Noob E85 Q

[Sal69]

Alright, I new here but I've heard of E85 and have thought of running it at times but was always tolded it'll mess my truck up(like running diesel in it) My trucks a 2000 F150 and has no notes saying I can or can not running it. Its the 4.2 v6 engine. Also, could I run this in my 80s-vic and 91 camaro with out problems. I'm not talking running it fuel time but maybe throwing a few gallons in with regular.

I know this has probly been asked a lot before but I just want too make 110 percent sure.

 

[MrMeeks]

No,don't run even a drop of e85 in your Ford.E85 will cause fuel injector and fuel pump failure,and the engine will burn far more of it compared to e10 fuel.

 

[MrMeeks]

No,don't use e85.It can damage fuel injectors and fuel pump because e85 has very little lube it . It may be possible to add a small amt. of outboard oil to the e85 to boost lubrication,but I don't want to test it with my only operable truck.One day I ran it in my farm tractor .The tractor had much less power and burned that gallon of e85 in a very short time.

 

[chubbs1]

WHY WOULD YOU WANT TOO??? NEVER DO THAT!! NOT GOOD FOR THE ENGINE!! NO BENEFIT TO THE ENVIRONMENT EITHER SINCE IT IS SO INEFFICIENT. STAY AWAY LIKE THE PLAGUE. The 80's Camaro is even worse to run it in. Lawn mowers can't even handle that stuff.

 

[calvin1]

Just in case you need a third opinion: NO!

 

[CarbonSteel]

Originally Posted By: Sal69
My trucks a 2000 F150 and has no notes saying I can or can not running it.

Unless your truck states Flex Fuel Vehicle (FFV) on the body or gas cap, you should not run E85 in it. There are some that state they have ran E85 "with no problems" but the fuel system on your truck is not designed for E85 and you will likely have some issues. The 2000 F-150 OM states:

Your vehicle is designed to use “Regular” unleaded gasoline with pump (R+M)/2 octane rating of 87.

You can see the entire OM online here: Ford F-150 Owners Manual

 

[Hallmark]

I wouldn't even run that stuff in my E85 2010 Fusion 3.0...too many ifs, and, buts, and asterisks in the manual.

 

[CarbonSteel]

Originally Posted By: MrMeeks
It can damage fuel injectors and fuel pump because e85 has very little lube it.

This **may** apply to a non-flex fuel vehicle, but there is a gentleman on the board who has ran (using his words) thousand of gallons of E85 in a non-FFV vehicle with no problems. I have not read this being a problem with a FFV (I have owned 2 and have had zero problems running E85).
Originally Posted By: MrMeeks
The tractor had much less power and burned that gallon of e85 in a very short time.

Most engines make more power due to the higher octane of E85 not less, but the BTUs contained in E85 are less than gasoline and more fuel will be required. However, in my FFV I have yet to see a huge drop in MPG (some yes, but not the 25-30% some have experienced. More on the order of 10-15% (at least thus far).

 

[SteveSRT8]

Excuse me, but VERY FEW engines make more power on E85. Only if properly tuned for it, as in flex fuel vehicles. Since the overwhelming majority of vehicles are not set up for it they should use extreme caution in selecting it as it is a huge hit in economy and produces a scary combination of pollutants!

I would agree that E10 has harmed very few vehicles, but E85 is also unlikely to harm most newer vehicles. It's older vehicles that can literally get eaten up by it!

 

[CarbonSteel]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Excuse me, but VERY FEW engines make more power on E85. Only if properly tuned for it, as in flex fuel vehicles.

In my opinion, that would depend on your definition of "tuned for it". If an engine is capable of producing more horsepower/torque but is being held back due to lack of octane (i.e. retard timing to reduce ping/pre-ignition), then yes, the engine WILL make more power as E85 has more than 100 octane. Every engine that I have ever seen using E85 produced more horsepower versus E10, but the economy is reduced (even that varies whereas some vehicles see a 30-40% reduction in MPG and others see 10-20%).

 

[Sal69]

Originally Posted By: 2010_FX4
Originally Posted By: MrMeeks
It can damage fuel injectors and fuel pump because e85 has very little lube it.

This **may** apply to a non-flex fuel vehicle, but there is a gentleman on the board who has ran (using his words) thousand of gallons of E85 in a non-FFV vehicle with no problems. I have not read this being a problem with a FFV (I have owned 2 and have had zero problems running E85).


Thats what I read and wanted to make sure about. Thanks everyone for your responses, I dont plan on running it anytime now. I was just wondering since its .40 cents cheaper then ruglar 87 in my area (3.09 vs 2.69)

 

[SteveSRT8]

Got any dyno figures? Seat o' the pants meters are a bit unreliable!

Around here in GM products (5.3 and 6.0) E10 reduces our mileage by a solid 10-15%. Very vehicle specific. No real driveability issues at all.

My 6.1 in the Chrysler went down almost 15% on E10, but I was able to recover some of that with a handheld aftermarket tuner. It being a high specific output motor (425 hp from 370 ci) you would think it would love the alcohol, but it's really hard to get a modern car to flow enough to utilize E85 properly. That's a key difference in the flex fuel motors.

Your mileage results are fine until you expect us all to believe that E85 only cut the mileage by 10-20%. Sorry, but I ain't buying it.

 

[LS2JSTS]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8


Your mileage results are fine until you expect us all to believe that E85 only cut the mileage by 10-20%. Sorry, but I ain't buying it.


Are you talking about in a FFV or in a non FFV?

In my FFV, the 10% figure is spot on with what I observed between E85 and E10. With E10 I get 31.X mpg combined use, with E85 it drops to 27-28 mpg pretty consistently.

I would tend to agree the results in non FFV would be different and would likely vary to a greater degree. But in a FFV, the 10-20% loss in fuel economy is correct imo.

Also, the HP and TQ figures from GM show improved TQ and HP with E85 vs E10. And that is usually the case with engines designed to use E85.

 

[CarbonSteel]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Your mileage results are fine until you expect us all to believe that E85 only cut the mileage by 10-20%. Sorry, but I ain't buying it.

Well...certainly not attempting to sell anything here! I live in the Houston metro area and with very few exceptions there is no E0 gasoline only E10/E15 and so my numbers are the difference between E10/E15 and E85. Apologies if somehow that was misleading!
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Got any dyno figures? Seat o' the pants meters are a bit unreliable!

For the power differences between E10/E15 and E85, Ford states this for my FX4 (so no dyno needed--unless you do not believe Ford):

– 5.4L 3V V8 with 310 hp and 365 lb.-ft. of torque (Regular gas)
– 5.4L 3V V8 with 320 hp and 390 lb.-ft. of torque (E85 fuel)

2010 Ford F-150 Towing Specifications

 

[Sal69]

I'm not sure if I should answer but if the engine is tuned for E85(this is off mytopic but for these last few Q's) the engine will see a dramatic change in HP and Tourqe. I'm not talking about FFV's but built cars. I'm from mn so I get too see the CC-summer nat'll at the fair grounds evey year and they have cars running full exhaust making 1200hp on e85. Where a gas engine would need too run 110 race fuel with open exhaust and a big turbo to make this(these are turbo cars, but when you see a singal turbo 406 belt out 1000hp on stuff that you can get out of holiday it surprizes you).

 

[rslifkin]

It will probably run fine. Generally, most newer vehicles can adjust the fuel flow enough to run ok on it. Be aware though, there is a risk of it clogging the fuel filter (cleaning effect on the tank). Other than that, it shouldn't do any damage. However, in an engine not set up to take advantage of the high octane, you'll see terrible mpg (probably around 25 - 30% less) due to the lower energy content.

The older cars would be more of a concern, however, as the fuel system parts may not handle alcohol well. They may also not be able to richen up the fuel mix enough. If any of them are carb-ed, don't even think about it, they'd need to be re-jetted first.

For the truck, I'd be tempted to say try it and see what happens with that big a price spread. If it throws a CEL, add more gas to the mix.