When is it time to change powersteering fluid

I had a car that turned it's factory fill Type F ATF power steering fluid into burnt-smelling, cola-looking fluid in 60K.

On the other hand, my 1998 Nissan Frontier with 90K, the power steering fluid (ATF of some kind, manual says Dexron III) still looks pink/red on a paper towel and smells OK.
 
There are some really odd ones out there. I think most specify ATF or some generic PS fluid (GM had a spec). Honda always had their proprietary mineral oil based fluid. For my Subaru, I asked at the dealer and they said that Subaru spec'ed any of their newer ATFs even though the reservoir said Dexron III . But the factory fluid was some brown stuff that clearly wasn't ATF.
 
I do a power steering "drain and fill" every time I do a transmission "drain and fill", usually every year.
Same on my manual transmission cars except I can't use the same fluid/oil as in the gearboxes...making it happen less often, maybe every 18 months or so.
 
more worry on brake fluid than this (hydrostatic? correct word? hydrotropic?). Many PS uses ATF now. Sure,
nearing 100K if not done yet, I'd doa clean out...
 
I've done the factory Honda method before. It's painful to do not because it's hard, but because of all the noise it makes where it seems like it's going to blow up. But it's easy and not all that messy with a little bit of work. I had a shop do it once and it wasn't expensive (less than 10 minutes labor) but I was told they don't really like doing it.

Just remove the fluid return hose and route it to a collection container. Run it and turn the steering wheel lock to lock until it can't do it any more. Then put everything back in place and fill up the fluid slowly. It's not too bad as air is purged rather quickly. I think it might have taken three top offs and it was at the top level. But that noise just doesn't sound right.
I basically do what you do; there isn't that much fluid in the system, but I don't like taking a bath in any kind of oil. I suck out as much as I can with a veterinary syringe with a small diameter clear tube attached so I can reach down into the pump. Suck out as much as I can get. Then jack the car up & support it, then turn the steering wheel lock to lock WITH THE ENGINE OFF 20 or more times until I can actually get no more fluid out. THEN disconnect the return hose and put a vacuum plug into the bottom of the reservoir. Point the return hose into a container and fill the reservoir with new clean fluid.
At this point in time, I ask my wife to get in the car, DO NOT START THE CAR, just turn the wheels lock to lock until I holler that I've got new fluid coming out the return hose. The "return" hose on my car is ~8 feet long, I think the factory calls it a "power steering cooler" since it goes up behind the radiator, makes a square "loop" then goes back to the pump. This long hose holds quite a bit of fluid. The "exchange" is now complete. Remove the vacuum plug from the reservoir, shove the return hose back on & clamp it, refill the reservoir and again turn the wheels lock to lock 40-50 times until it is completely quiet. Front wheels are still in the air so there is no "load" on the PS system.
Finally, I start the car, and continue turning the wheels lock to lock until it is for sure quiet. Let the car down off the jacks and go for a drive. Steering should be totally quiet and smooth as butter.
I know all this sounds tedious, but it actually doesn't take too long at all. I'm good for a few years and I'm probably WAY TOO OCD, but my vehicles are pushing 200K and steer as good as my daughter's car with 15K on it.
 
I basically do what you do; there isn't that much fluid in the system, but I don't like taking a bath in any kind of oil. I suck out as much as I can with a veterinary syringe with a small diameter clear tube attached so I can reach down into the pump. Suck out as much as I can get. Then jack the car up & support it, then turn the steering wheel lock to lock WITH THE ENGINE OFF 20 or more times until I can actually get no more fluid out. THEN disconnect the return hose and put a vacuum plug into the bottom of the reservoir. Point the return hose into a container and fill the reservoir with new clean fluid.
At this point in time, I ask my wife to get in the car, DO NOT START THE CAR, just turn the wheels lock to lock until I holler that I've got new fluid coming out the return hose. The "return" hose on my car is ~8 feet long, I think the factory calls it a "power steering cooler" since it goes up behind the radiator, makes a square "loop" then goes back to the pump. This long hose holds quite a bit of fluid. The "exchange" is now complete. Remove the vacuum plug from the reservoir, shove the return hose back on & clamp it, refill the reservoir and again turn the wheels lock to lock 40-50 times until it is completely quiet. Front wheels are still in the air so there is no "load" on the PS system.
Finally, I start the car, and continue turning the wheels lock to lock until it is for sure quiet. Let the car down off the jacks and go for a drive. Steering should be totally quiet and smooth as butter.
I know all this sounds tedious, but it actually doesn't take too long at all. I'm good for a few years and I'm probably WAY TOO OCD, but my vehicles are pushing 200K and steer as good as my daughter's car with 15K on it.

I don't know about jacking it up or doing anything extreme other than allowing as much fluid as possible to be removed. I was looking at the fluid, and it doesn't really come out the return hose at high pressure, at least not in Honda PS systems. I wouldn't do what I see in this from afactory service manual, but I just took an old motor oil bottle and lightly taped it to reduce some of the splash, then find a good place to wedge it so it doesn't fall. I had a 1995 Integra GS-R and my wife's 2002 Civic, and they don't have a cover per se, but otherwise it's pretty similar. Still not sure why they show an open collection container, and I'm sure that one isn't going to just magically float in the air.

I'm not sure what model this comes from.

5BOut.png
 
I truly forgot where I got this, I use either Amsoil PS fluid or Lubegard PS fluid ~30-50K, whenever it starts NOT looking amber....GM's Recommended PS Bleeding Procedure;
1) Ignition switch off.
2) Turn steering wheel full left.
3) Fill fluid reservoir to Full Cold level. Leave cap off.
4} Raise front wheels off ground.
5) With assistant checking fluid level and condition, turn steering wheel lock to lock at least 20 times. Engine remains off.
a) On systems with tong return lines or fluid coolers, turn steering wheel lock to lock at least 40 times.
b) Trapped air may cause fluid to overflow. Thoroughly clean any spilled fluid to allow for leak check.
c) Keep fluid level at Full Cold.
6} While turning wheel, check fluid constantly.
a) No bubbles are allowed.
b) If bubbles appear, recheck connections. Repeat step 5.
7) Start engine. With engine idling, maintain fluid level. Reinstall cap.
8) Return wheels to center position. Lower front wheels to ground.
9) Keep engine running for two minutes.
10) Turn steering wheel in both directions
Verify:
a) Smooth power assist
b) Noiseless operation
c) Proper fluid level
d) No leaks
e) No bubbles, foam or fluid discoloration
11) If all conditions apply, procedure is complete.
12) If any problems remain, see "Special Conditions."

Special Conditions:
􀄵􀄶 Foam or bubbles In fluid: Fluid must be completely free of bubbles. In step 5, be alert to periodic bubbles that could indicate a loose connection or leaky 0-ring seal.
􀅁􀅂 Discolored fluid: Fluid which is milky or tan in color is an indication of aerated fluid. Switch ignition off. Wait two minutes and recheck hose connections. Repeat steps 7 • 1 O. If condition still exists, replace 0-ring seals and clamps. Fill system and repeat bleed procedure.
􀅞􀅟 Pump whine or groan: With the engine running, recheck hoses for possible contact with frame, body panels or engine. If no contact is found, allow fluid to cool down and repressurize system.
If noise persists, remov0 and replace the power steering pump. Repeat the bleeding procedure following the pump replacement.
Following the procedures illustrated can save you much frustration and your customer money, plus you fix the problem the first time around. This keeps the customer happy and coming back for more service. A happy customer tells his friends about your shop and that keeps the bays filled.
 
Change it "more often than never"! Fresh fluid is better than old fluid, within reason.
If the manual tells you when to do it, do it at least on that cadence.
If the manual tells you it never has to be done, do it well before the end of the warranty.
If it is easy to do (turkey baster or mityvac) do it regularly. Same with the transmission, really.
 
I've noticed this fluid starts turning color after about 50,000 kms so that's when I do it. Not a fan of the turkey baster method because it's only getting rid of the light suspended crud in the fluid, not the heavier stuff that collects around the reservoir mesh. So IMO, I'd rather go for a longer change interval, but change it out properly. I'll fully uninstall the reservoir, clean it out completely, and also use the steering wheel + rack to pump out as much fluid as I can during the exchange.
 
I work on a lot of 3/4 ton and up rams. I usually like to do 60k on normal use trucks. 30k on snow plow mounted trucks

The fluid oxidizes at some point and usually on that schedule there are not pump problems
 
I used to use a baster to remove all the fluid from the PS fluid reservoir at every oil and filter change. Now I don't have to-electric power steering-zero feel!
 
Put a real filter in the system and never change it again. Long term, the screen in the reservoir will clog up and starve the pump without a real filter.

If the fluid is very not clear and probably somewhat brown, it's time to change it.
 
On the subject of fluid replacement on vehicles. (Power steering, brake fluid, coolant, windshield washer solvent, differentials, etc.) I purchased one of these, and it's invaluable when it comes to sucking out old oils and fluids. It's the best $13 you'll ever spend.

The biggest problem with bulb type syringes, (turkey basters), is once you draw out the fluid, they won't hold it well, and immediately start dripping and leaking everywhere. This won't.

They also are limited to 1 bar vacuum draw. I bought a 10 foot length of 3/8" I.D. neoprene hose with it, and it can evacuate a radiator if needed with the added hose length.

And this is quick and easy to use when compared to those elaborate, expensive "suck machines". And cheap enough to own several so you don't cross contaminate anything.

https://www.harborfreight.com/oil-suction-gun-95468.html
 
No schedule. I just suck out the reservior with the MityVac then hook it up to the return line and suck till it pulls air. Then fill reservoir and suck it through. Let the reservoir run low so it is easy to put the retuen line back on. Then fill it and Let It Bleed.
This is what I do also, but next time I’m going to try cranking the wheel lock to lock while it’s sucking the fluid out. I’m wondering if that would get even more fluid pulled out. I just did the way you’re talking about on my 95 Tacoma last night. The stuff that came out was dark and sure stinky. I think it was plain PS fluid, not ATF. I replaced with valvoline maxlife atf. Truck has 330k and I’m unsure of the fluid had ever been changed. The shocks were original until I got the truck recently…
 
I've done the factory Honda method before. It's painful to do not because it's hard, but because of all the noise it makes where it seems like it's going to blow up. But it's easy and not all that messy with a little bit of work. I had a shop do it once and it wasn't expensive (less than 10 minutes labor) but I was told they don't really like doing it.

Just remove the fluid return hose and route it to a collection container. Run it and turn the steering wheel lock to lock until it can't do it any more. Then put everything back in place and fill up the fluid slowly. It's not too bad as air is purged rather quickly. I think it might have taken three top offs and it was at the top level. But that noise just doesn't sound right.
That’s from the Honda FSM??
 
That’s from the Honda FSM??

More or less. I got a FSM for a 1995 Integra and I did it once at about 90K miles. Might have done it again later. The images and instructions were basically the same for any Honda-built PSF reservoir. I posted a scan of one of these pages, but that wasn't from mine. But Honda's instructions are to insert another hose into the return hose to route the used fluid, although finding something that fits might be a challenge. The first time I did it, I had a funnel with extension (used mostly for things like manual transmission fluid fill), and the tapered end of the extension wedged right into the return hose. But later I think all I could find at Home Depot was a flexible plastic hose and I just taped it. But it doesn't come out shooting at high pressure from the return line.
 
Turkey baster every oil change. 5000-7500 miles. Valvoline Maxlife or Amsoil red cap atf in my 15 Tacoma. The Pilot has electric rack.
 
I disconnect the reservoir hose on my 04 highlander and dump it out/refill at every oil change. Synthetic atf stays noticeably cleaner than conventional. I’ve got 304,000 miles on the the original rack and pump.
 
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