Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB

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Would it really make much difference if a JASO MA oil is used instead of MB? Honda seems to be the only one that sells a 10w30 MB rated oil. It would seem to me that a MB rated oil would just be any SN oil for cars.
 
One could always "play it safe" by using Honda's oil while it is under warranty. Not like it takes a gallon for each change.

Once it is out of warranty, the will likely be more MB players in the market.
 
Run any 30 weight oil you want. Honestly.

And change the oil often. The more often the better. Does this scoot have an oil filter? If it doesn't (like my Honda scooters), I change my oil every 600 miles. How often you change the oil will have a far greater impact on your scooter than how what oil you use.

I own a Ruckus and a CH250. My Ruckus has 18k miles on it. I've done 35 or so oil changes on it. It only takes 0.7 quarts. So, just change it. Your motor will thank you.

My reasoning: The high revving scoot engines shear oil like CRAZY. It will be quickly out of grade. Second, with no oil filter, contaminates build up quickly. My engines run better than any scoot out there for their mileage.

Since you're in Hawaii....run any 10w30 you want (synthetic or concentional) or any HDEO oil: 5w40 or 15w40.
 
Mr phishin and I have had this discussion before.

While I agree with most of what he has said, I don't agree with the frequent OCI.

I have the original PCX 125cc (2011)

Honda SPECS 5000 miles for this. I don't dare go that far. I change every 2000 miles. Make sure your air filter is a good fit, and change it at the recommended intervals.

The screen "filter" basically stops break in metals from destroying the engine. I've cleaned it every oil change and only on the first initial 600 mile did I find anything in it.

As for the oil to use, this is a dry clutch engine, and no shared transmission/gears. Run any 10w30 you like as long as it meets or exceeds the rating grade, (SG?)

The oil change is about .95 quarts, So I buy 1 quart bottles and use all of it. I've ran everything, GTX, Mobil 1, Penz Ultra, Rotella, Amzoil and now I have Redline 10w30. None have changed the feel of the engine, none have given me better or worse fuel millage. None come out of the drain hole any different.

I'm fast approaching 10,000 miles on my scooter. Just do the valves at the 600, and again at the 2500. After that maintenance on these scooters is super easy.
 
its funny that the manual says do not used energy conserving oil, but says to use MB oil, witch is basically the same thing.
I was disappointed there was not oil filter on this engine
 
Originally Posted By: OriginalRocket
Just do the valves at the 600, and again at the 2500. After that maintenance on these scooters is super easy.


I never have had to adjust my valves. My engine doesn't wear.

To the OP....it's a quart of oil. If you feel like changing your oil every 500-800 miles is a waste, then drain it into a very clean container. I run my oil through a coffee filter, and then use it in other vehicles.

I run a 50/50 mix of M1 Racing 0w50 (about $20/quart) and M1 0w20AFE (about $5/quart). So, even though my Ruckus only uses 0.7 quart per OCI and there is no oil filter, I still have about $10 in an oil change. The ester-based M1 Ow50 mixed with AFE is a good top off oil for nearly any vehicle/engine. So, I use it in other stuff since it only has a few hundred miles on it.
 
Originally Posted By: OriginalRocket
Mr phishin and I have had this discussion before.

While I agree with most of what he has said, I don't agree with the frequent OCI.

I have the original PCX 125cc (2011)

Honda SPECS 5000 miles for this. I don't dare go that far. I change every 2000 miles. Make sure your air filter is a good fit, and change it at the recommended intervals.

The screen "filter" basically stops break in metals from destroying the engine. I've cleaned it every oil change and only on the first initial 600 mile did I find anything in it.

As for the oil to use, this is a dry clutch engine, and no shared transmission/gears. Run any 10w30 you like as long as it meets or exceeds the rating grade, (SG?)

The oil change is about .95 quarts, So I buy 1 quart bottles and use all of it. I've ran everything, GTX, Mobil 1, Penz Ultra, Rotella, Amzoil and now I have Redline 10w30. None have changed the feel of the engine, none have given me better or worse fuel millage. None come out of the drain hole any different.

I'm fast approaching 10,000 miles on my scooter. Just do the valves at the 600, and again at the 2500. After that maintenance on these scooters is super easy.

I plan on using a MA Synthetic Motorcycle oil and following the manufactures recommendation of 5,000 miles or 1 year (with my current commute that would be 2,500-3,500 miles)
I have Dimple Magnetic drain plug coming in to. bugs me that this engine has no true oil filter
 
Originally Posted By: Phishin
Originally Posted By: OriginalRocket
Just do the valves at the 600, and again at the 2500. After that maintenance on these scooters is super easy.


I never have had to adjust my valves. My engine doesn't wear.


Yeah. Valve adjustment intervals per Honda are crazy! I would not be surprised if the dealer charges to check them and never takes the valve covers off. I'm a Automotive dealer Tech, it's hard to trust other dealer techs with your vehicle. Never know if your going to get one of the techs that really cares about doing the job right or, the hack that only cares about making money.
 
Originally Posted By: jkhawaii
its funny that the manual says do not used energy conserving oil, but says to use MB oil, witch is basically the same thing.


It is funny because Energy Conserving is not additive... its an API test
that this "oil may result is an overall saving of fuel in the vehicle fleet as a whole"...

Technically speaking Energy Conserving tested oil can not defeat a wet
clutch in good working order... what is confusing the issue is the
fact that all motorcycle wet clutches will reach a point in their life
and start to slip... no one complains about clutch slip when the bike
is new... but on about the 27K to 57K range is when containments may
build up to point where the clutch begins to loose its grip... this is
usually discovered by the owner during WFO (Wide Fooking Open)throttle
like at a track day... in error one can blame the oil but its really
the contaminants on the clutch plates...

So the notion that we should stay away from EC oil is on shaky
ground... fact is I've been using 10/30 Energy Conserving Mobil 1
since 98 in Mr.RC45 with no clutch slipping due to oil being certified
10% freer flowing than non EC oil... and we're talking about Honda's
homologated racer with a tall first gear good for 90mph that's known
to incinerate clutch plates...
 
Originally Posted By: jkhawaii

Yeah. Valve adjustment intervals per Honda are crazy! I would not be surprised if the dealer charges to check them and never takes the valve covers off. I'm a Automotive dealer Tech, it's hard to trust other dealer techs with your vehicle. Never know if your going to get one of the techs that really cares about doing the job right or, the hack that only cares about making money.


First of all....please don't take your scooter into a Honda dealer and have your valves adjusted for no reason.

There are two reasons to have your valves adjusted:
1.) They are noisy (valve lash too loose...common on intake valve)
2.) Your scooter is hard to start (valve lash too tight....valves can't close all the way, you loose compression at start-up...common on the exhaust valve)

If your scooter fires right up and is really quiet....of course they are going to charge you $200 and NOT do a thing....it's the price you pay for not knowing anything about your bike.

Adjust the valves when you need to...not because a book told you so.
 
Originally Posted By: Phishin

2.) Your scooter is hard to start (valve lash too tight....valves can't close all the way, you loose compression at start-up...common on the exhaust valve)


depending on the motor...this is very incorrect information. usually it is the intake valves that are too tight. i reference the honda crf250, kawaski kxf250, suzuki rmz250 and yamaha yz250f (along with the 450 lines of these) as prime examples.
 
Originally Posted By: sunruh
Originally Posted By: Phishin

2.) Your scooter is hard to start (valve lash too tight....valves can't close all the way, you loose compression at start-up...common on the exhaust valve)


depending on the motor...this is very incorrect information. usually it is the intake valves that are too tight. i reference the honda crf250, kawaski kxf250, suzuki rmz250 and yamaha yz250f (along with the 450 lines of these) as prime examples.


You are correct sunruh....I switched them around by accident.

It's usually your intake valve that gets too tight and your exhaust can get loose. I didn't catch my mistake until you pointed it out. Thank you for the correction. I don't want to spread bad info.

Regardless, I wouldn't suggest you pay someone to adjust your valves until you have evidence that it's needed. And if you go 3k mile OCI's on this scoot using PCMO 30 weight oil...you'll probably need it done anyway.

Shorten your OCI up to 800 miles, use a 40 weight oil...any 0w40, 5w40, 10w40, or even 15w40 since your in Hawaii, and you shouldn't have to ever adjust those valves. Especially if you change the oil often when breaking the scooter in. During break in....I like to change the oil in my Honda scooters at 50, 200, and then 500 miles. Then do my typical 600 miles OCI from then on.
 
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Thanks for every one's input, and opinion's. I found that Bel-Ray, and Lucus make Jaso MB motorcycle oil's, in addition to Honda.
 
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Originally Posted By: jkhawaii
Thanks for every one's input, and opinion's. I found that Bel-Ray, and Lucus make Jaso MB motorcycle oil's, in addition to Honda.


Come on bro. Stay away from Bel-Ray and Lucas oils. They are overpriced and junk.

Forget the Jaso MB approval. You'd be better off running 10w40 Valvoline or Pennzoil conventional oils than Lucas and Barf-Ray (VWB and PYB are far superior to those other oils).

Why are you so concerned with the MB approval?
 
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Honda brand motorcycle oil with JASO MB rating...the one that comes to mind is the synthetic blend WITH MOLY; I'm guessing that Honda PCX probably uses a dry clutch design and they might spec for an MB oil to have extra wear preventing additives (MOLY) than a JASO MA or MA2 oil would have; just a thought...

if it were my scooter I would opt for a reasonably priced full synthetic like Super Tech, Quaker State Ultimate Durability, or Mobil Super full synthetic (unless your dealer/Honda Corp can prove to you that NOT using their oil will void the warranty)

my personal scooter calls for 15w-40 or a 'quality motorycle oil'; oil change intervals are 2000 miles with filter replacement every 4000 miles; I also have magnetic crain plugs installed; I want to use a full synthetic since I have to keep it in the upper half of the power band alot, but didn't want to pay $11-13 per quart of motorycle specific oil...I settled on Amsoil 10w-40 synthetic scooter oil that costs me $8.17/qt at my Genuine Scooter dealer;

my point is to choose something better than conventional automobile oil, but why pay top dollar for oil that you're not gonna use to its full potential; choose a good synthetic 10w-30 that won't break the bank...heck, you can get Mobil 1 or Castrol Syntec or Pennzoil Platinum at Walmart for $6.79/qt if you wanted 'top tier' oil
 
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Originally Posted By: kmrcstintn

my personal scooter calls for 15w-40 or a 'quality motorycle oil'; oil change intervals are 2000 miles with filter replacement every 4000 miles; I also have magnetic crain plugs installed; I want to use a full synthetic since I have to keep it in the upper half of the power band alot, but didn't want to pay $11-13 per quart of motorycle specific oil.


I'd listen to this advice (except the longer OCI's...) Get a drain plug. Forget the MB certification.

EVERY scooter run on the high side of their RPM range. That's their design. This is why they shear oil so bad.

If you want to come on here and ask for advice, I doubt anyone has more scooter oil experience on here than I do. Maybe a one or two. Maybe.

I have a ton of miles on my HONDA scooters. A ton. I've never ever had a single problem or have ever had to made any valve adjustment on my scooters either.

If you don't want to run an ester-based oil in your scooter, like M1 Racing, Redline, Torco or Motul....that's fine. It will run just fine on any 40 weight oil. 40 weight oils typically have higher amounts of zinc and moly (Anti-wear agents) since they don't have to adhere to the newer oil regulations.

Maybe you can find Valvoline Synthetic VR1 synthetic. I'd suggest you mix a 50/50 ratio their 10w30 and their 20w50 for your scooter.

Lots of options. Stay in the 40 weight area though. Heck, even running Rotella (either conventional or synthetic) is better than Bel Ray, Lucas, or that Honda oil.
 
Got one of those Dimple magnetic drain plugs coming in. 10w30 AMSOIL motorcycle oil is what is going in, JASO MA.
 
Originally Posted By: jkhawaii
Got one of those Dimple magnetic drain plugs coming in. 10w30 AMSOIL motorcycle oil is what is going in, JASO MA.


I tested 10W30 Amsoil motorcycle specific oil in Mr.RC45 and it did no
better or no worst that 0 30 Mobil 1... not surprising since Amsoil
explains in a video how oil viscosity are tested and that Mobil 0W30
is good enough for Amsoil to buy for their base stock... Amsoil
believes that Mobil 0W30 is a premium PAO... so if your wallet can
handle the extra cost of Amsoil no problem but if you wish to cut cost
and still protect your prize then try 0 30 Mobil 1...
 
Originally Posted By: BusyLittleShop
Originally Posted By: jkhawaii
Got one of those Dimple magnetic drain plugs coming in. 10w30 AMSOIL motorcycle oil is what is going in, JASO MA.


I tested 10W30 Amsoil motorcycle specific oil in Mr.RC45 and it did no
better or no worst that 0 30 Mobil 1... not surprising since Amsoil
explains in a video how oil viscosity are tested and that Mobil 0W30
is good enough for Amsoil to buy for their base stock... Amsoil
believes that Mobil 0W30 is a premium PAO... so if your wallet can
handle the extra cost of Amsoil no problem but if you wish to cut cost
and still protect your prize then try 0 30 Mobil 1...


No Mobil offering is pao anymore. They use their house blended VISOM basestock.
And what 0w-30 are you using. The racing stuff without detergents or the AFE.
Either way they are both visom. If you want a high concentration of pao try co op DMO or redline. Royal purple is still using alot of it in their hps and xrp line.
You sir should really research before posting. Amsoil gets their basestocks from a few different suppliers,not just mobilexxon.
And can visom formulation is better than a pao oil anyways.
You sir should spend some time reading

And what exactly was the protocol for your testing. I know for a fact that Amsoil 10w-30 is shearproof in the uoa I've seen,and all were in extremely high horsepower applications in track mustangs and lt-1 and ls-1 powered bow ties.
A 0w-30 is certainly more prone to shear. It has to be because of the viscosity improvers.
So do tell what exactly was your criteria in testing these 2 oils against each other.
 
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Originally Posted By: Clevy
And what 0w-30 are you using. The racing stuff without detergents or the AFE.
Either way they are both visom.


I don't think so Clevy. With all due respect, I'm willing to bet that the M1 Racing 0w30 and their 0w50 are both ester-based. Heck, just by looking at the price of M1 Racing oil...it better have an ester-base stock. LOL!! I'm better it's closer to Torco, Redline, or Motul 300V oil than it is anything else.
 
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