http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=6&t=507483&page=63
Halfway down the page.
This is getting scary folks!
Halfway down the page.
This is getting scary folks!
Malfunction double = machine gun = jail time!
- Thread starter Tempest
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Been scary for a long time , some people are just starting to wake up.
It's nice to see they are ready when the Klingons, Romulans and the Borg invade.
But since all those species have interstellar spacecraft and superior weapons, I think you'd best spend your time learning how to negotiate!
Just a thought there.
But since all those species have interstellar spacecraft and superior weapons, I think you'd best spend your time learning how to negotiate!
Just a thought there.
ATF can own you without thinking twice.
Originally Posted By: Mucho_MPG
ATF can own you without thinking twice.
And that is exactly why our founding father's gave us the right to bear arms. Any and all arms.
They must be rolling over in their graves as the constitution gets put through a paper shredder...
Your vote matters folks, especially the upcoming presidential election.
ATF can own you without thinking twice.
And that is exactly why our founding father's gave us the right to bear arms. Any and all arms.
They must be rolling over in their graves as the constitution gets put through a paper shredder...
Your vote matters folks, especially the upcoming presidential election.
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
Originally Posted By: Mucho_MPG
ATF can own you without thinking twice.
And that is exactly why our founding father's gave us the right to bear arms. Any and all arms.
They must be rolling over in their graves as the constitution gets put through a paper shredder...
Your vote matters folks, especially the upcoming presidential election.
Do you really think Americans should have unlimited access to Arms/Weapons?
Originally Posted By: Mucho_MPG
ATF can own you without thinking twice.
And that is exactly why our founding father's gave us the right to bear arms. Any and all arms.
They must be rolling over in their graves as the constitution gets put through a paper shredder...
Your vote matters folks, especially the upcoming presidential election.
Do you really think Americans should have unlimited access to Arms/Weapons?
To arms suited to self defense, yes.
Yes - the constitution says we do. It's one of the tenants of what is the United States, and it's one of the tenants that gives us freedom - what little we still have.
The US constitution's right to bear arms has a lot more to do with the citizenry's ability to stop government power then it does with blowing away some creep entering your home. Granted, at the time the constitution was written, arms were what they were...
But the premise stands.
What happened to the guy eluded to in this thread is total manure.
The US constitution's right to bear arms has a lot more to do with the citizenry's ability to stop government power then it does with blowing away some creep entering your home. Granted, at the time the constitution was written, arms were what they were...
But the premise stands.
What happened to the guy eluded to in this thread is total manure.
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Below is from a previous post. If you go sticking M16 parts into your AR15 you are on risky ground.
Quote: Originally Posted by shark92651: I don't think there is more here than meets the eye. This was a 20 year old Olympic Arms AR-15 that came from the factory with a three position selector and an M-16 trigger group, although those are not the parts that make it FA.
Actually not. By the serial number, the firearm was manufactured some time in 1990. At that time, Oly was not using M16 parts in their guns. Someone, maybe the defendant, stated that worn parts were replaced by DPMS parts. It is possible that they were replaced with DPMS tri-burst parts (this is indicated in a thread on another forum which included scans of court documents etc). Those replacement parts kits were easy to find at gun shows in the early 90s. The question is, who replaced the parts? The defendant? The kid who borrowed the gun? The feds?
Waitaminute, from the docs posted on the thread on AR15, it sounds like the gun in question did have a three-position selector switch and a modified bolt? Even if it wasn't a complete conversion to an MG, if he has put even some "evil" parts into it, he's right on the line (maybe over the line) and really asking for trouble, and is not a blameless guy with a malfunctioning factory-parts gun.
I think MGs should be legal (I'm hoping we can start unwinding 922o after Heller) but if he has modified and evil parts in his gun, it's asking for big trouble.
I hope he is pardoned, of course. It's insane that even one minute of law enforcement resources are wasted worrying about selector switches. There's hardly a difference in the danger of a full-auto AR-15 and a semi-auto AR-15.
Quote: Originally Posted by shark92651: I don't think there is more here than meets the eye. This was a 20 year old Olympic Arms AR-15 that came from the factory with a three position selector and an M-16 trigger group, although those are not the parts that make it FA.
Actually not. By the serial number, the firearm was manufactured some time in 1990. At that time, Oly was not using M16 parts in their guns. Someone, maybe the defendant, stated that worn parts were replaced by DPMS parts. It is possible that they were replaced with DPMS tri-burst parts (this is indicated in a thread on another forum which included scans of court documents etc). Those replacement parts kits were easy to find at gun shows in the early 90s. The question is, who replaced the parts? The defendant? The kid who borrowed the gun? The feds?
Waitaminute, from the docs posted on the thread on AR15, it sounds like the gun in question did have a three-position selector switch and a modified bolt? Even if it wasn't a complete conversion to an MG, if he has put even some "evil" parts into it, he's right on the line (maybe over the line) and really asking for trouble, and is not a blameless guy with a malfunctioning factory-parts gun.
I think MGs should be legal (I'm hoping we can start unwinding 922o after Heller) but if he has modified and evil parts in his gun, it's asking for big trouble.
I hope he is pardoned, of course. It's insane that even one minute of law enforcement resources are wasted worrying about selector switches. There's hardly a difference in the danger of a full-auto AR-15 and a semi-auto AR-15.
Sorry, I started reading the link hoping to get the story 'in a nutshell' I'm not sure I succeeded! But, this is about a guy that lent a legal weapon to a buddy, buddy modified the gun to an illegal status and was caught using it at a firing range (am I right so far) Now is it the legal owner of the weapon that is 'on the hook' for owning an illegal weapon?
Quote;
The US constitution's right to bear arms has a lot more to do with the citizenry's ability to stop government power then it does with blowing away some creep entering your home. Granted, at the time the constitution was written, arms were what they were...
So, it seems the orriginal premise of the RTBA is just about redundant, in that it is not 'acceptable' for the citizenry to have access to the same weapons as the government. So now the RTBA is interpreted to a right to defend. and the only question is the limits of defence.
Sounds like a slippery slope!
Sorry if these sound like Dumb questions, I have spent half my life in Europe half in Canada. the whole RTBA is alien to me
Quote;
The US constitution's right to bear arms has a lot more to do with the citizenry's ability to stop government power then it does with blowing away some creep entering your home. Granted, at the time the constitution was written, arms were what they were...
So, it seems the orriginal premise of the RTBA is just about redundant, in that it is not 'acceptable' for the citizenry to have access to the same weapons as the government. So now the RTBA is interpreted to a right to defend. and the only question is the limits of defence.
Sounds like a slippery slope!
Sorry if these sound like Dumb questions, I have spent half my life in Europe half in Canada. the whole RTBA is alien to me
The link is below; same guy, same story.... guy purchased legal weapon a long time ago, evidently installed some questionable parts a long time ago and even if the parts didn't make it selective fire the parts are risky as they were from the full auto version, guy lends the weapon to someone, the weapon due to being worn and/dirty can go full auto unintentionally, attracts attention of the law.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=91446&page=5
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=91446&page=5
Sounds like someone pushing the limits of whats legal, and the Law pushing back.
I don't see much about how the weapon was being used. The guy was at a range, when the gun first went full auto did he stop using it and consider it a malfunctioning weapon in need of repair? Somehow I don't think so!
I don't see much about how the weapon was being used. The guy was at a range, when the gun first went full auto did he stop using it and consider it a malfunctioning weapon in need of repair? Somehow I don't think so!
1st, the guy is stupid for loaning a gun to someone he barely knows, and in reality anyone.
2nd, the kid was stupid for not packing up the rifle when it malfunctioned and appeared to be having fun with a slam firing gun...which is potentially very dangerous to the shooter bye the way.
BUT, he did not appear to charged with manufacturing a MG, and the rifle only doubled on soft primers. This means that the hammer was following and that the rifle did not have full auto parts. Tri burst parts would be very easy to tell. There was no auto sear, nor the modifications to the receiver to accept one. This is all very bogus and the ATF flexing their muscle. I really hope this goes away on appeal otherwise anyone shooting a semi-auto gun has the potential to go to jail for a malfunctioning weapon.
As far as rights and why they are important, check this out:
http://transsylvaniaphoenix.blogspot.com/2008/05/british-called-they-want-their-guns.html
2nd, the kid was stupid for not packing up the rifle when it malfunctioned and appeared to be having fun with a slam firing gun...which is potentially very dangerous to the shooter bye the way.
BUT, he did not appear to charged with manufacturing a MG, and the rifle only doubled on soft primers. This means that the hammer was following and that the rifle did not have full auto parts. Tri burst parts would be very easy to tell. There was no auto sear, nor the modifications to the receiver to accept one. This is all very bogus and the ATF flexing their muscle. I really hope this goes away on appeal otherwise anyone shooting a semi-auto gun has the potential to go to jail for a malfunctioning weapon.
As far as rights and why they are important, check this out:
http://transsylvaniaphoenix.blogspot.com/2008/05/british-called-they-want-their-guns.html
Right to bear arms is based on the premise that government and citizens are the same people, all working for the same side. There is no fundamental difference between any citizen and a soldier, so both should be trusted with any kind of weapon... provided the really nasty ones are kept under similar levels of security.
"There is no fundamental difference between any citizen and a soldier, so both should be trusted with any kind of weapon..."
In garrison unless we were using them our weapons were secured in a battalion armory that had a 24/7 guard. Each weapon was issued by serial number, all weapons accounted for at the end of each exercise. We had plenty of 'machineguns' in our unit but the vast majority were trained as rifleman using semi-auto fire.
In garrison unless we were using them our weapons were secured in a battalion armory that had a 24/7 guard. Each weapon was issued by serial number, all weapons accounted for at the end of each exercise. We had plenty of 'machineguns' in our unit but the vast majority were trained as rifleman using semi-auto fire.
Originally Posted By: Tempest
This is all very bogus and the ATF flexing their muscle.
A perfect summation. I am literally frightened after reading that guy's story.
This is all very bogus and the ATF flexing their muscle.
A perfect summation. I am literally frightened after reading that guy's story.
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