Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 -- 2005 VW TDI -- very high iron

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LoneRanger

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Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 = FAIL

Almost double the iron content. Operational difference between the two runs: April sample was from winter run of mostly short trips. August sample was from Spring/summer run of almost all highway miles. Operator's employment changed from local in town job to out of town requiring 50 mile commute each way each day, hence the highway miles. Nothing else whatsoever changed. Note TBN exhausted in 2nd sample for same length of run as compared to previous. M1 ESP 5W30 is VW spec 507 approved, and VW approves 507 spec oil for use in 2004 - 2006 USA based TDI's, as 507 supercedes 505.01 and 506.01. In the previous report, Blackstone stated the Mobil 1 ESP was working well and to consider extending OC to 11,000. So much for that.


I will be switching the car back to Mobil 1 Turbo-Diesel Truck 5W40 CJ4 as soon as possible.


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What oil did you run on previous interval?

Still not sure I'd blame the oil for the high iron showing. Maybe something else is up, as Blackstone pointed out?
 
With all the highway miles, I expected the iron to trend downwards instead of up. My jaw dropped when I read the new report. Very concerned now.
 
Blackstone always suggests shortening an oil change interval when a wear metal reads high, but I think that's just a feel-good solution. Sure, you get a lower PPM reading, but you're still shedding EXACTLY the same amount of metal per hour of engine operation- its just going into two batches of oil instead of one.

If it were mine, I'd give an HD/diesel engine oil or something else with ZN/P numbers above 1000 PPM, like M1 0w40, 15w50, or one of the high-mileage oils a run and see if the wear trends back down, emissions equipment and recommended viscosity be darned. You can keep following the "rules" and watch the engine erode whatever part is beginning to fail, or you can violate the recommendations and see if you can extend its life. I'd go with the latter.
 
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I stay away from Mobil, and would not touch it with a 10 foot pole. I want the iron to stay IN the engine, so I use ANY oil, OTHER THAN MOBIL!!! If these results were from SuperTech, everyone would be saying, see!!!, get what you pay for. But Mobil is recommended for Corvettes, and is highly priced, so people fall for this gimmick. stay away!!!
 
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Blackstone always suggests shortening an oil change interval when a wear metal reads high, but I think that's just a feel-good solution. Sure, you get a lower PPM reading, but you're still shedding EXACTLY the same amount of metal per hour of engine operation- its just going into two batches of oil instead of one.


+1
 
For 9k miles on a diesel, I'm not sure that's such a bad report.

All metals except Fe are well within reason, and diesels tend to toss out a bit more Fe. Viscosity and Flashpoint are very good.

I think some are being a bit harsh here....JMO!
 
HI LR!
If the engine has a soft cam or follower you really cant blame the oil per-se, though a traditional 15w-40 Rotella or JD 50 MIGHT show lower numbers due to higher AW/AS additisation. High wear will proceed, but at a lower rate. I would have VW or yourself look at the potential wear location. Is your warranty kaput after 5 years? Any under the table deals going on with these engines?
 
Arco, yes the 2004 - 2006 VW diesels have an issue with the camshafts. Seems Volkswagen chose to make the cams and followers out of Wolfsburg's Finest Chocolate. A lot of 2004 - 2006's are eating their cams and followers. Soft and tasty. A large part of it is the unit injector design where the cam directly drives each cyl's injector.

My wife is getting ready to move into a regional sales rep position in October and will be putting in some serious highway miles with 3 and 4 hour trips to client cities common. Its a stick shift Beetle. We're thinking about just chucking it and getting her a more comfortable car for the highway in general, yet one with superior fuel economy and less Spartan than the Beetle in the luxury dept.
 
Originally Posted By: Captain_Klink
I stay away from Mobil, and would not touch it with a 10 foot pole. I want the iron to stay IN the engine, so I use ANY oil, OTHER THAN MOBIL!!! If these results were from SuperTech, everyone would be saying, see!!!, get what you pay for. But Mobil is recommended for Corvettes, and is highly priced, so people fall for this gimmick. stay away!!!



Blah blah blah, woof woof woof.

I'm not particularly brand loyal when it comes to oil, the real point here is that its NOT the oil causing the numbers to climb. A different formulation with a lot more ZDDP might get the problem under control, but even then its something of a band-aid. If you don't like the recommendation Mobil 1 0w40 or 15w50, I'd equally recommend Rotella or Delo 400.

Band-aid or not, the truth is that the engine might run another 100k miles this way- I'm not one to tear down or discard an engine based on oil analysis alone without other symptoms. I'd switch oils and then run it until something starts to fail, personally. If its cam followers, there's not going to be a spectacular kaboom, its just going to fade away and lose power as the valve lift decreases. Probably start getting pretty noisy too as the clearances open up- plenty of warning so that no one should be stranded.
 
TDI Club folks have discussed both oil and cam issues quite some time ago. As for oil, the consensus there was to stay away from back-specked 5W-30 and run TDT and Rotella. Even Delo and Delvac mineral oils were 'approved' by them. I would search there for recommendations on your strategy going further. IRC, rebuild is waiting around 200k miles, so if yours is young you still have some time. They even keep a list of reputable VW mechanics for each and every State..
 
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Originally Posted By: Captain_Klink
I stay away from Mobil, and would not touch it with a 10 foot pole. I want the iron to stay IN the engine, so I use ANY oil, OTHER THAN MOBIL!!! If these results were from SuperTech, everyone would be saying, see!!!, get what you pay for. But Mobil is recommended for Corvettes, and is highly priced, so people fall for this gimmick. stay away!!!

You do realize nobody gives a [censored] what you say??
 
"Clink! You bumbling Idiot!"
-
Actually I like Clink's Wolf in Wolves clothing!
"Mobil 1. We Dont meet SM or GF-4 specs, but We're so B.I.G, no one will touch Us - not even API.
Heck, We IS da API, dagnabbit!"
 
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
"Clink! You bumbling Idiot!"
-


And that was when Clink was a Colonel... he's been demoted since :p
 
I posted in PCMO forum that showed the VW 507.00 spec, which Mobil 1 ESP meets (a spec that few other oils meet), has the least wear of all the specs according to Lubrizol's relative performance tool. Its relative performance in several areas is way beyong GF-5/SM, A5/B5 or anything else
21.gif
. The only bad thing in this UOA is the iron and the rest looks stellar. Do we really know if the high iron is the fault of the oil and even if so does it really mean higher wear? It is possible that the sulpher in N.A. fuel drops this low SAPs TBN quicker but the TBN is not low according to B-stone. nd I thought that was more of a problem when using it in gas engines anyway.
 
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