Why not return?

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Jul 19, 2004
Long Island/New York
Why doesn't Castrol return to their old formula and make Syntec the same way Mobil-1 is.I know cost is the big factor but if you(Castrol)know that a PAO/Ester based oil is better than a Group-III hydrcracked oil wouldn't you want a oil that is just as good if not better than you competitors.If Castrol is reading this post(I hope)they would benefit from these posts.Thanks Joe

Given the intended application of the product, can you explain why PAO/Ester based oil is better than severely hydrocracked Group III? Remember, given the intended application...
In average climate and use how superior is Mobil 1 to a well formulated Grp III ? What performance aspects of PAO justify its cost?
Extended drains? How far are we running on average now?

Cold weather? (The admittadly superior argument).
Hot weather?
What about PAO's molecular structure makes it superior in automotive lubricants?

Justify the cost with performance rather than image.
Cost & high sales/profits are the reasons. I'm sure it would be difficult for any company to suddenly swap cheaper oil base for more expensive oil base - then sell it for the same price.

Plus many folks buying American Castrol synthetic oils do not know the group-III/group IV/group V base oil differences. So in essence, they think all the different oil manufacturers selling products for roughly the same money - must have the same product/quality. Basically, those folks are uneducated in motor oils.

I know I felt that way until coming to this BITOG site. Now when I spend $5 for a quart of synthetic, I look for the higher group oils first == not because I think they are better -- but only so I don't feel I am being short-changed in quality.
Is it me or is there a grey area in finding base oil components in an MSDS sheet? Sometimes the %'s just don't equal 100. So then do we really know what were buying??

Is it really just base oils that lubricant providers are selling to the uneducated? How about effective additive chemistry, perhaps some un-noted ester content, and a total package that's able to take just about what ever bizzare conditions the consumer throws at it in what, 3-5-7.5-10K miles? I haven't a clue really, but even if I had the resources and knowledge to make my own lube....

In some ways, business is just business - you take what you can get unless you have/need the proof to be able to demand more. Aside from API standard testing, I don't think any consumer is ever really going to see that comprehendable proof that justifies the cost. So with that being said, move to the next product that seems to have a better price point of one's liking. I have my indicisions, but at least API testing is there to give me some piece of mind.
PAO = Better cold pump, cold crank, more turbulent flow, better high temp oxidation resistance. Seeing how syntec is close in price to M1 why pay more or the same for an inferrior product. Nothing like buying for gold but getting lead instead. Lead and Gold are more simalar then GV and GIII base oils. Their is only one molacue difference between gold and lead hence the reason they share so many properties. If I am paying for synthetic I want a synthetic not something simalar to a synthetic.
In the US, Castrol probably won't change unless
Pennzoil Platinum and M1 in ever growing flavors takes market share from Castrol.
Here we go again. You drive 5000 miles and syntec 5w30 will protect just the same as mobil1. As a matter of fact motorcraft syn blend will protect exactly the same as the 2 full syns. CAN WE GET PAST THIS EVER?
Unfortunately they will never get over it. They still believe Mobil 1 is all PAO. I don't know where these people buy oil at, but where I shop I get Syntec for $5 cheaper per 5qt. jug then the Mobil 1. I see it as buying a superior add pack by buying the Castrol.

"Cost & high sales/profits are the reasons. I'm sure it would be difficult for any company to suddenly swap cheaper oil base for more expensive oil base - then sell it for the same price."
Agreed to a point. Has anyone noticed the price of Syntec vs. M1 lately though? Considering that at K-Mart, Syntec is over a dollar more per quart than M1, and again higher in 5 quart jugs at WM, and you can get the fabled GC at AZ for the same price as any other Syntec. From Terry @ Dyson lab:" ZOil is primarily a PAO based lubricant. Nothing but Grp4 and higher components. We are currently attempting to break out and ID the complex and unique esters used in the formula. More later" Ladies and Gents, Syntec could be, and should be a Grp4 oil for it's price point.
MC5w20, where are you getting Syntec for $5 less than M1.
Here in California - Mobil 1 goes for 5.59/quart whereas Castrol Syntec goes for 5.19/quart or less. I think it is even better at wal-mart (castrol for less). I'll grab the prices when I go there again.
At walmart 5 quart containers of Syntec go for $20.xx. The Mobil 1 5 quart containers go for $25.xx. I remember 6 months ago the price spread was only a dollar on the five quart containers.

5 quarts of Motorcraft Semi-syn run me $9.xx. So I am currently not running full syn right now, nor in the last year. Unless the price gap closes I plan to run the semi-syn.
Thanks. Your prices out west are flipped from ours here. The MC has just shown up in the last couple of months; same price as you. M1 local here is 20.57 for the 5 quart jug (including the new 5-30 T&SUV.. yummy!) but the Castrol has a higher price point; 24 and change, same as Valvo Maxlife Syn. The best value here is still the P66 syn blend @ 1.48 per, and there are still local AZ's with Syntec @ 4.99 posted on the shelves, and a boatload of Syntec boxes sitting around. I can even find the elusive GC local ( about 50 quarts or so). I just don't see Castrol having the passionate following here in the Midwest that there is out west. Maybe there is a stronger following of FunkMaster in the western states? FunkMaster Flex
Out here where we have 60F for winter... synthetic isn't as important for us as it is for you guys that get -20F.

Although, when it gets 114F+ out here in the Californian desert... Synthetic has got to help.
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