Whining noise with RPM first start of some days

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325
Location
Ontario, Canada
2001 RX300 with 280k km. 1MZ-FE engine. Drained and filled steering reservoir with Mobil 1 ATF. Drained and filled ATF every 20-30km interval Transfer case + rear diff changed Redline 75W90 at 210k km. Sometimes when starting the car after sitting for a long while, there is this almost supercharger type whining noise around 1500rpm and increases with RPM until around 3000rpm where the engine noise drowns it out a bit. However, afterwards, if you start and drive the car all day later, you don't hear the whining noise anymore and it doesn't happen every single day. I traced the noise to be by the airbox and looks to be where the starter is or under it. I can hear the whining noise with a screwdriver placed on the starter. Putting car in R makes the noise louder, but after I turn off the engine and wait a few minutes to turn it back on. The noise is gone. I found this thread with the same sound, which the OP says it's tranny issue and like the OP, I changed ATF regularly, it's never brown or anything and always replaced with Type-IV. One thing I haven't done is take the pan off to clean the magnets and replace the filter(I believe OEM is metal filter). https://www.clublexus.com/forums/rx...aling-whistling-noise-2.html#post9592490 Could it be due to motor/transmission mounts? If shifting in different gears and all can have an effect on the noise, the powertrain does shift into a different position depending on P/R/D gears?
 
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1,793
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TX, USA
If you suspect the mounts are bad, you need to inspect it? or have somebody inspect it? If that is not the issue, then it may be internal to the transmission. I know it is probably not a DIY so you need to bring it to a good mechanics who know about Toyota Transmission.
 
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wing0

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Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by The_Nuke
Record the sound, upload to YouTube, paste in a link
Go to the clublexus link in my original post, there are 3 youtube videos by the other poster and it sounds just like that. Whining noise. I did a bit more research on general toyota transmission and a clogged transmission filter could cause whining. Since the filter has never been changed, I'm going to order one and change it.
 
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Joplin
I will be interested to hear if the filter change works for you. Please report back in on what you learn after the change.
 

wing0

Thread starter
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325
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Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by ragtoplvr
a failing alternator can whine. failing battery or a intermittent drain, a hard charging alternator will also make a noise. Rod
The noise is coming from the other side of the engine, not where the serpentine belt or alternator is. I did put a screwdriver on the alternator to listen. I also disconnected the negative plug on alternator for a sec and the noise remains (I saw somebody with bad diode in Toyota alternator use this method to test).
 
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10,902
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Cincinnati, OH, USA
Starter hanging up, not releasing after the engine starts, I bet-when it warms up, it stops sticking. Might just be dirty, cleaning might fix? Hope it's not under the intake manifold (like someToyotas)!
 

wing0

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Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by bullwinkle
Starter hanging up, not releasing after the engine starts, I bet-when it warms up, it stops sticking. Might just be dirty, cleaning might fix? Hope it's not under the intake manifold (like someToyotas)!
Thanks for your input. I was thinking if it could be the starter as well, but I cannot find good sources of complaints that the starter makes whining noise, while people said they experienced whining noise from transmission especially before filter change. So I am only able to put the screwdriver onto the starter housing and hear the whining noise. It happens usually the first start after sitting for 12+hrs and it persists for at least 10+ mins of driving or last time I let it idle for about 5 minutes and shutoff. The 2nd start after doesn't seem to have the whining noise anymore. I will have to test this theory further. The starter is at the same level as the intake filter box so I probably need to remove all of that before I can get access to the starter. How should I test if the starter is sticking? I know there's a gear inside that pushes out when first starting the car, are you saying it doesn't retract properly and the engine is driving the starter? How can I clean it? brake cleaner? The starter is bolted on top of the transmission so right now I need to isolate which one is producing the noise.
 

Kokopelli34179

Site Donor 2021
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62
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New Mexico
Sounds like starter motor still spinning. It could be the solenoid not disengaging. I had '02 Jetta that made a squawking noise after cranking. It didn't do it all the time. It ended up being the starter.
 
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wing0

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Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by Kokopelli34179
Sounds like starter motor still spinning. It could be the solenoid not disengaging. I had '02 Jetta that made a squawking noise after cranking. It didn't do it all the time. It ended up being the starter.
The car is back at home so I have a chance to take a look. I would say, I can still hear the whining noise, it's less intrusive in the cabin after whole car is all warmed up. It's not completely gone. I put screwdriver on the starter again and while the car is idling. I can hear this bearing noise? I'm not sure if the sound is transferred from the motor onto the starter. It's very hard to distinguish where the whining sound is coming from, once I try to use the throttle cable to rev the engine up, the engine noise just over powers the whining on the ear that I don't have on the screwdriver. From more reading, if the gear solenoid does not disengage on the starter, the starter would overheat since it's not meant to be always spinning. What sound should I hear if I tap the starter while the car is idling. Should it be almost silent internally?
 

wing0

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Ontario, Canada
Solved for now

I got a stethoscope and listened in on both starter and transmission under. The noise is more prominent from the transmission housing.
Ordered an ATF filter and got some more Type IV fluid. I have a hunch that it's the filter not passing fluid.

It's been very hot here so kept delaying the actual work until one day I got a chance to drive it and it would take like 3 seconds before it would change from R to D backing out of garage. The whining noise was also louder and started to not shift into 4th gear.

Drain fluid and took pan down, both magnets are completely wrapped with shavings with some spikes appearing too.
ATF filter(supposed to be metal mesh, but they changed it to paper filter some time in 2001 and I guess I got the "later" batch of car model) was plugged since it has never been changed for 260k+ km.

Put back everything and no more whining, shifts are back to normal. If the car lasts another 100k, I'll drop the pan again and replace the filter as the paper filter probably catches more stuff than the old metal mesh style.
 

wing0

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Ontario, Canada
Those shavings worry me, in over 400,000 miles on my old Sienna I have only seen a small amount of shavings on the magnets.

True, but there is not much else I can do other than change fluid and filter then hope for the best.
Definitely with the whining noise and filter probably somewhat plugged did not help with the longevity of the transmission, but now that I know it's the paper filter.
I'll just do the filter change earlier and probably closer to Spring or Fall time frame.

I could try and put maxlife in there, but it's been running ok on Type IV for the life the car so far.
 
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12,371
Location
OH
True, but there is not much else I can do other than change fluid and filter then hope for the best.
Definitely with the whining noise and filter probably somewhat plugged did not help with the longevity of the transmission, but now that I know it's the paper filter.
I'll just do the filter change earlier and probably closer to Spring or Fall time frame.

I could try and put maxlife in there, but it's been running ok on Type IV for the life the car so far.
I would stay with the thicker T IV. Only thing I would think about adding to it is some Lubegard Red.
 
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17,540
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Upper Midwest
How many times and at what mileage has the pan been dropped?
I'd have to look back at my spreadsheet, but I usually drop the pan every second time and generally cooler line flush the fluid every 50,000 to 60,000 miles give or take. And mine does have the metal mesh screen so it is less prone to plugging up. I also use a synthetic fluid and my old van has a separate cooler because of the towing package.

So yes his is a different situation with the much longer interval.
 

wing0

Thread starter
Messages
325
Location
Ontario, Canada
I'd have to look back at my spreadsheet, but I usually drop the pan every second time and generally cooler line flush the fluid every 50,000 to 60,000 miles give or take. And mine does have the metal mesh screen so it is less prone to plugging up. I also use a synthetic fluid and my old van has a separate cooler because of the towing package.

So yes his is a different situation with the much longer interval.

Thanks for the info, you have dropped the pans many more times and the cooler line method would replace a lot more fluid.
I've only been doing drain and fill throughout the life of the car so far.
Hopefully car can last another 100k km, which by then would be like 25 years old.
 
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