, so yes he loves Subies would never own one, note he does head work, crank rods and all the precision stuff for marine and local track guys.

 

[webfors]

I love my Forester. Hasn't caused me a lick of problems except for just recently. The release/throw-out bearing is squawking which requires a tranny drop to replace a $60 part. The consensus is that I should replace the clutch while I'm in there since half the battle is getting access. Local trusted subaru mechanic quote me $900 + tax (13% here) = $1017 for the full job.

Only other thing is a loose baffle in my exhaust that likes to whistle when I put the engine under load.

You won't have that tranny issue with the old 4EAT, and possibly the newer CVT's.

 

[05LGTLtd]

If foul weather driving is important, watch some of the comparison videos on line showing awd in action. Subaru and Audi have the best awd, IMHO. Subaru plus conti contact extremes equals unstoppable awd performance. I guess if you needed to deliver organs/blood over mountain passes in BC you might need dedicated snow tires, but chances are you won't.

My subaru legacy is 8 years old and I run an oversized turbo/injectors/custom tune. Some how I've managed not to blow a head gasket??? Of the seven subarus I've owned one had a bad head gasket. It was 98 forester I bought used and probably not cared for as it should have been before our purchase. Overall it was still a good car. We sold it with 170k I think. Still ran strong.

 

[John_K]

Quote:
odious, loathsome, rolling-rubber-room, NHTSA-designed malignancies currently polluting the new-car market.

John

 

[NHGUY]

If you buy the Subaru,unload it at around 90K miles.Bail out before the warped/cracked heads,and converter failures catch up to you.They can be bought cheap with around 120-140K miles on them.Wonder why...

 

[dparm]

If you liked the Integra, the CR-V will feel familiar -- it's the same platform (Civic/Integra/del Sol).

 

[rjundi]

Originally Posted By: NHGUY
If you buy the Subaru,unload it at around 90K miles.Bail out before the warped/cracked heads,and converter failures catch up to you.They can be bought cheap with around 120-140K miles on them.Wonder why...


Not my extended families experience with over 10 in the 20 years. One head gasket failure at 235,000 miles. My mom runs a "trouble zone" 2000 Forester with 180k miles no issues. Overblown. No one hit convertor failure either. Just odd nags like knock sensor, starter.

Personally I have a 2005 Legacy GT (turbo) which is different motor. I would not state reliable nor unreliable. Unlike most cars though an absolute hoot to drive with 250HP coupled to nice 5 speed and decent handling.

Mine hit no issues below 100k. 105k a throw out bearing in clutch that cost $450 to replace($50 part). 150k-165k(present) more stuff cropped up(starter,alternator, coil pack, seizing brake caliper).

 

[rjundi]

Originally Posted By: Donald
If you want a long lasting engine, get a diesel.


I have seen plenty of Honda, Ford truck gas, Dodge van, Toyota, Subaru, GMC engines run 300k for a lot less repairs than diesels out there in same period. That being said my experience with diesel is friends Ford truck, Chevy, VW and MB.

 

[doitmyself]

When I was shopping for vehicles this past winter, I could never figure out the real reliability of Subaru through internet investigation. Their fan base has somewhat of a cult following and there are tons of anecdotal stories of "the best vehicle I have ever owned".

But, there are the underlying engine issues over the years that keep rearing its ugly head.

I would (and did) investigate the current FB engine oil consumption allegations to determine if they are real or internet amplification.

Subaru changed the piston ring design this past year to address the issue. Here is a very recent (October 2013)updated TSB about piston ring replacement:

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B9hchBUnzJxDT0Nldy1qalh6M00/edit?usp=sharing&pli=1

Also, here is a link addressing the alleged problem at the Forester forum. Notice that some people are not having any oil consumption issues, thus my question regarding whether this is internet amplification.

Start on the last page 165 and work your way back: http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/...2/index165.html

 

[TTK]

Originally Posted By: doitmyself
When I was shopping for vehicles this past winter, I could never figure out the real reliability of Subaru through internet investigation. Their fan base has somewhat of a cult following and there are tons of anecdotal stories of "the best vehicle I have ever owned".

But, there are the underlying engine issues over the years that keep rearing its ugly head.

I would (and did) investigate the current FB engine oil consumption allegations to determine if they are real or internet amplification.

Subaru changed the piston ring design this past year to address the issue. Here is a very recent (October 2013)updated TSB about piston ring replacement:

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B9hchBUnzJxDT0Nldy1qalh6M00/edit?usp=sharing&pli=1

Also, here is a link addressing the alleged problem at the Forester forum. Notice that some people are not having any oil consumption issues, thus my question regarding whether this is internet amplification.

Start on the last page 165 and work your way back: http://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/...2/index165.html


I am a member of the subaruforester.org forum, and as with any forum, people with problems tend to post...people with no problems don't, but the statistics are just not there... just not enough people on forums to form a statistical base. There is also a thread on that forum for people with high mileage on their foresters. Subaru is increasing sales in the US at a remarkable rate and they are a good company that have a history of taking care of customers, within reason, of course. Go drive one, look it over and the engine layout at how well it is done.

 

[Chris142]

Subaru's are generally good cars. I would own one. The non Turbo ones are possibly the easiest late model cars made to work on. You can pull the engine in an hr.

 

[ram_man]

I would get the Honda if nothing else than for piece of mind. its a known good vehicle hands down. subi will always wondering when will my hg fail will it today tomorrow or maybe never.

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: ram_man
I would get the Honda if nothing else than for piece of mind. its a known good vehicle hands down. subi will always wondering when will my hg fail will it today tomorrow or maybe never.


You are kidding right? Nothing against Honda or anything, but we will never own another. My wife uses stronger wording than that. Just too many things break for my taste. Toyota isn't what it used to be either.

I wanted a small, sporty, AWD, non mini-ute. Subaru WRX Limited on order.

IMHO Subies are above average.

 

[sopususer]

Originally Posted By: VNTS
My friend works in a performance machine shop and they handle all the Subaru heads from all the local Subie dealers since most shops screw em up. He is always working on them says they Are junk, and still sees newer vintage even though people claim Subie has corrected their problems, so yes he loves Subies would never own one, note he does head work, crank rods and all the precision stuff for marine and local track guys.


The new Subaru FB engines have an entirely different cooling system from that of the EJ series.

Here's a pic of some of the various head gasket designs of the old EJ engines:

From this file Fuji Motors FB Engine Info

it says in regards to the new FB engines:

Cooling has been optimized by using separate engine cooling circuitry for the block and the head, resulting in improvements in fuel efficiency and output characteristics.

In the 2011+ FB engines the head was made a separate box (gray here) that capped the cooling passages of the cylinder block. The coolant no longer goes through the head gasket, so the head gasket no longer relies on thin weak rings to seal the cylinder tops.

I believe Subaru has finally addressed the head gasket problems.

As for the oil consumption I can say the wife's 2013 Legacy with the 2.5 FB motor has 20K on the clock and we haven't seen any consumption. Knock on wood.

We've owned six Subaru vehicles through the years. If I had to buy an new car tomorrow it would be a Subaru. There is a reason the Subaru diehards are diehards. For the money, no vehicle gives you as much as Subaru, imho.

 

[Rolla07]

Test drive one! Best AWD on the market and i think they are great vehicles. As with any vehicle, as a car gets older it will need repairs but they have been strong vehicles. I wouldnt hesitate to buy one. Head gasket issues were common years ago...but i know tons of ppl who had 170-180 k miles on them and no issue..cant go wrong with honda toyota or subie i dont think.

 

[Rolla07]

Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: ram_man
I would get the Honda if nothing else than for piece of mind. its a known good vehicle hands down. subi will always wondering when will my hg fail will it today tomorrow or maybe never.


You are kidding right? Nothing against Honda or anything, but we will never own another. My wife uses stronger wording than that. Just too many things break for my taste. Toyota isn't what it used to be either.

I wanted a small, sporty, AWD, non mini-ute. Subaru WRX Limited on order.

IMHO Subies are above average.


Definitely agree they are above average..but I disagree about your thoughts on Toyota. Friends have had horrible experiences with their 2011 civic..so i cant say much besides saying its common that these 3 MFR's usually have solid offerings.