0W30 vs 5W30 vs 10W30

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Originally Posted By: mrcoolguy
No, its a 99 Camaro SS that has plenty of miles! I just want a good oil for my car, which is why I am considering using GC.


GC 0w30 is an excellent oil for the LS1 engine! I ran GC in my Corvette for a few years with really good oil analysis results. I've also had great results with Pennzoil Platinum 5w30 and am currently using Ultra 5w30 and have great results with it as well. So from my experience with my LS1 engine, I would recommend any of these three oils.
 
I want an oil with group 4 and group 5 base stock so its between Mobil 0W40 and GC 0W30. Since these oils are pretty easily accessible! Any differences?
 
Originally Posted By: mrcoolguy
I want an oil with group 4 and group 5 base stock so its between Mobil 0W40 and GC 0W30. Since these oils are pretty easily accessible! Any differences?


Well you can look up the spec sheets if you're concerned about the densities and such. You could run oil pressure and temp gauges and see how they compare depending on how "hard" you run this thing...

Both are great and would work very well. Two of my favorites which I run in my Passat. My experiences say M1 would be a tad cheaper to get, but I've heard in multiple places that LS1 engines take a liking to GC.

But what do I know, I just pick the bottle that looks the prettiest.
 
Originally Posted By: The Critic
GM obviously knew that 0w30 will be synthetic, yet they chose to not allow it for all temps. Plus 0w30 would have given a fuel efficiency advantage as well.

Clearly there is a concern with the amount of VII in the oil, which will likely lead to more shearing and deposit build-up than a comparable 5W30.


I don't think it's as simple as that. Most manufacturers tend to specify only one grade of oil for their North American versions of the car. We don't see a lot of "xxw-xx is suitable above/below XX degrees F" anymore. Even when the manufacturers commonly had viscosity/temperature charts, there were some rather weird recommendations. We frequently saw 10w-40 treated as the red headed stepchild, probably for the VII issues you mentioned, which were more of an issue in the day. I know my old F-150, and even the Audi, had a couple strange recommendations; I can't quote them offhand, since the manuals aren't in front of me right now.

If the manufacturers specify one grade, barring any proprietary specifications or the occasional Japanese switch to 0w-20, they tend to specify something that can be had readily, and had readily in conventional, since some will balk at synthetic prices and make their own (probably worse) choice anyhow.

5w-30 fits the bill for GM, and 5w-20 does for Ford. I haven't seen Ford manuals from the past few years recommend 0w-20, either. Potential warranty issues aside (and that's another debate altogether), there should be no problem with a 0w-20 substituting for a 5w-20 or a 0w-30 substituting for a 5w-30 or 10w-30.

With the dexos1 specification, GM has chosen to go with the 5w-30 viscosity. There may be several reasons, including technical ones such as what you pointed out. Part of it, undoubtedly, is the path of least resistance for the consumers. Walmart and oil change places are quite likely to have M1, PP, and QSUD in 5w-30 with dexos1 approval. If dexos1 was a 0w-30 specification, I would expect more confusion. People would be using GC. People would be grumbling they couldn't find 0w-30. People would use 5w-30 anyway, and then probably just conventional, if this hypothetical dexos1 0w-30 was simply too hard to find and people didn't understand it would be at least semi-synthetic.

Perhaps down the road dexos1 will be expanded to include 0w-30 oils. I guess we'll have to see.

To the OP, there are 5w-30s that are thicker at operating temperatures than some 10w-30s, and 0w-30s that are thicker at operating temperatures than some 5w-30s and 10w-30s. Petro-Canada and Esso-Mobil are littered with examples. Anyone who tells you that 0w-30 is too thin for an engine that specifies a 30 weight is absolutely clueless, and would be the last person I'd listen to with respect to oil choices.

If your engine is specified for 5w-30 year round, use it year round with confidence. A 10w-30 isn't going to help you in summer; heck, it may be thinner than the 5w-30 of the same brand. The only beef I have with 0w-30 oils is the price of synthetics with respect to my oil change interval.

Even my ridiculously old school dad would have shaken his head at me for putting a 10w-30 in an engine specified for 5w-30. He was regularly scolding me with the phrase "too thick" long before this site came into being.
 
Originally Posted By: mrcoolguy
I want an oil with group 4 and group 5 base stock so its between Mobil 0W40 and GC 0W30. Since these oils are pretty easily accessible! Any differences?


I'm not sure that basestocks really matter, since PP and PU, both of which use Grp III basestocks, hold up really well in actual use.
Still, between GC and M1 0W-40, the M1 is a more modern formulation, and has been progressively improved.
GC is an older formulation that will still deliver good results.
OTOH, one of the great advantages of this forum is that you can take advantage of others experience.
Patman has posted above that he had very good results with GC, PP and PU in an engine very similar to the one in your Camaro.
Another thought is that any search for the magic oil should be informed with a few UOAs. You can search that forum and find UOAs using various oils in engines similar to the one you have.
That will give you a feel for what works and what doesn't.
You can also do a few UOAs, to establish a baseline and then to see what changes with various oils.
Finally, under typical SoCal conditions year 'round, I doubt you'd see much difference in startup viscosity between the three grades you've mentioned in your opening post.
You could gather the data from product data sheets and run those points through a viscosity calculator, but I don't think it matters at the temperatures you see in your neck of the woods.
Viscosity is always a child of temperature, and the 0W part only comes into play at temperatures lower than what you'll see.
0W means only that the oil has that viscosity range at the temperature specified in the test protocol, and viscosity change is not linear as temperature changes.
If you lived where I do, it might matter, and if you lived in North Dakota, it would matter.
 
Gosh! I wonder what weight oil GM uses (as a factory fill) & recommends for the Corvette, the supercharged CTS-V, the GTO, etc. ???????????

5W-30 M1.

What do they know about (their) engines, anyway?

Cheers!

p.s. In LA any SL (and up) 5W-30 would work fine in a " '99 Camaro SS"
 
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Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
Gosh! I wonder what weight oil GM uses (as a factory fill) & recommends for the Corvette, the supercharged CTS-V, the GTO, etc. ???????????

5W-30 M1.

What do they know about (their) engines, anyway?





You're making the assumption that just because an oil is the factory fill, then that automatically makes it the best choice. Not always the case!

It's true, many people have gotten hundreds of thousands of miles out of their LS1 engines using M1, and I'm not saying it's a bad oil, I just don't think it's necessarily the best choice in every application.
 
Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
Gosh! I wonder what weight oil GM uses (as a factory fill) & recommends for the Corvette, the supercharged CTS-V, the GTO, etc. ???????????

5W-30 M1.

What do they know about (their) engines, anyway?





You're making the assumption that just because an oil is the factory fill, then that automatically makes it the best choice. Not always the case!

It's true, many people have gotten hundreds of thousands of miles out of their LS1 engines using M1, and I'm not saying it's a bad oil, I just don't think it's necessarily the best choice in every application.


The thing you are leaving out is that XM(M1) has worked extensively with GM( and many other engine builders around the world) to produce an oil that has met the rigorious requirements that GM has required of an oil. It's XM that has spent the dollars in R&D along with engineers from GM to produce an oil capable of the demands their engines are under. Will other oils work fine in these engines? Of course they will if they meet the same requirements.
 
Originally Posted By: The Critic
GC 0w30 is not a fuel efficient 0w30 so the usual rules about 0w-xx oils do not apply.

Fwiw, GM does not recommend the use of 0w30 in a car calling for 5w30 unless the ambient temp is below 32F or 0F (one of the two). That says a lot.


probably because there is not a gm 0w30 oil at the dealer!
 
As a favor to a friend, I gave her 2.2 Ecotec an oil change.
The OM recommended 0W-30 where very low (I don't recall the number) temperatures were anticipated.
We sometimes see really cold (like -20F) temperatures here, so I figured that was good enough, and gave the thing M1 0W-30 AFE.
The M1 site also recommended AFE 0W-30 without reservation for this 2008 G5.
 
Originally Posted By: steve20
What part of OH sees -20 degrees?


not to flame on fdcg, but ^^^this.

Just an honest question. (Wind chills can't count as there's no heat to pull away from a static engine)

I am still fully advocating the use of 0-Weights regardless.
 
I cant see ohio having -20. Our coldest last year was barly into the -30 and our coldest i can remember was jan in 2009 and we hit -42(all temps without windchill). I live in the 6th coldest city in the USA, and since ive joined BITOG ive became alot more anal about my oil. But the 0wXX while is great for wear in cold, i am one of the few in my city that run anything less than a 10W30. And there are many vehicles running around over 200k miles. You can run 0Wxx in anything that the second number is what your engine calls for without worry.
 
Originally Posted By: mount
Originally Posted By: steve20
What part of OH sees -20 degrees?


not to flame on fdcg, but ^^^this.

Just an honest question. (Wind chills can't count as there's no heat to pull away from a static engine)

I am still fully advocating the use of 0-Weights regardless.



I thought I might get called on this, and I did say "sometimes".
I went to the NOAA site, and found the following, which I've copied and pasted below. Note that every city in the state for which NOAA offered data in the table I looked at has seen -20F.

CLEVELAND, OH 61 -20 -15 -5 10 25 31 41 38 32 19 3 -15 -20
COLUMBUS, OH 63 -22 -13 -6 14 25 35 43 39 31 20 5 -17 -22
DAYTON, OH 59 -25 -16 -7 15 27 40 44 39 32 21 -2 -20 -25
MANSFIELD, OH 43 -22 -11 -6 8 25 37 43 40 33 20 2 -17 -22
TOLEDO, OH 47 -20 -14 -6 8 25 32 40 34 26 15 2 -19 -20
YOUNGSTOWN, OH 59 -22 -14 -10 11 24 30 40 32 29 20 1 -12 -22

The first number is the number of years of data used by NOAA, while the rest are the lowest temperatures recorded by month Jan-Dec.
What's really surprising are the record lows for spring, summer and fall.
We live about midway between Cincinnati and Dayton, incidentally.
This ain't North Dakota, and while will see overnight lows below zero every winter, it's usually for only a couple of days following a heavy snow, and it doesn't linger for weeks at a time.
 
Originally Posted By: steve20
What part of OH sees -20 degrees?


Wooster, and MI border. Particularly by the lakes. Possible Cleveland too.

It sure sees 0 and below in winter!

And 100+ in Summer, if not high 90s.
 
Originally Posted By: 45ACP
Originally Posted By: steve20
What part of OH sees -20 degrees?


Wooster, and MI border. Particularly by the lakes. Possible Cleveland too.

It sure sees 0 and below in winter!

And 100+ in Summer, if not high 90s.


We may not be North Dakota, but we aren't Texas either.
This part of the state will see at least a couple of below zero mornings each winter, and we'll also see at least one afternoon each summer where the temperature flirts with, and sometimes exceeds 100F in this part of the state.
We've also had 56" of precipitation in 2011 in the southwestern part of the state, and we have yet to see more than a few snow flakes this winter.
We did have our usual summer drought, with a total of only 6.5" of rain June through August. This did not help the farmers, who had to plant late due to spring rains, and who then got hit with nearly eleven inches of rain in September, too late to help their crops, and just in time to screw up the harvest.
 
Boo-Hooo!

Growing up in Dayton in the '50's we walked to school (St. Agnes) barefoot in the snow 5 miles, uphill BOTH WAYS!

Having a 1 ton truck to pull a utility trailer to the dump twice a year makes as much sense as making your oil choice dependant upon the lowest temps on record.

Normal ambient temp = good choice.

Cheers!
 
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