What's so special about the Honda ATF - Z1 ?
- Thread starter AccordMDX
- Start date
- Status
Not to threadjack but speaking of Honda Autos. I used an extractor to remove three quarts from my girls 2002 Accord. That dipstick hole is tiny, how the **** do you guys get three quarts back in through that hole?
Im an aircraft tech and was able to rig a hose to a tiny funnel but it took forever to get it in.
Am I missing something? how can I make future changes easier
Im an aircraft tech and was able to rig a hose to a tiny funnel but it took forever to get it in.
Am I missing something? how can I make future changes easier
Very small dipstick tube?
I use a tiny funnel that fits inside the dipstick tube and a larger funnel that fits tightly in the smaller funnel so it does not leak between the big and small funnels. You could use tubing that fits tightly around the outside of the dipstick tube. Or use the hole for the fill bolt if it does not have that oil jet recall installed.
I am concerned that my Honda 5 speed auto will bite the dust all too soon after hearing about frequent auto trans failures in Hondas.
Why should a transmission need so much compulsive extra service as Honda? Is it really a crappy design?
I use a tiny funnel that fits inside the dipstick tube and a larger funnel that fits tightly in the smaller funnel so it does not leak between the big and small funnels. You could use tubing that fits tightly around the outside of the dipstick tube. Or use the hole for the fill bolt if it does not have that oil jet recall installed.
I am concerned that my Honda 5 speed auto will bite the dust all too soon after hearing about frequent auto trans failures in Hondas.
Why should a transmission need so much compulsive extra service as Honda? Is it really a crappy design?
I suppose if i were to pick an off-the-shelf ATF for any auto honda, I'd choose either Valvoline Mercon V or their Maxlife Dexron/Mercon.
I just put in about 3 qts of the maxlife in my mothers 97 accord. Seems to shift pretty well. I was debating the maxlife over the mercon V.
I just put in about 3 qts of the maxlife in my mothers 97 accord. Seems to shift pretty well. I was debating the maxlife over the mercon V.
Falconguy,
Good question on getting the ATF back in the transmission. Try this. Find the dipstick and look back towards the firewall a few inches and to your right or drivers side, you should see a large 17mm nut with a large flange. The nut will also have a bright colored paint stripe across it. This is the fill hole. Remove the 17mm nut and there is a crush washer under it. You can easily insert a large funnel into this hole.
The drain plug is located on the drivers side pointing out towards the drivers side. It is a large plug with a recessed square head that may be golden dicromatic in color also with a bright stripe of paint on it. On my Acura I have to move a splash guard to see it, so you may also have to move a plastic guard on your Accord.
Good Luck, hope this helps.
Good question on getting the ATF back in the transmission. Try this. Find the dipstick and look back towards the firewall a few inches and to your right or drivers side, you should see a large 17mm nut with a large flange. The nut will also have a bright colored paint stripe across it. This is the fill hole. Remove the 17mm nut and there is a crush washer under it. You can easily insert a large funnel into this hole.
The drain plug is located on the drivers side pointing out towards the drivers side. It is a large plug with a recessed square head that may be golden dicromatic in color also with a bright stripe of paint on it. On my Acura I have to move a splash guard to see it, so you may also have to move a plastic guard on your Accord.
Good Luck, hope this helps.
MolaKule
Staff member
Just to jump in here for a second, the Z1 fluid contains too many metals for use in other transmissions, so the answer is no, do not use the Z1 fluid for DexronIII/Mercon applications or any other for that matter.
As Terry said, the Z1 is one weird fluid.
Heating up the fluid will help too. When working with gear oils, I fill a 5 gallon bucket with hot tap water and put the bottles of oil in the hot water for 15 min. ( I know ATF is not Gear oil, but it should still help)
The Honda transmission was developed using Japanese additives as were some Mitsubishi transmissions. The additive packages coming from the Japanese "Cosmo" company. There are differences between the clutch compatibility additives/friction modifiers which effect the clutch lock up times (typically .7 to .9 of a second) The typical USA Lubrizol,Ethyl additive is more attuned to USA transmissions with different clutch lock times. Does it make a difference - I say no,the differences being so minor. It is though a dealer opportunity to sell you another dealer part and dispute a warranty. Later trans oils for the Malaysian Proton. Mitsubishi,Daewoo Hyundai should appyy to the Honda with no concerns
Ecclestone: Are you saying that ATF+3 that is specified for Hyundai A/T's would work well in a Honda A/T that calls for Z1 fluid? What do you think about using Valvoline Maxlife ATF (which Valvoline claims can be used in a Honda Z1 application?) I hate giving the Honda dealer $4.50 a qt. for an inferior product.
From what Mola said in another thread, Honda ATF Z1 has way too many "metal" to be used for other transmission. The UOA from various Honda ATF do show very high alumnium/copper/iron so I am not sure what those "metal" are.
UOA from the Honda ATF Z1 didn't show anything abnormal other than higher Fe Cu Al content. Maybe it has something that other ATF is not using and is not "analyized" by UOA.
I guess Mola and Terry are keeping their mouth shut on what those "metal" and "additives" were. They are doing this for a living so I won't blame them. If Terry said Mola is the only one got it right I would trust him.
My acura dealership frequently gave me coupon back in the days for ATF Z1, they sell it for $2.50 a quart and charge you $2.50 for the drain plug gasket.
I haven't seen any coupon from them recently however. Since I don't bring my car in for service anymore I guess they think I am either too cheap or already sold the car.
UOA from the Honda ATF Z1 didn't show anything abnormal other than higher Fe Cu Al content. Maybe it has something that other ATF is not using and is not "analyized" by UOA.
I guess Mola and Terry are keeping their mouth shut on what those "metal" and "additives" were. They are doing this for a living so I won't blame them. If Terry said Mola is the only one got it right I would trust him.
My acura dealership frequently gave me coupon back in the days for ATF Z1, they sell it for $2.50 a quart and charge you $2.50 for the drain plug gasket.
I haven't seen any coupon from them recently however. Since I don't bring my car in for service anymore I guess they think I am either too cheap or already sold the car.
Dex 111 will replace Dex 11 in almost all applications. The "sunset clause" for use of the GMH Dexron name now applies and virtually every oil company uses or manufactures a generic version of Dex 11. Typicaly a generic version uses only one base oil in blending in lieu of 2 giving a slightly heavier product than original specs. I would need to check my blend sheets to give a the exact increase ,but around 3 - 6 Cst would be typical. All blends have a tolerance of maybe 3% either way. Most vehicles are out of new car warranty and are not effected by a slight increase in viscosity, which may be actually an advantage.
Incidentally my records show a recommendation for Daewoo, Proton and Misubishi as a a Type SP trans fluid for those vehicles with damper clutches. I would see no reason not to use that in Hondas in need
Incidentally my records show a recommendation for Daewoo, Proton and Misubishi as a a Type SP trans fluid for those vehicles with damper clutches. I would see no reason not to use that in Hondas in need
MolaKule
Staff member
I called the local Honda dealer here for you (I was interested in their pricing structure as well) and they want $3.95/qt over the counter.
This is for Z1 all mineral (dino) oil fluid.
SF has to charge more since our ATF's are Blends of PAO and Esters with GroupIII oils.
This is for Z1 all mineral (dino) oil fluid.
SF has to charge more since our ATF's are Blends of PAO and Esters with GroupIII oils.
- Status