Oil Applications - I

[MolaKule]

1. What is the difference between a Rust and Oxidation Inhibited (R&O) oil, and a Tractor Hydraulic (THO or THC) oil? [In terms of additives].

2. Could one oil be used as a replacement oil for the other?

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

1. R&O has no detergent/dispersant or ZDDP

2. No

 

[Pablo]

I'm with Jason but I suppose by definition a tractor oil is more of a "universal" oil to be used throughout...as an R&O can't be used in all gear boxes, etc

 

[userfriendly]

THFs are a multi functional fluid, formulated for use in transmissions, final drives, wet brakes, and hydraulic systems of "tractors", and other equipment employing a common fluid reservoir for the hydraulic system and drive train.
Mostly a multi fluid for farm equipment, back hoes, ect.
Can be used as a semi-automatic (power shift) transmission fluid (C-4).
I look at THFs as a heavy grade of ATF with an ISO viscosity of around the 46-60 range at 40C.
I've tried them in 2-stroke motorcycles where the owners previousy had used ATF.(with mixed reviews/results)
In automotive and light truck manual transmissions that called for ATF.
In railroad track maintaince equipment such as tampers.
I've poured THF on railroad switches and frogs, because that was the closest pail of something slippery and looked like oil.
I believe THFs have similar additive packages to ATFs, and meet GL-4, Cat TO-2, Allison C-4 are wet clutch and brake compatable and reduce chatter. (controlled rate)
They are usually red or orange in colour.
I've noticed some all season multi-grades of late.
The winter grades have a viscosity profile identical to an ATF or 32 hydraulic oil.
R+O: Those and the better quality of R+O, turbine fluids are what I use in motorcycle suspensions.

You mean there is another use for them?
Someone else can do the R+O statment.

[ September 05, 2003, 01:51 AM: Message edited by: userfriendly ]

 

[MolaKule]

Excellent responses.

In terms of applications, Rust and Oxidation Inhibited (R&O) oils are considered in the group of Industrial Hydraulic oils.

Some R&O oils are rust and oxidation inhibited only, but most today are AW R&O oils (AW Hydraulic oils), that contain ZDDP, moly, antimony, or boron compounds to aid in anti-wear funtionality. R&O oils contain no detergents. Some R&O oils have been used to simply coat steel or iron until further treatment or manufacture. Most R&O oils have been replaced with AW hydraulic oils which may contain Viscosity Index Improvers that have Pour Point Derpessants. AW Hydraulic oils usually have the better base stocks than do R&O oils. AW Hydraulic oils are usually made from Group II+ to Group V oils, while R&O oils usually cling to Group I or II oils.

Some R&O oils or AW hydraulic oils may be found in compressors as well, although specialty compressor oils have mostly replaced these oils.

It was found that with simple R&O oils, that when the oxidation inhibitor is consumed, wear increased. With higher pressure pumps and more tightly clearanced valving, more anti-wear qualities had to be added and of course, these AW adds also provide better oxidation inhibition.

The multipurpose THF fluids were designed to meet or exceed the tractor fluid specifications for J.I. Case, John Deere, and International Harvester farm tractors.

Tractor Hydraulic Fluid (THF) fluids serve as transmission fluid, hydraulic fluid, and gear oil for these applications. The viscosity is in the range of SAE 10W20 or 20W30. They must have very high VI, low pour point, Extreme-Pressure (EP) characteristics, outstanding Rust Inhibition, and oxidation resistance. They also have some detergents and dispersants.

For non-severe coating applications, the THF's could do the job, but NOT vice versa. Besides, the THF's are more expensive, so it is not economical to use THF's to replace R&O oils.

[ September 09, 2003, 10:39 PM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]

 

[MolaKule]

UTF or Universal Tractor FLuid, was supposed to be a universal fluid for use across international boundaries and to reduce lube inventories.

UTF fulfills the torque transfer, hydraulic, and power. transmission requirements of farm tractors and implements

For example John Deere, Case and others had slightly different THF specs and one UTF is supposed to replace all these disparate fluids.

It is supposed to be about a 7.3 to 9.5 cSt viscosity fluid with hi VI, improved shudder resistance, improved moisture tolerance, better anti-foam, improved thermal characteristics, and improved oxidation stability over THF's.

http://www.renewablelube.com/products/pdf/Bio-Hydrostatic Fluid.pdf

http://www.amref.com/bp_pb/7352_BP_UTF_PB.pdf

http://www.americanoilsupply.com/tds/24_utf.pdf

http://www.uslubricants.com/products/tractor.htm

http://www.smartsynthetics.com/products/amsoil_ath_tractor_hydraulic_transmission_oil.htm

http://www.peaklubricants.com/spec_sheets/PEAK Tractor Fluid.pdf

 

[Steve S]

Mola, help me with this on the Mystic oil website there are 2 "THFs" JT5 I think and Mystic ,looking at the specs the Mystic seems better than the JT5. Yet the JT5 costs more at the local Tractor supply .

 

[MolaKule]

Those lubricants are made by Citgo, a Venezuelan company nationalized by Hugo Chavez, a socialist and anti-American.

What in the specs make you think one is better than the other?

 

[Steve S]

Pour points Unless I am mistaken the cheaper one "the mystic "has better numbers? I know about uncle Hugo But as I have posted before is Arab oil better? I like Chevron products but I am curious?

 

[XS650]

Originally Posted By: John K
frogs??? I assume this is rr terminology??


Yes, maybe userfriendly will 'splain the difference between a frog and a switch.