Why some SP VOA's look anemic

[4WD]

Pfft... you don't know what you're talking about... Red Line 5W-30 might be the only oil in the world that simultaneously meets Dexos 1 and BMW LL01...

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...though it probably wouldn't be able to pass either...

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Uh-huh … Cheaper to get hydro-processed P66 …
I have white bottle RL in the stash - ain’t no Dexos …

 

[Deleted member 89374]

Uh-huh … Cheaper to get hydro-processed P66 …
I have white bottle RL in the stash - ain’t no Dexos …

Lol, I know, I was just making a joke.

 

[4WD]

Lol, I know, I was just making a joke.

Such a crapshoot that merger made out of redline - but, the euro that Buster posted looked kinda sexy …

 

[chris719]

My issue with this is, when in use in an engine that's not on a test stand, there's a lot of fuel entering the crankcase. the 4-5% we sometimes see in an oil analysis is only the tip of the iceberg as a lot of it evaporates quickly. This becomes part of the "base oil" for all intents and purposes, but is volatile and very prone to oxidation.

It's obviously good to have an oil that's stable, and I've always tried to go for those oils since learning the difference but I've seen what the move from A3/B4 to C3 oils did to gas engines, it's nasty. In the US the move has been more gradual and not combined with ultra long OCI so the change wasn't that abrupt or visible. In europe the change happened overnight almost. "Bulk tank is empty, we've ordered some *new* oil, guys".

I want the clean base oil with the high concentration add pack. And I'm happy to pay for it as winter season lasts too long for me to have 1 oci throughout. it was fine on my diesel, not on the turbo gdi.

What have you seen with the C3 oils in engines that you don't see with A3/B4? Varnish over time?

 

[Deleted member 89374]

What have you seen with the C3 oils in engines that you don't see with A3/B4? Varnish over time?

He may not realize that high calcium oils are like a magnet for fuel. It's another "old wife's tale" that somehow old-school A3/B4 oils are superior to modern formulations.

 

[kschachn]

Pfft... you don't know what you're talking about... Red Line 5W-30 might be the only oil in the world that simultaneously meets Dexos 1 and BMW LL01...

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But of course it doesn't actually say that. It doesn't even say it is suitable for, just recommended.

You know what recommended means, right? It means that out of everything we sell this is the one we recommend. It really says nothing of substance.

 

[kschachn]

He may not realize that high calcium oils are like a magnet for fuel. It's another "old wife's tale" that somehow old-school A3/B4 oils are superior to modern formulations.

A magnet? How does that work?

 

[chris719]

He may not realize that high calcium oils are like a magnet for fuel. It's another "old wife's tale" that somehow old-school A3/B4 oils are superior to modern formulations.

So, let’s say you have no GPF and a DI engine that can run either C3 or A3/B4. If you had to choose between M1 0w-40 FS and ESP X3, what are you picking?

 

[Deleted member 89374]

So, let’s say you have no GPF and a DI engine that can run either C3 or A3/B4. If you had to choose between M1 0w-40 FS and ESP X3, what are you picking?

I have a GDI engine and it doesn't particularly like A3/B4 oils. ESP X3 for sure... however, I will most likely stick to HPL PCMO PP 5W-30 in it. Or M1 EP 5W-30. Normal ILSAC API SP oils run just fine in this engine. A3/B4... it likes to drink them... slowly.

A magnet? How does that work?

 

[kschachn]

All right. I thought maybe you knew of some sort of affinity for fuel.

 

[Jetronic]

What have you seen with the C3 oils in engines that you don't see with A3/B4? Varnish over time?

varnish is how it starts but the oil turns to a frotty mess. the varnish is there at the time of the first oil change (at 10k miles if you're lucky, 20k or more if not). I don't expect these oils to keep engines anywhere clean if used for more than 5k in the use case of my old customers.

 

[Jetronic]

He may not realize that high calcium oils are like a magnet for fuel. It's another "old wife's tale" that somehow old-school A3/B4 oils are superior to modern formulations.

on the other hand, my diesel engines loved the high calcium oils

 

[Deleted member 89374]

All right. I thought maybe you knew of some sort of affinity for fuel.

A little bit of humor maybe?

Anyway...

Gasoline that's not properly atomized is absorbed faster by a high calcium motor oil. Somehow, I believe that you already knew that...

 

[Scuder]

A magnet? How does that work?

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Donnie thinks it's vacuum.

 

[chris719]

A little bit of humor maybe?

Anyway...

Gasoline that's not properly atomized is absorbed faster by a high calcium motor oil. Somehow, I believe that you already knew that...

Is it really statistically significant? Even if there is 3000 ppm of calcium, that's still a tiny fraction of the volume of the oil.

 

[OVERKILL]

He may not realize that high calcium oils are like a magnet for fuel. It's another "old wife's tale" that somehow old-school A3/B4 oils are superior to modern formulations.

The A3/B4 oils are becoming reduced calcium, increased magnesium now, but still much heavier on the DI package than their low/mid-SAPS counterparts. I'm definitely of the opinion that these unconstrained formulations (no limit on phosphorous for example) give the blender the opportunity to produce a superior product, heck that was the logic behind the Super Car 0W-20.