Transynd Fluid?

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Mar 15, 2009
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michigan
A lot of people on the Diesel forums are switching their Allison transmissions from Dexron VI to Transynd with fantastic results. They say the Transynd is a superior fluid even when compared to the almighty DEX VI, I was wondering if this is a fluid that would work well in other GM transmissions like the 4L60E or 4L80E?
 
Hi,
disturban - You must use a fluid with the correct specification - Dexron V1 may or not be part of the specification. As for Castrol Transynd it is an excellent product when used in the correct application and according to its specification
 
I believe that fellow BITOGer Onion runs Transynd in his 4T65Es with great results. Look at some of his old posts.
 
Transynd is the trade name for BP/Castrol's synthetic ATF that is licensed under Allison's TES-295 spec and formerly under the Dexron-III spec. Putting Transynd into a transmission made for Dex-VI is putting a syn Dex-III fluid into it. If the transmission was made for Dex-III, great, use any fluid that meets Dex-III specs or is licensed as TES-389, the same as Dex-III with a new name. If the transmission was made for Dex-VI and you put in a Dex-III fluid, the risk is yours.

By the way, there are other TES-295 ATFs licensed by Allison other than Castrol's Transynd, and there is also Amsoil's unlicensed TES-295 copy. And many syn fluids that either meet the Dex-III spec or are "recommended" where Dex-III was spec'ed.
 
I've had Transynd in my '01 Lumina's 4T65e for the past 30K or so. This particular transmission didn't shift well when I 'upgraded' to DexVI (the 1-2 up-shift started a nasty slip & grab behavior at full throttle). Did a complete flush with Transynd and it solved the problem.

Transynd is a synthetic atf that meets DexIIIG specs, along with a laundry-list of industrial specs... and should work fine in any application calling for that.

As for whether Transynd or DexVI is 'better' in the Allison transmissions in those GM trucks- I dunno. From what I've read, there's very little in the way of 'proof' or solid info that's readily available to us mere consumers (lots of claims, lots of anecdotal evidence... very little in the way of data). The choice of OEM fluids in that particular transmission is based more on corporate politics than any distinct advantage. Personally I doubt you'd notice any real difference between the two.

In non-Allison applications calling for DexVI, I have no doubt that Transynd would work. But for how long? And under what conditions? And would it cause warranty issues? Transynd is a weird looking ATF once it gets some miles on it- turns a strange yellow color with a reddish tint... it would DEFINITELY be noticed by the tech if there was a warranty issue. IMO it would be analogous to putting a fluid like Amsoil, Maxlife, etc. into an application that wasn't designed for it (although one would assume that Amsoil and Valvoline have done some testing for automotive applications... I dunno if we can assume that with Transynd, with the exception of GM pickups. It would work- but you'd be taking your chances.

I've seen no reason to believe that Transynd is a "better" fluid than DexVI in any way. My own results tell me that the friction properties of Transynd are somewhat different than those of DexVI- and said friction properties of Transynd work better in my 230,000-mile 4T65e. But I wouldn't bet that everybody else would have the same experience. If a transmission was designed with DexVI in mind, the friction properties of DexVI would probably be more suitable than those of Transynd.
 
My understanding of using tes 295 fluid in Allison transmissions, is there is a cutoff serial number where you can use Dex III before the cutoff, Dex VI after. tes 295 is recommended for heavy use applications and extended drain in Allisons. Allison has an extended warranty program that includes a requirement to use tes 295 fluid. The maintenence schedules show some impressive increase in change intervals. Some of the applications look pretty tough, such as garbage trucks with many starts per mile. The longest change intervals aren't allowed until after a couple of changes ensuring little dilution of the tes 295 fluid with the original fluid.

I changed the fluid in my 2003 Silverado with a 4L60 at 25K with Delvac tes 295. The original fluid spec was Dex III. It shifts very nice, maybe a bit better than the factory fluid. I am confident it is a durable fluid for my transmission.
 
I have a 2000 4L60E that calls for DexIII, the first 100k on this truck was cushy driving and mostly freeway and at 100k I did a pan drop and filter change as well as flushed all fluid out and replaced with DexVI, I also added a Transgo HD2 Shift kit and billet servos and 4th gear super apply servo. I added a B&M drain plug also.

The truck has a custom tune on it and shift points and line pressure are tweaked. Now with 160k on it I have done two pan drain and refills, I plan on draining just the pan and refilling every 30k because the truck see's a lot of hard driving now, towing, off road, ect.

So far the transmission is holding up great and shifts are fast and firm, I was just curious about the Transynd because all the Allison guys are raving about it but it seems to me I have the superior fluid and it is working great so I am not going to change anything.

Thank you all for the info...this site rocks!
 
Originally Posted By: disturban
I have a 2000 4L60E that calls for DexIII, the first 100k on this truck was cushy driving and mostly freeway and at 100k I did a pan drop and filter change as well as flushed all fluid out and replaced with DexVI, I also added a Transgo HD2 Shift kit and billet servos and 4th gear super apply servo. I added a B&M drain plug also.

The truck has a custom tune on it and shift points and line pressure are tweaked. Now with 160k on it I have done two pan drain and refills, I plan on draining just the pan and refilling every 30k because the truck see's a lot of hard driving now, towing, off road, ect.

So far the transmission is holding up great and shifts are fast and firm, I was just curious about the Transynd because all the Allison guys are raving about it but it seems to me I have the superior fluid and it is working great so I am not going to change anything.

Thank you all for the info...this site rocks!


You are correct Transynd used to have a DEXRON-III approval but lost it in the G to H upgrade as it could not pass some of the more demanding requirements. Also compared to DEXRON-VI it is less durable in friction since it utilises a now comparatively old DEXRON-III additive package.

Probably fine for it's intended application but it is not magic.

The DEXRON-VI that you are using is superior for your application.
 
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I found this article about Shell Donax TX. They are using the same approach as Scheaffer and Amsoil and not getting this fluid certified. They claim both Dex III H and TES 295 performance.

http://www.imakenews.com/rotella/e_article000539098.cfm?x=b11,0,w

This link doesn't work so copy and enter it in a google search. Or just google search Shell Donax TX. Shell's product info says it is semi-synthetic.
 
That is very interesting.

My question is how would one provide proof of performance when the given specification has been obsolete for a number of years?

Of course they will say that the formulation has not changed since it was originally approved. What else would you expect?
 
Looking for more info on Transynd, I found an expert posting on several forums. Tom Johnson aka "Mr Transynd" worked for Allison 1990-2008 and wrote the specs for TES 295. If you do a google seach for Tom Johnson Mr Transynd, you will find several threads on RV, Duramax, and diesel forums. He seems willing to answer any questions posed about Allisons and fluids. It would be nice to compel him to join here.
 
Now that would make for some fun reading... an oil-nerd fight between WhiteWolf and Mr Transynd.
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My shop uses Transynd in all our buses, 1st and 3rd gen ZF Ecomats. After 20k miles the oil is always brown and burnt. I believe its due to the small cooler and heavy retarder use but I honestly wouldn't use Transynd in any serious working vehicle.
 
I lifted this info from an RV forum post by Mr Transynd:

Allison did approve DEXRON-III ATF for many years until I saw a need to change that. The problem was always viscosity loss in DEXRON type fluids. They were good fluids from every other aspect but they tended to lose viscosity (some could lose as much as 50-60%). So the problem we had was keeping the drain intervals low enough to avoid significant viscosity loss that could affect transmission durability. If you use a TES-389 fluid (DEXRON-IIIH) you need to drain it per recommendations. These fluids lose viscosity and could result in wear if you run them too long. Also, cooling efficiency drops due to reduced flow in the cooling circuit because the fluid is thinner. So, as long as you're following recommended TES-389 drain intervals, you'll be OK. However, unless you're changing it yourself, the labor to change fluid will eventually be more than the TranSynd since you can run it 150,000 miles in the 1000/2000 Series and 300,000 miles in the 3000/4000 Series.

PS: That's why I'm on this forum. I'm here to settle all the arguments concerning Allison fluid recommendations and specs since I'm the guy that wrote all of them.

PSS: TES-389 fluids are all DEXRON-IIIH fluids. That's why the drain intervals are so short compared to TranSynd and TES-295 fluids. We launched the TES-389 specification because some folks just could not bring themselves to spend the extra money for TranSynd or another TES-295 fluid. But, it's false economy .... TranSYnd and the other TES-295 fluids are worth it (by a large margin)
 
Originally Posted By: Whitewolf
Well can someone post the DEXRON-III (H) licence for Transynd?


I don't see anybody making the claim that Transynd meets this now-defunct spec. You say that DexVI 'has surpassed Transynd performance'. I'd like to see some kind of data or info to back that up.

I understand that you're saying that Transynd didn't meet the DexIII(H) spec (or DexVI for that matter). But as I'm sure you're quite aware, there's more to a spec than "performance". For all WE Transynd could have missed the spec by .01% on some nitpicky detail that nobody here would care about. Without more info, it really doesn't mean a whole lot.

For that matter, DexVI does not meet the TES-295 spec. Does that mean that Transynd 'has surpassed DexVI performance'? No... all it means is that we're comparing apples and oranges. But in this case both fluids are commonly used in some of the same applications. So any info that you can provide beyond "it doesn't meet the spec" would be helpful.
 
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