WIX Filter Failure

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You can believe what you want ... but my belief is this was a real failure due to a large overpressure situation caused by the oil pump's pressure regulator failing, and the fact that the filter just couldn't take the pressure for whatever reason. Done presenting the tidbits of evidence that are there. There is way more evidence that this is real vs. a hoax ... which frankly I saw no evidence of. It will be interesting if this guy posts again on YouTube with the same problem, because it's an engine issue, not a filter issue. Any filter put under the same over pressure condition probably would have failed in a similar manner. Over and out.
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Oil filter cans have blown out before the gasket. But the fact he claims oil went every where isn't really proof positive he had excessive oil pressure since it requires trusting what this guy says. Your argument is that a blown and leaking oil filter seal will protect the filter can but a filter bypass won't protect a center tube from pressure differential doesn't really add up IMO. If you had 300 psi oil pressure outside the oil filter element, the filter bypass is going to provided for ~290 psi inside the filter element, so no excessive presure differential and no crushed element.


Go read the TSBs I posted links to above. If a filter's bypass valve always protected the filter from extreme inlet pressure and very high pressure differentials as a result, then there would never be a case of a blown up filter or a filter with a crushed center tube or crushed element. This obviously happens in the real world, otherwise there wouldn't be technical information about it. Go disable your oil pump's pressure regulator and see what happens.


I never said the oil filter bypass can never fail. What I said was that a working bypass would most likely still protect against excess pressure differential. You are expecting me to believe that this guy's oil pump relief valve failed AND that the filter bypass failed to prevent excessive pressure differential. Why don't you disable your oil pump's pressure relief valve and see if the filter bypass allows the center tube to crush like you say?
 
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I never said the oil filter bypass can never fail. What I said was that a working bypass would most likely still protect against excess pressure differential.


Gotta disagree with that. A filter's bypass valve is not designed to save the filter under an extreme over pressure situation due to a failed oil pump pressure regulator.

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Why don't you disable your oil pump's pressure relief valve and see if the filter bypass allows the center tube to crush like you say?


I KNOW what would happen ... so I'll let you do it since you think everything will be AOK.
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
You can believe what you want ... but my belief is this was a real failure due to a large overpressure situation caused by the oil pump's pressure regulator failing, and the fact that the filter just couldn't take the pressure for whatever reason. Done presenting the tidbits of evidence that are there. There is way more evidence that this is real vs. a hoax ... which frankly I saw no evidence of. It will be interesting if this guy posts again on YouTube with the same problem, because it's an engine issue, not a filter issue. Any filter put under the same over pressure condition probably would have failed in a similar manner. Over and out.
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OK fine. You believe the evidence that this oil filter failure is legitimate and strong and I believe it is weak and inconclusive. there is evidence of it being a hoax if a person will accept it.
 
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
... there is evidence of it being a hoax if a person will accept it.


There is no evidence that I saw that proves it's a hoax ... nothing at all. No can cuts in the first video - yet the guts are crushed and rattling like mad. No evidence of someone bashing in the guts with a rod through the base holes - no marks on the element that would have been left with such force. Where's the visual evidence it's a hoax?
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Why don't you disable your oil pump's pressure relief valve and see if the filter bypass allows the center tube to crush like you say?


I KNOW what would happen ... so I'll let you do it since you think everything will be AOK.
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Another straw man. I never said everything will be OK. The filter gasket will likely blow and maybe even the filter can along with other seals and maybe even pump failure, but that doesn't mean the filter center tube will necesarily collapse and vertically. My filter bypass is on the engine on most of my vehicles so even if the tube does collapse it won;t be the filter's fault
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
... there is evidence of it being a hoax if a person will accept it.


There is no evidence that I saw that proves it's a hoax ... nothing at all. No can cuts in the first video - yet the guts are crushed and rattling like mad. No evidence of someone bashing in the guts with a rod through the base holes - no marks on the element that would have been left with such force. Where's the visual evidence it's a hoax?
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But there is signs of a cut at 1:35 and at 2:20, but you deny it and insist that video 1 and 2 must be the same can showing the exact same sections. and why would there be marks on the element if a rod pushed down the end cap?
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Originally Posted By: mechanicx
But there is signs of a cut at 1:35 and at 2:20, but you deny it and insist that video 1 and 2 must be the same can showing the exact same sections. and why would there be marks on the element if a rod pushed down the end cap?
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Are you just trolling now ... really? It's all been discussed already. There was no cut in the filter in the first video ... the evidence between 1:24 and 1:35 is clear. Guts were crushed and rattling around, with no cut in the filter. Paint chips matching in both videos proves it's the same exact filter. If that's not evidence, then I don't know what is. You don't have to believe the facts ... but let's just stop beating a dead horse now ... it's all been said already.
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Oh yeah, the info in all those TSBs is made up and a hoax.
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Go search YouTube for collapsed filters ... there are a lot of videos out there ... all hoaxed apparently.
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
But there is signs of a cut at 1:35 and at 2:20, but you deny it and insist that video 1 and 2 must be the same can showing the exact same sections. and why would there be marks on the element if a rod pushed down the end cap?
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Are you just trolling now ... really? It's all been discussed already. There was no cut in the filter in the first video ... the evidence between 1:24 and 1:35 is clear. Guts were crushed and rattling around, with no cut in the filter. Paint chips matching in both videos proves it's the same exact filter. If that's not evidence, then I don't know what is. You don't have to believe the facts ... but let's just stop beating a dead horse now. It's all been said already.
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You say "no cuts" in the first video, "paint chips match", "both videos are the exact same filter" as if that's indisputable but I don't agree. You are quilty as anyone of believing and seeing what you want to see and ignoring everything else. The only trolling here is when you create straw man arguments. So I see it as you beating the dead horse as much as anyone
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OK, yeah ... whatever. You don't even have a staw man
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We are well into time wasting mode now. Believe what you want ... I'm done wasting time here.
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
OK, yeah ... whatever. You don't even have a staw man
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We are well into time wasting mode now. Believe what you want ... I'm done wasting time here.
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You're right I haven't made any strawmen. I've been getting plenty from you
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. I could just copy and paste yours but why bother. You don't seem to take graciously anyone not agreeing with your opinions and assumptions that you only think are indisputable.
 
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
OK, yeah ... whatever. You don't even have a staw man
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We are well into time wasting mode now. Believe what you want ... I'm done wasting time here.
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You're right I haven't made any strawmen. I've been getting plenty from you
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. I could just copy and paste yours but why bother. You don't seem to take graciously anyone not agreeing with your opinions and assumptions that you only think are indisputable.


The evidence I posted up clearly trumps your weak arguments. You really don't have anything to present except the non-evidential shot at 2:20 which is obviously a weak attempt of trying to convince anyone with better than 20-40 vision that there's a cut in the filter, and the guy must have stomped the removed element with his feet and put it back in the can just to make WIX filters look bad.
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Show me the evidence that it was all a hoax. I've shown pretty hard evidence from the two videos that the can was not cut and the guts were crushed and rattling around - and that the filters in both videos were the same one. You have absolutely nothing .. and that's why you are now just tolling and trying to argue for the sake of arguing. You have zero evidence to even back up your arguments ... so what's that, an invisible man argument?
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I forgot to comment on this.
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
But there is signs of a cut at 1:35 and at 2:20 ...


There are obviously no signs of the can being cut at 1:24, yet it magically gets cut between 1:24 and 1:35 while he's handling it and shaking it around? OK ... I believe that.
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This is just your opinion delivered annoyingly. What you claim is indisputable evidence isn't really conclusive. I see what could be a cut line in the seam at 1:24 and also at 2:20. I have 20/15 vision, so it not's because I need glasses.

It doesn't matter if the filter being cut open is certain or not in the first video. The filter just doesn't look right throughout the first video. He could've smashed the filter element with a rod through the inlet holes. I don't believe this guy story for other reasons that have been given. At this point we are just going in circles.
 
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
This is just your opinion delivered annoyingly. What you claim is indisputable evidence isn't really conclusive. I see what could be a cut line in the seam at 1:24 and also at 2:20. I have 20/15 vision, so it not's because I need glasses.


You must have a pretty vivid imagination and your eyes must see what your mind wants them to see, because there is zero evidence of the can being cut at 1:24. The zoomed in snap-shot I posted shows zero evidence of any kind of cut. The cut in the second video is wide and jagged, and missing paint on the cut edges. If it was cut at 1:24 (or even at 2:20) it would stick out like a sore thumb.

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
It doesn't matter if the filter being cut open is certain or not in the first video. The filter just doesn't look right throughout the first video. He could've smashed the filter element with a rod through the inlet holes. I don't believe this guy story for other reasons that have been given. At this point we are just going in circles.


The filter "just doesn't look right"? It looks fine except for the imploded guts and that they rattle around inside the can.

I think it does matter to know if the filter is cut open or not in the first video. Since it is not cut open, and the guts are crumpled and rattling around, then he certainly couldn't have removed the element to smash it with his foot. The theory that he put a rod down the base inlet holes and smashed it up doesn't really hold any water, because if that was done the metal end cap and ADBV would show evidence of such action - but it doesn't show any evidence of high impacts from the end of a rod. Straw grasping theory IMO.

Yes, we are certainly going in circles. I'm surprised nobody else has chimed in one way or the other on this lately. Surely the snap-shots of the video aren't that controversy - or is everyone blind?
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This guy jaymay http://www.youtube.com/user/jaymay023#g/u who posted the videos posted the two videos 3 months apart. He has over 60 videos many of them about using epoxy and silicone to make "Iron man" motorcycle helmets. The first video's filter looks tampered with. He appears to be a hack and I don't believe him or his story.
 
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
This guy jaymay http://www.youtube.com/user/jaymay023#g/u who posted the videos posted the two videos 3 months apart.


So? ... who says he had to post them a few days apart to be believable? It's the same filter in both videos. The paint chip pattern on the edge of the base shows that's the case (as I proved with snap-shots). Maybe his motor blew and is now out of the car and he just got around to putting up the video.

If you have a YouTube account why don't you go on there and challenge him about it being a complete hoax and get down the the bottom of it?

The filter in the first video looked "tampered with"? How so? Nothing looks tampered with to me.
 
mechanicx - here's a little test for you to conduct. Next time you take an oil filter off, put a rod down the base plate holes and smash the snot out of the element and then show us all that there was no evidence on the ADBV and element end cap of such an action being done.

Heck, maybe I'll do it ... sounds fun. But I'm sure if I posted up photos of the ADBV all chewed up and the end cap all deformed from blunt force trauma from the end of the rod that it would just be concluded it was all a hoax.
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Well first off I believe the filter's been cut and can see evidence of a cut line which you deny. But if it's possible to smash the center tube through the baseplate holes on the WIX, you place the requirement that the second video is the same element. I don't necessarily believe it is same element or can. All we know is the element is smashed in the first video, but we don't see the nature of the damage. There could be damage to the end caps and ADBV that aren't seen, and the second video is a different element.

Also if you were to attempted to crush the center tube of an intact filter I doubt you'll go out of your way to do so without damaging damaging the end caps or ADBV
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You're the perfect conspiracy theory model and representative. I have a feeling that if you were standing right there next to the dude videoing the filter, you'd say he somehow froze time and messed with the filter while you were in time suspension.
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It's really not hard to clearly see there is no cut in the filter and the guts are all messed up and rattling around in the first video. All shown between 1:24 and 1:35 ... a mere 9 seconds of time. And clearly no evidence of rod smashing trauma to the ADBV and end cap in the second video. The end caps are not very thick metal, and a rod with even a little force behind it will deform the end cap or the rod will just poke a hole right through the metal. No such evidence in the second video.

I think I will do this rod smashing experiment, just for gags. I know what the result will be ... a smashed up end cap that looks like some guy beat the snot out of it with a rod and hammer.
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Well if being skeptical here makes me a conspiracy theorist, then you must be a "tin-foil" hat wearer believing every filter failure story that comes down the pike
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And clearly no evidence of rod smashing trauma to the ADBV and end cap in the second video. The end caps are not very thick metal, and a rod with even a little force behind it will deform the end cap or the rod will just poke a hole right through the metal. No such evidence in the second video.



Because you allow for no possibility of the 2nd video posted 3 months later to be a different element that was smashed, or a different can, right
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