Mobil oils for Getrag transmission and BMW diff

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OVERKILL

OVERKILL

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Going to change the gear and tranny oils the next time the car is on the hoist. I'd rather not use the BMW/Castrol fluid if I can help it.

Does Mobil make an equivalent manual transmission fluid that anybody knows of? Preferably synthetic? Transmission is a Getrag 420G.

The diff should be pretty easy, I have a stock of Delvac 1 synthetic gear lube for that.
 
Originally Posted By: dparm
Why does it have to be Mobil? They do sell 75w90, 75w90 LS, and 75w150 gear lubes.


Because I like Mobil.

With that out of the way, I have their 75w90 in Delvac 1 form already on-hand. I have a feeling the transmission takes something else.
 
According to Amsoil's page:



MTF-LT-1, BMW part no. 83 22 9 408 942 from
model year 2004 some manual transmissions are filled with
MTF-LT-2 which has the same properties as MTF-LT-1.
The MTF-LT-1 fluid may be mixed and or substituted for the
MTF-LT-2 manual transmission fluid, except SMG Transmission
in 2006 and later M3, M5, M6. 2006 and



From what I read, MTF-LT-1 used to be made by Mobil and it's a 75w80 oil, GL4. The LT-2 was the Castrol fluid.
 
Originally Posted By: dparm
According to Amsoil's page:



MTF-LT-1, BMW part no. 83 22 9 408 942 from
model year 2004 some manual transmissions are filled with
MTF-LT-2 which has the same properties as MTF-LT-1.
The MTF-LT-1 fluid may be mixed and or substituted for the
MTF-LT-2 manual transmission fluid, except SMG Transmission
in 2006 and later M3, M5, M6. 2006 and



From what I read, MTF-LT-1 used to be made by Mobil and it's a 75w80 oil, GL4. The LT-2 was the Castrol fluid.


To get the spec for your car you should look for a sticker on the transmission if you can't find it in your owner's manual.
 
Originally Posted By: dparm
The LT-2 was the Castrol fluid.

From what I know, MTF2 is a Pentosin fluid. Like you mentioned, it is a GL-4 75w-80 fluid and according to Pentosin, it is recommended for all ZF and Getrag boxes from 1997 onwards. The OE BMW part number for it is: 83 22 0 309 031. I'm currently using it in mine. I bought it from Autohausaz. People also use RP Synchromax and Redline something or another with good results. Personally, I haven't noticed much difference between Synchromax and Pentosin in mine. Also, according to the spec sheet, Pentosin MTF2 is a mineral fluid, but it has unusually low pour point of -60C.

I don't know if Mobil currently has something comparable.

As for rear diff, I'm using LubroMoly 75w-90. I'd expect most other GL-5 75w-90 fluids to work just fine, unless the M has some unusual rear diff requirements.

P1050629.jpg
 
You should probably give this long, painful thread a read.

I came across this when helping a buddy of mine do the transmission fluid on his 1000HP Supra... It has a similar, though not identical transmission. Evidently, there were a number of reported failures with Redline MTL, and after reading though this thread, I actually believe it.

XOM does not make a suitable lubricant for this application. The general consensus from that thread seems to be OEM or RP. FWIW, the Supra guy ended up using Motorcraft XT-M5-QS: PDS Link.

problem is, it's probably made by Castrol. I'm not actually sure what went into his decision to use the Motorcraft stuff, but knowing him he researched it to death before using. So, you may want to check that out.
 
Originally Posted By: JOD
I came across this when helping a buddy of mine do the transmission fluid on his 1000HP Supra... It has a similar, though not identical transmission. Evidently, there were a number of reported failures with Redline MTL, and after reading though this thread, I actually believe it.


MKIVers were pushing up to 1200rwhp through stock, unbuilt Getrags and then blaming it on the fluids used?!?
crazy2.gif
smirk.gif
 
Originally Posted By: JOD
You should probably give this long, painful thread a read.

I came across this when helping a buddy of mine do the transmission fluid on his 1000HP Supra... It has a similar, though not identical transmission. Evidently, there were a number of reported failures with Redline MTL, and after reading though this thread, I actually believe it.

XOM does not make a suitable lubricant for this application. The general consensus from that thread seems to be OEM or RP. FWIW, the Supra guy ended up using Motorcraft XT-M5-QS: PDS Link.

problem is, it's probably made by Castrol. I'm not actually sure what went into his decision to use the Motorcraft stuff, but knowing him he researched it to death before using. So, you may want to check that out.


Yup, read that thread. Which is why I was wondering if Mobil made a fluid.

I'll fire them off an e-mail and ask.

Thanks for all the help so far guys!

-Chris
 
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: JOD
You should probably give this long, painful thread a read.

I came across this when helping a buddy of mine do the transmission fluid on his 1000HP Supra... It has a similar, though not identical transmission. Evidently, there were a number of reported failures with Redline MTL, and after reading though this thread, I actually believe it.

XOM does not make a suitable lubricant for this application. The general consensus from that thread seems to be OEM or RP. FWIW, the Supra guy ended up using Motorcraft XT-M5-QS: PDS Link.

problem is, it's probably made by Castrol. I'm not actually sure what went into his decision to use the Motorcraft stuff, but knowing him he researched it to death before using. So, you may want to check that out.


Yup, read that thread. Which is why I was wondering if Mobil made a fluid.

I'll fire them off an e-mail and ask.

Thanks for all the help so far guys!

-Chris


Mobil doesn't make an 71141 compatible fluid any more. Here's the proof:

Mobil Q&A

I'm almost positive they used to say their M1 ATF was compatible. Lots of evidence of that if you google 71141 equivalents.
 
Yeah, got a response from them this morning. Said they don't have a compatible fluid and I have to go to the dealer.
 
Manual trannys should get manual tranny fluid, not regular differential gear oil, and often not the factory ATF.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Manual trannys should get manual tranny fluid, not regular differential gear oil, and often not the factory ATF.


I had great luck with Mobil 1 ATF in my Borg Warner T-5. However, this car is different.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Going to change the gear and tranny oils the next time the car is on the hoist. I'd rather not use the BMW/Castrol fluid if I can help it.

Does Mobil make an equivalent manual transmission fluid that anybody knows of? Preferably synthetic? Transmission is a Getrag 420G.

The diff should be pretty easy, I have a stock of Delvac 1 synthetic gear lube for that.


I'm not too sure about the M5 but I have tried many different fluids in my Z3M tranny. I have tried M1 ATF, Amsoil MTF, Dex VI and RP Syncromax. My favorite is the Royal purple.
 
I wasn't a fan of having M1 ATF in my Getrag. My last 3 Getrag boxes have spec'd out ATF; not sure what the M cars are calling for.

Anyway, the shifts became very notchy. I eventually just went with generic dino Chevron ATF and the shift quality improved a lot over M1.

I had a similar experience when i put M1 gear lube in my LSD diff. MISTAKE! Didn't realize that I needed the friction modifiers too. The LSD bound up and felt like it was going to poop itself. I added some LSD-specific additive to the M1 and it was still fine when I sold the car with 250,000 miles.
 
Originally Posted By: JOD
You should probably give this long, painful thread a read.

I came across this when helping a buddy of mine do the transmission fluid on his 1000HP Supra... It has a similar, though not identical transmission. Evidently, there were a number of reported failures with Redline MTL, and after reading though this thread, I actually believe it.

XOM does not make a suitable lubricant for this application. The general consensus from that thread seems to be OEM or RP. FWIW, the Supra guy ended up using Motorcraft XT-M5-QS: PDS Link.

problem is, it's probably made by Castrol. I'm not actually sure what went into his decision to use the Motorcraft stuff, but knowing him he researched it to death before using. So, you may want to check that out.


Very interesting VOA of the BMW fluid in that old thread:

BMW MTF-LT-1

cSt@40 c 37.5
cSt@100 c 7.5
Viscosity index 172
SUS @ 100F 190.1
SUS @ 210 F 51.3
silver Boron 205
Aluminum 1
Calcium Cadmium Chromium Copper Iron Magnesium 2
Manganese Molbdenum Sodium 2
Nickel Phosphorus 484
Lead Antimony Silicon Tin Vanadium Zinc 7
Total Acid Number 0.63 mgKOH/g
viscosity -cP @ -10 c 2116
viscosity - cP @ -20 c H 4757
viscosity - cP @ -30 c H 12347
viscosity - cP @ - 40 c H 38246

Synthetic oil with boron-phosphorus ep package. Viscosity does not meet Dexron and mercon low temperature requirements.

Other fluids I have run in my BMW for comparison; note that RP has significantly better low temperature properties than the stock fluid:

RP Synchromax

Vicosity at 40C = 38 cSt
Viscosity at 100C = 7.7 cSt

viscosity - cP @ -20 c 1050
viscosity - cP @ -30 c 2730
viscosity - cP @ - 40 c 8430
Pour point = -54C

M1 ATF Dex III

Vicosity at 40C = 36.3 cSt
Viscosity at 100C = 7.4 cSt

viscosity - cP @ - 40 c 10040
Pour point = -51C


Castrol Dex VI

Vicosity at 40C = 29.8 cSt
Viscosity at 100C = 6.0 cS
Pour point = -40C

Amsoil MTF

Vicosity at 40C = 47.1 cSt
Viscosity at 100C = 9.6 cSt

viscosity - cP @ - 40 c 38273
Pour point = -45C
 
I`d emailed Mobil one time and they said that they don`t make a lubricant for a synchronized manual tranny (that is if said tranny uses a GL4 gear oil).
 
Originally Posted By: mva
Originally Posted By: JOD
You should probably give this long, painful thread a read.

I came across this when helping a buddy of mine do the transmission fluid on his 1000HP Supra... It has a similar, though not identical transmission. Evidently, there were a number of reported failures with Redline MTL, and after reading though this thread, I actually believe it.

XOM does not make a suitable lubricant for this application. The general consensus from that thread seems to be OEM or RP. FWIW, the Supra guy ended up using Motorcraft XT-M5-QS: PDS Link.

problem is, it's probably made by Castrol. I'm not actually sure what went into his decision to use the Motorcraft stuff, but knowing him he researched it to death before using. So, you may want to check that out.


Very interesting VOA of the BMW fluid in that old thread:

BMW MTF-LT-1

cSt@40 c 37.5
cSt@100 c 7.5
Viscosity index 172
SUS @ 100F 190.1
SUS @ 210 F 51.3
silver Boron 205
Aluminum 1
Calcium Cadmium Chromium Copper Iron Magnesium 2
Manganese Molbdenum Sodium 2
Nickel Phosphorus 484
Lead Antimony Silicon Tin Vanadium Zinc 7
Total Acid Number 0.63 mgKOH/g
viscosity -cP @ -10 c 2116
viscosity - cP @ -20 c H 4757
viscosity - cP @ -30 c H 12347
viscosity - cP @ - 40 c H 38246

Synthetic oil with boron-phosphorus ep package. Viscosity does not meet Dexron and mercon low temperature requirements.

Other fluids I have run in my BMW for comparison; note that RP has significantly better low temperature properties than the stock fluid:

RP Synchromax

Vicosity at 40C = 38 cSt
Viscosity at 100C = 7.7 cSt

viscosity - cP @ -20 c 1050
viscosity - cP @ -30 c 2730
viscosity - cP @ - 40 c 8430
Pour point = -54C

M1 ATF Dex III

Vicosity at 40C = 36.3 cSt
Viscosity at 100C = 7.4 cSt

viscosity - cP @ - 40 c 10040
Pour point = -51C


Castrol Dex VI

Vicosity at 40C = 29.8 cSt
Viscosity at 100C = 6.0 cS
Pour point = -40C

Amsoil MTF

Vicosity at 40C = 47.1 cSt
Viscosity at 100C = 9.6 cSt

viscosity - cP @ - 40 c 38273
Pour point = -45C







IIRC, there were grumblings in that thread that the fluid that came OUT of the transmission was note the same as what you were putting back in. That what came out was heavier. Too bad we don't have a UOA of it.
 
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