Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: bigjl
Millers do indeed procure "Nano" oils for racing.
Big dosh but can be found on Opieoils.
With any new technology somebody has to either go first or be the first to take it main stream.
The oil meets lots of stringent Acea specs so can't be bad.
I wouldn't think a company with the reputation of Millers Oils would be trying to sell snake oil.
There are some very good oil firms that have little presence in the US.
In the same way as some US companies have little presence in the UK and Europe.
Comma and Morris oils are two off the top of my head.
There IS one distributor stateside who will be carrying Millers oils (and their Nanodrive racing) in the spring.
My question was NOT where/how to get it, but whether or not they use this IF WS2 as their primary, nano sized, AW agent.
We may NEVER know without a FULL VOA, and gas chromatography performed on it, as I'm SURE that they will plead the old, tired, tried and true, "propriatary info" if asked.
A few points. I'm with the US distributor of Millers. Have been meaning to get on there and seek out threads about Millers, but have been pretty slammed with several things.
First thing I want to address is Millers, itself. You are indeed correct about the company. Millers is about 130 years old, having started out making industrial lubricants. It has resisted the consolidation that the industry has seen over the years, and to this day remains in control of the Millers family. bigjl obviously gets that, but I know that Millers is unknown to the majority of folks here. I could keep going on about this, but I'd point to the recent technical development partnership Millers and Bryan Herta Autosports (Barracuda Racing) have formed. Not a sponsorship, MIllers is developing some proprietary oils for their IndyCar efforts, and will be supplying their lower tier teams, as well. But no, not snake oil.
On to the oil, itself. The NT content and additives are proprietary. I apologize that we can't make this info public, but given the performance capabilities, it is indeed a valuable technology. The gear oils have been out since 2008, and the motorsports users in places like WRC and BTCC are seeing 3-4 times the life out of it. The F1 team that has been working with Millers for the past couple of years has seen the wear after a 5 Grand Prix simulation on a dyno fall off drastically (they were slated to bring it in this year, but due to the tight points race, waited, and should be using it next year). There are efficiencies gained, as well. So teams are seeing gearbox oil temperatures in closed systems drop 20-25 degrees F.
Second point is that the engine oils took years to develop. The same technology won a pretty prestigous award in 2009. It has been nominated for the 2012 award which will be presented next month at teh World Motorsport Symposium in the UK. Point with that is that it took years to develop the oil, even though Millers had a very strong fully synthetic racing engine oil with which to start. I know most folks here are smart enough than to think that they could just get this stuff and add it in, but to end up with a truly optimized blend takes a long time, with a lot of resources. And again, the base oil is very robust, so that is more than half of the story.
The NT additives serve very, very well as an EP additive, which is why Millers set out to develop the gear oils first. The main benefit seen in engine oils is in boundary lubrication, so primarily near TDC and BDC on the cylinders. Valvetrain, as well. But its mechanisms are more similar to an EP additive than to ZDDP (note that the racing oil still contains high levels of ZDDP, too high to meet SN ratings - the NT did enable Millers to reduce it by about 10%, but it is still about 1100ppm).
We actually currently have the motorsports stuff in stock. Have had it for several months. We are setting up some dealer networks, and are starting to see more and more interest. We hvae recieved very good feedback, particularly with the gear oil. Yes, the motorsports stuff is very expensive, but it is not out of line with other high end motorsports oils. Most is $20/L, just like Motul 300V or Joe Gibbs XP#. The 0W20 and 0W30 are $22.50/L. But the important thing to note here is that it isn't the NT additives that drive up the cost, it is the good, high quality base stock (again, just like some of the better racing oils out there). While the road oils will command a premium when they come out, they won't be priced at the same kind of levels as the Motorsports stuff. The current longlife road oils are priced pretty close to Motul 8100.
Will try to start watching stuff here and answer questions as they arise. Feel free to shoot me an e-mail at
[email protected] if you would like to know some stuff. I can post some more info on the oils, but I don't want to come across as advertising it.