Where can I find an oil chart with the most ZDDP?

Status
Not open for further replies.
A Mobil website FAQ lists all their Mobil 1 products and identifies those with higher ZDDP treat levels.
 
Another way to check for wear prevention is to see how the oils fare in the 4 Ball Wear test. Some companies like AMSOIL use lots of ZDDP and post their 4 Ball Wear tests to back it up.

When checking the results of the 4 Ball Wear test watch the parameters the test was run under. Clearly a wear scar run at 1,200 RPM for one hour with a load of 20 kilograms isn't as impressive as a wear scar result from the test being run at 1,800 RPM with a load of 40 kilograms. The larger the wear scar the worse the wear prevention. But if a smaller wear scar was run with less load, lower temperature and slower RPM you have to take that into consideration.

Hope this helps. Good luck with your motor oil search. I have a collection of vintage cars all with flat tappet cams. I know where you're coming from.
wink.gif
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: 02Lightning
I'm running a flat tappet cam car and need the most ZDDP in my oil. Thanks


1. According to SAE papers, you do NOT need Z*P greater than 1200 ppm (.12%), more can actually harm.
2. check out the article at http://systems-engineering-associates.com/paper under "avocations" You do NOT need to use additives. see the "right oil" paper. If you insist on buying the "wrong oil", then the "additive" paper will show how to get to the SAE 1200ppm.
 
Originally Posted By: 63Avanti
Originally Posted By: 02Lightning
I'm running a flat tappet cam car and need the most ZDDP in my oil. Thanks


1. According to SAE papers, you do NOT need Z*P greater than 1200 ppm (.12%), more can actually harm.
2. check out the article at http://systems-engineering-associates.com/paper under "avocations" You do NOT need to use additives. see the "right oil" paper. If you insist on buying the "wrong oil", then the "additive" paper will show how to get to the SAE 1200ppm.
Why does the mobil racing oils have 1600 ppm? other racing oils also have high amounts ,but then killer race only valve springs aren't kind to the valvetrain.So back to the beginning what are the spring pressures "open and closed".
 
I recall reading somewhere 1200 is ideal and more than 2000 starts to cause camshaft spalling in fresh engines because it began to attack the iron and allow the cam to pit under load.
 
"Race" engines have camshafts with more agressive lobe lift profiles on the cams PLUS much higher valve spring pressures (so they can turn much higher rpm levels, for extended periods, with these higher lift longer duration flat tappet camshafts they have to have to be competitive in their respective classes) to do what they do. Higher spring pressures, particularly, are a contributor to the pressure the cam lobe sees from the flat tappet valve lifter. Similar higher contact pressures also exist at the rocker arm pivots and interfaces with the pushrods and valve stems. Greater side loadings also exist on the valve guides from the sliding motion (of the rocker arm tip across the top of the valve stem as it forces the valve open and, to a lesser extent, as the valve closes) of the valve as it opens and closes. Plus, if any "harm" is to be done to the motor with the elevated ZDDP levels, the oil does NOT stay in the engine much past the particular race event . . . i.e., NOT 3000+ miles.

"Race" engines are a specific application per se, with might have a bearing on "street" or "hot rod" motors, but more remotely for "street" or "stock" motors which most of us have.

One article I saw mentioned that detergency additives can wipe out zddp levels, so the two need to be balanced. Seems like I saw that in a VW forum or on the LNEngineering website?

As always, oil base stocks, anti-wear additives, detergency additives, and other items in the total oil formulation are what usually is important rather than just looking at ONE aspect of the total combination . . . I suspect. Some generalizations might be made, but only ones which might work for one brand of oil and/or one viscosity rating of a particular brand of oil.

Just some thoughts,
CBODY67
 
Try Brad Penn Penn Grade 1 "The Green Oil" racing oil. It's supposed to have 1200 ppm of zinc and phosphorous for flat-tappet cams. Many racers swear by it. We run it in our 440.
 
Hi,
Chris71 - You said this;

"Try Brad Penn Penn Grade 1 "The Green Oil" racing oil. It's supposed to have 1200 ppm of zinc and phosphorous for flat-tappet cams. Many racers swear by it. We run it in our 440."

WOW - that's the same as M1 15w-50 (both versions) has!
 
Last edited:
No kidding, we run the Brad Penn Penn Grade 1 because it's a partial synthetic and dad gets it at about $40/case since he works at a Napa. We also run it because so many racers use it and so many engine builders recommend it.
 
The Brad Penn is what the green Kendall GT-1 was, a fairly highly regarded oil. I don't think it is anything magical and there is a lot of hype around it with all the ZDDP questions these days, but it is a fairly solid oil.

It's nice because you can get that ZDDP in a 30-weight...kind of like if you used a 10W-30 CI-4+ HDEO...
 
Last edited:
Brad Penn is an unusual oil. The regular off the shelf 30 wt. can be used in a daily driver but the Penn Grade 1 30 wt. is an engine break-in oil only. We run the Penn Grade 1 10w-30 for street use and the Penn Grade 1 40 wt. for runs down the strip.
 
I'd really just use a 10W-30 CI-4+, brand name HDEO if I was that worried about ZDDP content because that would make things far simpler. Rotella, Delo and Delvac are all good oils and in 10W-30 would all be suited for most of these high concern applications.
 
If you haven't clicked on this one yet, here is more on additives, as well as viscosity and myths
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top