Liqui Moly vs Pentosin

[Finklejag]

Okay boys. My 2010 GTI is close to 30,000 miles. I had my Intake replaced under warranty for a faulty Intake Sensor. I asked the mechanic performing the job to tell me how the intake valves look. He showed me the old intake and told me the valves looked pretty good. I know the FSI has way more problems then the TSI. I want to switch to the low SAPS oil. I will be doing 5K OCI's. I shouldn't have to worry about TBN depletion.

I have a VAG tuning shop 2 blocks from me. I bought Pentospeed 0W-30 from them in the past. They stock all the Ligui Moly and Pentosin oils. A lot of the Liqui Moly oils only meet older specs such as BMW LL-98 and MB 229.3. It seems the Low SAPS oils meet the higher more stricter specs these days.

Liqui Moly Top Tec 4200

Top Tec 4200

Pentoin Super Performace III

Super Performance III

The Top Tec has a slightly higher VI, and a better pour point. Both are pretty much equal though. I would assume both are group III oils?

This shop still has Pentospeed 0W-30. I can't even find it on the Pentosin website? Do they even make it anymore? Maybe it's old stock?

 

[skyship]

Originally Posted By: Finklejag
Okay boys. My 2010 GTI is close to 30,000 miles. I had my Intake replaced under warranty for a faulty Intake Sensor. I asked the mechanic performing the job to tell me how the intake valves look. He showed me the old intake and told me the valves looked pretty good. I know the FSI has way more problems then the TSI. I want to switch to the low SAPS oil. I will be doing 5K OCI's. I shouldn't have to worry about TBN depletion.

I have a VAG tuning shop 2 blocks from me. I bought Pentospeed 0W-30 from them in the past. They stock all the Ligui Moly and Pentosin oils. A lot of the Liqui Moly oils only meet older specs such as BMW LL-98 and MB 229.3. It seems the Low SAPS oils meet the higher more stricter specs these days.

Liqui Moly Top Tec 4200

Top Tec 4200

Pentoin Super Performace III

Super Performance III

The Top Tec has a slightly higher VI, and a better pour point. Both are pretty much equal though. I would assume both are group III oils?

This shop still has Pentospeed 0W-30. I can't even find it on the Pentosin website? Do they even make it anymore? Maybe it's old stock?


The big question is do you want to spend more money on oil?? Top Tec is good but LM make better G4 oil like Synthoil High Tech 5/40, which I use in my 1.9TDI (There is a VOA and 2 UOA's in this forum from me). If you drive the car hard LM also do a good Race Synthoil 10/60, but I would check with a VW forum about that one, as it might have reduced flow cooling effects etc.

Which exact engine do you have?
LM US web site oil finder:
Engine CCZB (Could be the wrong engine)
Capacity : Capacity 4,7 liter

· Use : Normal
· Intervals : Change 15000 km / 12 months
: Top Tec 4100 5W-40
: Leichtlauf High Tech 5W-40
: Synthoil High Tech 5W-40
: Synthoil Energy 0W-40

· Use : Extended drain (max)
· Intervals : Change 30000 km / 24 months
· Products : Top Tec 4200 5W-30

If you don't like the look of the LM oils, or a good one is not available then try Castrol or Mobil as they have similar oils. If you are not using a real VW oil filter I would be careful with the longer OCI figure. 10K miles is a better figure unless you get stuck in traffic a lot.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: skyship
If you are not using a real VW oil filter I would be careful with the longer OCI figure.


I'm sure Finklejag knows better. Mann and other OEM filters can be had ridiculously cheap in North America if one has the right source.

 

[Finklejag]

High Tech 5W-40 might be Group IV, but it only meets BMW LL-98 and MB 229.3. What I have read. The hardest specs to meet are Porsche C30 and MB 229.51.

I have tons of 5W-40 oils to choose from in the US. The last time I ran a 30 weight oil in my engine. The engine felt peppier. All the low SAPS oils are 30 weights.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: Finklejag
High Tech 5W-40 might be Group IV, but it only meets BMW LL-98 and MB 229.3. What I have read. The hardest specs to meet are Porsche C30 and MB 229.51.

I have tons of 5W-40 oils to choose from in the US. The last time I ran a 30 weight oil in my engine. The engine felt peppier. All the low SAPS oils are 30 weights.

Idk man. I use GC 0W30 in my CC with that engine.
Thing is gas. The U.S. gas is old fashioned gas with lot's of sulfur. Many European countries also have dirty gas such as the U.S, mostly in Eastern Europe. All oil manufacturers are pushing for High SAPS oils there or Mid-SAPS oils.
Since I moved to CA recently, I am considering to move to Mid-SAPS oil such as Motul X-Clean 5W40 or Pentosin 5W40 considering cleaner CA gas.
Although, you are in Portland, which means mild temperatures, so yes I would def go with 30 weight.

 

[fauxchemist]

Unless you drive your car hard and by hard I dont mean a little sprited driving know and then. Using such good oils makes no sense. I use the same oil as SKYSHIP but then again im also doing 15,000-20,000OCI. You claim 5K oci. Either your wasting money or hopefully tracking the car.

 

[bigjl]

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: Finklejag
High Tech 5W-40 might be Group IV, but it only meets BMW LL-98 and MB 229.3. What I have read. The hardest specs to meet are Porsche C30 and MB 229.51.

I have tons of 5W-40 oils to choose from in the US. The last time I ran a 30 weight oil in my engine. The engine felt peppier. All the low SAPS oils are 30 weights.

Idk man. I use GC 0W30 in my CC with that engine.
Thing is gas. The U.S. gas is old fashioned gas with lot's of sulfur. Many European countries also have dirty gas such as the U.S, mostly in Eastern Europe. All oil manufacturers are pushing for High SAPS oils there or Mid-SAPS oils.
Since I moved to CA recently, I am considering to move to Mid-SAPS oil such as Motul X-Clean 5W40 or Pentosin 5W40 considering cleaner CA gas.
Although, you are in Portland, which means mild temperatures, so yes I would def go with 30 weight.


Not sure but I think you will find that ultra low sulphur fuels are sold in every Western European country and Eastern European countries joining the EU I suspect will be changing over to ultra low sulphur fuels fairly soon after joining the EU as it is the EU that dictates these things.

I have noticed that the low saps 5w30 oils are normally specced for the extended drain service schedule (30k km) and the normal interval (15k km) is 5w40 with normal saps.

On the few I have checked the TBN is lower in the low saps oil, I assume the low saps oil stays in grade longer.

I would have thought low saps would be better for a direct injected petrol engine?

Anybody confirm that?

I have been driving diesel for a long time now. Even when I had my Subarus I usually had a little diesel car for running about and putting miles on.

I would probably run the 5w30 low saps but change at around the 10/12 k mile mark.

As the OE filter should be good for 30k km you could even consider leaving it on for two OCI's.

Have done this before when changing at half or less than half of the manufcturers OCI.

 

[edyvw]

Yeah I agree about fuel. I said some countries, and in Eastern Europe you have bunch of them, including Romania and Bulgaria that are barely meeting EU standards. I do not count Czech Republic, Poland, Hungary, SLovenia, Croatia, Bosnia in that, they are pretty good when it comes to fuel quality.
Idk about grade, I had both oils put in dealership for 15k and for 30k, I would say it more depends on the oil producer.

 

[Finklejag]

Originally Posted By: bigjl



I would have thought low saps would be better for a direct injected petrol engine?

Anybody confirm that?





Lubrizol did a study about low SAPS oil and direct injection.

Luroizol

If you use a low SAPS oil in a gas engine in the US. The TBN will be wiped out way before the 10,000 mile OCI that VW calls for. We have to much sulfur in our gas. That's why I plan to do 5,000 oci's.

 

[slo town]

Originally Posted By: Finklejag
Originally Posted By: bigjl



I would have thought low saps would be better for a direct injected petrol engine?

Anybody confirm that?





Lubrizol did a study about low SAPS oil and direct injection.

Luroizol

If you use a low SAPS oil in a gas engine in the US. The TBN will be wiped out way before the 10,000 mile OCI that VW calls for. We have to much sulfur in our gas. That's why I plan to do 5,000 oci's.


Not in California. As of early 2006 California gas has been low sulphur gas, unlike the other 49 states. Proof in following link.

http://www.arb.ca.gov/enf/fuels/phase3dates.pdf

Scott

 

[fauxchemist]

Originally Posted By: fauxchemist
Unless you drive your car hard and by hard I dont mean a little sprited driving know and then. Using such good oils makes no sense. I use the same oil as SKYSHIP but then again im also doing 15,000-20,000OCI. You claim 5K oci. Either your wasting money or hopefully tracking the car.

 

[skyship]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: skyship
If you are not using a real VW oil filter I would be careful with the longer OCI figure.


I'm sure Finklejag knows better. Mann and other OEM filters can be had ridiculously cheap in North America if one has the right source.


I don't know who makes VW filters but if you don't buy one from a VW dealer, then I would stick to a filter made in Germany like Mann (If it says made in Germany) or Bosch.
Figuring out which company makes a particular cars filter does not help much, as they are made to VW specs.
If you extend the OCI beyond the VW filters limits, then I think Mobil makes some real good EP filters.