BMW 335d Factory Fill 6.5k miles.

Status
Not open for further replies.
Are the BMW diesels running the LL-01 or is there a specific variety of Castrol SLX Professional for diesels? Sorry, I'm not up on all the BMW oil specs.
 
Originally Posted By: unDummy
Wheres the zinc?



It has been suggested that BMW uses a break-in oil on their diesels. I've only seen 2-3 BMW diesel UOA's so I decided to help the community by adding one of my own.

Just to let you know this factory fill was driven from Nov-May, 50/50 hwy/city, and included 3 early AM 2 miles trips every week. I was also fairly vigorous with the break-in.
 
Originally Posted By: dparm
Are the BMW diesels running the LL-01 or is there a specific variety of Castrol SLX Professional for diesels? Sorry, I'm not up on all the BMW oil specs.


The dealerships pour SLX OE Pro which is LL04, MB 229.51, among others.
 
If they used a break-in oil, I'd expect ALL additive numbers to be exaggerated. And, they might even recommend an early change out.
Break-in oil is a myth and often confused with the additives from the assembly lube.

The Z and P ratios have an issue. Call Blackstone for a retest.
 
break-in oils are a myth? i don't know any of the specifics of the op's engine, but every john deere engine i have either bought new or have had over-hauled has required thier break-in oil, a straight 30wt break-in oil.

if it were me i would retest at next interval and wear numbers hopefully will be lower
 
Originally Posted By: unDummy
If they used a break-in oil, I'd expect ALL additive numbers to be exaggerated. And, they might even recommend an early change out.
Break-in oil is a myth and often confused with the additives from the assembly lube.

The Z and P ratios have an issue. Call Blackstone for a retest.


While it is true that BMW only performs a 1200 mile break in service on their "M" models, if you search BITOG for other BMW diesel UOA's of factory fill you'll find similar Z and P ratios. It was Blackstone which suggested this fill as some sort of break-in oil.

One other note is that the diesels recquire Low-SAPS oil. That might explain some of it (Look at the M1 ESP UOA's for example)
 
Last edited:
Most low SAP oils still have the ~1:1 Z to P ratio.

I looked at some ESP UOAs and they had 700-900 ppm of Z and P.

This UOA has 500 P and
If every low SAP oil requires 600-900 PPM of BOTH, then its OK for BMW to use a factory fill that may doesn't meet their own requirements/specs?

A break in service interval is different than break in oil.

I would've given this vehicle a break in service at 1k too. On my several last new car purchases, I changed the oil/filter when I pulled in the driveway. And, all my fluids got an early 'break in' change. But, none were ever filled with special break in oil.

The only zinc-free motor oils that I've seen were from Fuchs/Silkolene. Is Fuchs the factory fill?
 
Originally Posted By: unDummy
Most low SAP oils still have the ~1:1 Z to P ratio.

I looked at some ESP UOAs and they had 700-900 ppm of Z and P.

This UOA has 500 P and
If every low SAP oil requires 600-900 PPM of BOTH, then its OK for BMW to use a factory fill that may doesn't meet their own requirements/specs?

A break in service interval is different than break in oil.

I would've given this vehicle a break in service at 1k too. On my several last new car purchases, I changed the oil/filter when I pulled in the driveway. And, all my fluids got an early 'break in' change. But, none were ever filled with special break in oil.

The only zinc-free motor oils that I've seen were from Fuchs/Silkolene. Is Fuchs the factory fill?


Here's a UOA of another factory fill: http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=223833&d=1269895719

It had been suggested that Fuchs might have been the factory fill but as to what oil specifically who knows.
 
That just verifies a weak or unknown additive package. And, I would want it out as quickly as possible.

Lets skip the additive package so that it wears in instantly. Sorry, I for one would rather have the engine break and wear in by 30k instead of 5k, even if it means a tad bit of oil consumption or an engine not at 100% when younger. Its a diesel!

Now, my only question is, do we have any of these at 100k-150k miles yet?
 
Originally Posted By: unDummy
That just verifies a weak or unknown additive package. And, I would want it out as quickly as possible.

Lets skip the additive package so that it wears in instantly. Sorry, I for one would rather have the engine break and wear in by 30k instead of 5k, even if it means a tad bit of oil consumption or an engine not at 100% when younger. Its a diesel!

Now, my only question is, do we have any of these at 100k-150k miles yet?


Understood. As for 100k mile vehicles, those will only be found in Europe. The BMW diesel has only been on sale in the U.S. since late 2008 or early 2009.
 
Different tuning, different habits, different owners, different fuels and emissions.... not worried about the overseas diesels. We tend to castrate and choke 'em here.

I just hope that we don't ruin the diesel image again with all the emissions reliability issues that will occur.
 
Originally Posted By: unDummy
Most low SAP oils still have the ~1:1 Z to P ratio.

I looked at some ESP UOAs and they had 700-900 ppm of Z and P.

This UOA has 500 P and
If every low SAP oil requires 600-900 PPM of BOTH, then its OK for BMW to use a factory fill that may doesn't meet their own requirements/specs?

A break in service interval is different than break in oil.

I would've given this vehicle a break in service at 1k too. On my several last new car purchases, I changed the oil/filter when I pulled in the driveway. And, all my fluids got an early 'break in' change. But, none were ever filled with special break in oil.

The only zinc-free motor oils that I've seen were from Fuchs/Silkolene. Is Fuchs the factory fill?


Here's a thread with another UOA of the BMW factory fill: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1897605&page=1

You're hitting the nail on the head.
I've been trying to understand the nature of the BMW factory fill oil - it definitely is low zinc (as shown by the OP's UOA), but it does not appear to have the same additives as what we know to be LL-04 oils, such as you mention.
How does the Fuchs zinc-free oil perform in the absence of zinc? Does anyone know what its additive package looks like?
As far as I know, BMW is using a Castrol oil for factory fill, but my conclusion is only based on the fact that they recommend Castrol and supply Castrol branded oil for their refill kits. Who the heck knows what they are really putting in the vehicles?

Edit: One last question: since we know that at least Fuchs does offer a no/low zinc LL-04, should we conclude that the factory fill oil is "bad" or a "break in oil" or could it simply be a euro low/no zinc LL-04 formulation?
 
Last edited:
I found the spec sheet for the Castrol oil: http://www.tds.castrol.com.au/pdf/8549_SLX_Professional_BMW_LL04_Powerflow_119393_2007_10.pdf

Please note their comment regarding their additive package:
Quote:
High levels of metal based additives in engine oil can contribute to long term blocking of particulate filters and increase harmful emissions. “Clean Performance Technology” from Castrol uses lower levels of these metal based additives and prolongs the life of the particulate filter system.


Other than marketing gobbledygook, does this offer any insight into the results of the UOA's posted here and in other threads?
 
Hi,
62Lincoln - You said this;
"Other than marketing gobbledygook, does this offer any insight into the results of the UOA's posted here and in other threads? "

Yes, of course it does. However, many people here on BITOG do not understand the reactions (chemical and other) that an engine libricant goes through in use

This is but one reason why simple UOAs (and single pass UOAs in particular) need to be treated only as an "interesting tool" especially regarding wear metal levels
 
Doug, thank you for your reply. Stepping away from wear metals for a moment, I'd really appreciate your thoughts on the apparent "lack" of the usual additives in this oil - even compared to other LL04 oils such as Mobil 1 ESP 5W-30. Obviously, there's more than 1 way to achieve approval with the OEMs and their diesel requirements. There were comments earlier in the thread about this oil's unusual Z:p ratio, as well as the "unusual" absolute levels of Z and P. Since this oil has been characterized by Blackstone as a "break in" oil, is it really? Or has Castrol simply chosen a unique approach to a long life, low SAP oil required by the OEM's?
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: unDummy
This isn't a john deere. Not too many john deeres on the highways.

But then nothing runs like a Deere!!! I just had to post.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top