Which 7317 Fram ( or other sized filter ) for a 2.0 Honda commuter?

[Fair enough]

I know the PG headquarters are in Memphis TN and they also have offices is Massachusetts. Not sure if any North American manufacturing exists for oil filters. My guess is Interfil may have something south of the border.

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I guess north America includes Mexico in some definitions. South America doesn’t start at the USA southern border, at least I never thought of it like that. Those Champion by Federal Mogul filters were nice I thought, but never used one. I think if PG was going to make in USA they would say it, but never know.

 

[dlundblad]

At first we thought it was just the Endurance. Now we have c&p’s show all models with the leak.

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I don’t think a visual test without pressure is an accurate assessment. While in use, that leaf spring could very well be seated into place. Also filters go into bypass more often than we think and thus “leak.”

Also, some designs (WIX style ADBV/ bypass combo for example) constantly “leak” as it is part of their normal function.

 

[Glenda W.]

I don’t think a visual test without pressure is an accurate assessment. While in use, that leaf spring could very well be seated into place. Also filters go into bypass more often than we think and thus “leak.”

Also, some designs (WIX style ADBV/ bypass combo for example) constantly “leak” as it is part of their normal function.

Here’s a link to my intact inspection mega thread. Without an official iso test on a known leaker we’ll never know for sure. I’ve always said I’m not comfortable with it, others aren’t bothered by the leak. Myself and other testers have applied extreme pressure to the leaf spring outside the canister and were unable to get a seal. The leaf spring also still leaked during my thermal expansion test of over 200 degrees. I also had some c&p’s with well formed leaf springs that sealed perfectly. The more recent poor quality stamping seems to be the culprit.

Thread 'Fram Endurance Flashlight Test in canister'

Sep 4, 2024

Tested on a new Fram Endurance FE7317 purchased at Walmart.

The question was “Does the Fram Endrance still have a gap in the bypass spring while under pressure?”

The answer is yes on this one. Also has a gap outside of the canister as Whip City and Sayjac have already found. I also carefully put some drops of oil on the gap areas to check every 10 minutes. It only took seconds for the oil to leak through with gravity.

• Glenda W.
• Replies: 1,162
• Forum: Engine Oil Filters

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[dlundblad]

@Sayjac, I recall in a not so distant past when the tearing Purolator filters weren’t an issue to you.

 

[ZeeOSix]

^^^ I don't think Sayjac was OK with tearing media.

 

[Sayjac]

@Sayjac, I recall in a not so distant past when the tearing Purolator filters weren’t an issue to you.

That would be a misleading if not inaccurate statement.

Accurately, though 'I' personally never had a tear in the Puro PL/L14610 series filters (and I used many), during the Puro tear spate I completely stopped buying/using them. I switched to (Wix)Napa Gold (5)7356 (classic wix construction) series filters that instead. I would purchase at my local Napa semi-annual 40% off Gold sale (~$4). I used many of them until my local Napa stopped having the sale and by then M&H had just started making changes to Wix filters. If confirmation required a search of bitog for the Napa Gold 7356 (and some others) show the multiple c&p done of that application during that time frame.

'More recently', I gradually waded back in to Puro US made filters in the form of the US made Bosch Premium 3323 purchased from RA for an excellent price. I've c&p all them here and all have been excellent. Also tried several US Puro PL/L series that I've occasionally caught on sale at Amazon. Like the 3323 all c&p and all have been excellent, no tears. In fact, I have an L14610 just cut and will be c&p soon. So, while I personally never had an anecdotal tear issue, it's clear from switching filters that I wasn't ok with tears and took the Puro 'tear issues' seriously as not ok. Now, that is the complete picture of my media tear(s) thoughts and experience.

I assume the call out is because of the reaction left at the bottom to your post. One reason for it was because best information posted on the sub forum over many years says "bypass events" are rare and of short duration when they do occur. So, 'I' wouldn't compare that to what's being seen with oil bypass openings in the FE and other Champ Labs made filters. Also, the Wix design 'combo valve' statement 'imo' not really applicable to what is being seen with Champ Labs with separate bypass seal areas. Further, unlike the current issue which with many flashlight tests of multiple Champ Labs filters with metal-to-metal seal areas, 'I can't recall' that the Wix combo valve oil bypass was a proven phenomenon. Just remember seeing statements to that effect. If it was proven true, like the FE, for me another reason not to use a (wix) combo valve filter.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Also, some designs (WIX style ADBV/ bypass combo for example) constantly “leak” as it is part of their normal function.

I don't think any engineer designing a full flow oil filter purposely designs them to "constantly leak". Why would they?

 

[Brybo86]

Premium Guard 4612EX from Rock Auto. Buy like 6-12 of them. $4.71 each plus whatever for shipping.

I'd also look at doing like 5k changes and maybe get a couple UOA's so you know where you are with whichever oil you choose. You can go up or down from there. If mostly highway it gets to temperature so should minimize fuel dilution concerns. I'd also just keep a book for your changes (and or reset trip B) so you know. Many things and messages are tied to the MM resets and might change some other things if you reset the oil one early. I just wait until it gets to 10-15% in my Honda's and reset it then. Oil changed at different schedule based on UOA's of those vehicles in their usage conditions.

Is that the same as the Pentius PLXL7317?

 

[dlundblad]

I don't think any engineer designing a full flow oil filter purposely designs them to "constantly leak". Why would they?

I remember the Fram rep we had here said this design leaked pretty bad.

I wouldn’t call it a full flow leak. That was your wording. (I assume you knew this was an internal leak with the bypass. Not leaking out at the case or o ring.)

 

[dlundblad]

That would be a misleading if not inaccurate statement.

Accurately, though 'I' personally never had a tear in the Puro PL/L14610 series filters (and I used many), during the Puro tear spate I completely stopped buying/using them. I switched to (Wix)Napa Gold (5)7356 (classic wix construction) series filters that instead. I would purchase at my local Napa semi-annual 40% off Gold sale (~$4). I used many of them until my local Napa stopped having the sale and by then M&H had just started making changes to Wix filters. If confirmation required a search of bitog for the Napa Gold 7356 (and some others) show the multiple c&p done of that application during that time frame.

'More recently', I gradually waded back in to Puro US made filters in the form of the US made Bosch Premium 3323 purchased from RA for an excellent price. I've c&p all them here and all have been excellent. Also tried several US Puro PL/L series that I've occasionally caught on sale at Amazon. Like the 3323 all c&p and all have been excellent, no tears. In fact, I have an L14610 just cut and will be c&p soon. So, while I personally never had an anecdotal tear issue, it's clear from switching filters that I wasn't ok with tears and took the Puro 'tear issues' seriously as not ok. Now, that is the complete picture of my media tear(s) thoughts and experience.

I assume the call out is because of the reaction left at the bottom to your post. One reason for it was because best information posted on the sub forum over many years says "bypass events" are rare and of short duration when they do occur. So, 'I' wouldn't compare that to what's being seen with oil bypass openings in the FE and other Champ Labs made filters. Also, the Wix design 'combo valve' statement 'imo' not really applicable to what is being seen with Champ Labs with separate bypass seal areas. Further, unlike the current issue which with many flashlight tests of multiple Champ Labs filters with metal-to-metal seal areas, 'I can't recall' that the Wix combo valve oil bypass was a proven phenomenon. Just remember seeing statements to that effect. If it was proven true, like the FE, for me another reason not to use a (wix) combo valve filter.

I guess with all that being said, a bypass situation being rare is something I have not heard of.

 

[ZeeOSix]

I remember the Fram rep we had here said this design leaked pretty bad.

Specifically which design?

I wouldn’t call it a full flow leak. That was your wording. (I assume you knew this was an internal leak with the bypass. Not leaking out at the case or o ring.)

You used the words: "constantly “leak” as it is part of their normal function." Like said, no full flow oil filter is intentionally designed to "constantly leak" as part of its normal function. A spin-on oil filter is a "full flow" filter, meaning it's suppose to filter all the flow (the full flow) going to the oiling system.

 

[ZeeOSix]

I guess with all that being said, a bypass situation being rare is something I have not heard of.

They only bypass in certain conditions, and yes it's not very often. On vehicle tests by members here have proven that.

 

[dlundblad]

Specifically which design?


You used the words: "constantly “leak” as it is part of their normal function." Like said, no full flow oil filter is intentionally designed to "constantly leak" as part of its normal function. A spin-on oil filter is a "full flow" filter, meaning it's suppose to filter all the flow (the full flow) going to the oiling system.

In my OP, I specified the wix bypass combo design.

Asking what’s already been answered as well as word manipulation… seems this conversation is getting lost in the weeds.

 

[ZeeOSix]

In my OP, I specified the wix bypass combo design.

Asking what’s already been answered as well as word manipulation… seems this conversation is getting lost in the weeds.

The bottom line is no full flow oil filter is suppose to be designed to "continuously leak" as part of their normal function. Not sure you really know what a "combo valve" is.

 

[DannyM]

Is that the same as the Pentius PLXL7317?

No.. The Pentius XL is a different company out of Korea and it is taller like the 7317 size. The Premium Guard is made in Vietnam and/or China and the 4612 is the short filter like a 6607 size. For some reason Premium Guard doesn't make a 7317 size in their extended line with their own brand name on it but they do make a regular basic version that is 7317 size which is PG4610.

 

[dlundblad]

The bottom line is no full flow oil filter is suppose to be designed to "continuously leak" as part of their normal function. Not sure you really know what a "combo valve" is.

The bypass and ADBV is integrated hence the combo in the name. The filter is/ was made by WIX. This design leaks during normal use.

I bought one to cut and post here, but never used one.

 

[ZeeOSix]

The bypass and ADBV is integrated hence the combo in the name. The filter is/ was made by WIX. This design leaks during normal use.

Where's the proof and test data showing the combo valve had a constant leak path? Frankly, that's the first time I've ever heard anyone make this claim specifically to a combo valve.

 

[Brybo86]

No.. The Pentius XL is a different company out of Korea and it is taller like the 7317 size. The Premium Guard is made in Vietnam and/or China and the 4612 is the short filter like a 6607 size. For some reason Premium Guard doesn't make a 7317 size in their extended line with their own brand name on it but they do make a regular basic version that is 7317 size which is PG4610.

I thought the Pentius was made in Vietnam and China also?
Most threads say they are the same as premium guard and microgard select

M

Thread 'Edit: OOS but allowing backorders. 12 pack of Pentius PLXL6607 filters for $19. Sold and shipped by Amazon'

Sep 24, 2024

Not sure how long this price will last. Only 5 packs left (edit: 20 minutes later only 1 pack left). These look to be very similar to the Microgard Select. Pentius claims 99% at 20 microns.

If I owned a vehicle that used this size, y’all wouldn’t know about this deal. So, consider yourself lucky.

Edit: Fixed the link
Pentius PLXL6607-12PK Spin-On Oil Filter (Extented Life Line), 12 Pack

• mitsuman47
• Replies: 14
• Forum: Product Rebates, Sales and Promotions

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[ZeeOSix]

I thought the Pentius was made in Vietnam and China also?

The linked Amazon page says they are made in Korea. Not sure if all Pentius models are, but at least that one is.

 

[dlundblad]

Where's the proof and test data showing the combo valve had a constant leak path? Frankly, that's the first time I've ever heard anyone make this claim specifically to a combo valve.

Once again, I mentioned that the Fram rep we had here said this. Do you read anything?

Since personal insults are now flying, I don’t think you know your head from a hole in the ground.