What % of Amsoil and other synthetic oil users...

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I use it for all the reasons stated. With 5 cars serviced depending I go from 5000 to 12,000 miles between changes depending on the engine. Been Amsoil for 11 years now. Since I am in a warehouse city I can get it for $4.55/qt + tax (the 10W30) so it beats out the other competitors except Mobil.
 

Mike_dup1

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I have used snythetics since 1977 and hav only did an oil analysis once! It came back saying oil was still good, so I never seen any more need for it. I just use my 26 yrs experience to tell me when to change oil, usually only 1/yr except I have gone much longer on vehicles and equipment that are only in season use, e.g. lawn mover, ATV, Snow Blower, my 1964 Impala.
 
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G-Man II: What IS with the Mobil 1 picture on your profile? I thought you did/do work for Mobil(?) I go the Amsoil 3x OEM Volvo recommmended OIC in my 1985 245 Turbo. Oil does FINE. Great in fact. So Amsoil is spot on. Results posted. Jury is out on Volvo 855 non-Turbo approaching 20K mile OIC and 14 months analysis sson. 10K and 15K OIC results were fine. 1985 Toyota truck sits all year and gets maybe 1000 miles/year. I hate to even change the oil at that "short" OIC. Coming up on two years...yikes SAME oil......I'll do an analysis.
 
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Thats where I got the idea he is with Mobil. I saw the picture on his profile. I still would rather have an oil thicken after 16k miles, which by the way, was due for a change bc it was one years time, then to thin out to a 20wt. [Smile] [Big Grin] [ February 02, 2003, 10:02 AM: Message edited by: buster ]
 
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Here's a bit of insight into my selection process. While I currently use AMSOIL, I've got more hours, miles, and oil changes with M1 products. As I understand it (feel free to correct me), there are only a couple of manufacturers of synthetic base stocks. Mobil is the largest, and developed their technology with lots of DoD money (read: 'our parent's money' for many of us). I think that that Petro Canada makes some of the base stocks that AMSOIL uses as well. There are other additive package manufacturers besides Lubrizol, but they're the biggie. AMSOIL goes into the selection and blending process with a different philosophy. They build their products for the long haul. You might not agree with the 25K/1 year interval for most of their oils, but they do, and have from the beginning. And where the formulations have fallen short, they've worked to improve them. Many customers have no trouble making 25K. Many run 150K with the same oils. I've seen their products do that - this isn't a case of 'a friend's brother's nephew who sells AMSOIL said that a client's brother...' thing. Contrast the path Mobil choose to take with M1. It was also a 25K/1 year oil. There were acceptance probs here, and probably a couple of other problems as well. Instead of sticking with that goal and improving the product first, cost second, the decision was made to lower the change interval and formulate the product for a 7500 mile/1 year change. There are folks that have successfully gone beyond this with M1 products but not nearly as many. Before finding this site, I only knew of 3 or 4. I don't consider this to be an attack or a validation of either product. In the general aviation market there are older style airplanes with fabric covered wings that carry 2 people almost 100mph for just over 2 hours. And there are 6 passenger jets that can fly high and fast and from coast to coast. Each is better than the other for a specific function - the Taylorcraft does what it does very well, and so does the Learjet. I like very much that I don't have to change the oil every couple of months. I like that I'm not adding the additional 27 quarts of drain oil to the hazardous waste process. And I like very much that I can purchase these products for less than I can purchase other synths. And I still kinda giggle when I get a tax refund on my oil changes besides. [Big Grin] I also completely agree that there are some (many?) waaaay over the top AMSOIL salespeople out there. As much as I'd like to start muzzling some of them, and deleting lots of web page content, no one died and made me the sales censor. In typical free-market fashion, I'll not support those folks that I don't feel comfortable with or agree with. And I also recognize (more and more as time goes on) that my ignorance will make some companies' products look 'too good to be true' and I'll miss a good opportunity. ((I got an AMSOIL catalog from a gent in Colorado about 5 years ago. After waving the BS flag around the living room, I tossed the catalog in the wood stove.)) But I can separate the independent dealer's religious zeal from the company and their products. Just my $.02. Andy PS... FWIW: Ya'll can 'blame' my presence here on a waaaaay over the top Schaeffers salesman that was badmouthing full synth oils on another forum I frequent.... He just could not 'get' that I MUST use a full synth in my car. He was so hung on the benefits of Mo that he couldn't hear that semi synth has lots of petroleum in it.
 
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Andy, I thought that the VW TDI required an oil with a VW 505 spec. A few non-snythetic oils meet this requirement. VW uses a Group III for Dealer change under warranty. Now I am confused. Please set me straight on this.
 
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quote:
Originally posted by Andy H: Contrast the path Mobil choose to take with M1. It was also a 25K/1 year oil. There were acceptance probs here, and probably a couple of other problems as well. Instead of sticking with that goal and improving the product first, cost second, the decision was made to lower the change interval and formulate the product for a 7500 mile/1 year change.
I don't believe this for a second. The current formulation of Mobil 1 is FAR better than the original in every respect. Mobil chose to stop advertising 25,000 mile drain intervals because it directly conflicted with what auto makers recommended (since they didn't distinguish between conventional and synthetics when it came to maintenance intervals). Continuing to advertise maintenance practices which went against what the car makers required would have ensured Mobil never got any OEM fill contracts for Mobil 1, so in one sense this was a marketing decision, and it's obviously paid off. Mobil 1 is the factory fill for the Corvette, the Cadillac XLR, the Dodge Viper, every Porsche, every Mercedes AMG model, and every Aston Martin. As for Mobil 1's extended drain capabilities, their ACEA ratings and meeting certain European OEM specs show that, even though Mobil doesn't market the oil as having any particular mileage capability.
 

mdv

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quote:
Originally posted by buster: they should realize that Amsoil is half Mobil 1 and half Lubrizol.
Isn't that kind of over simplifying things?
 
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Yes it is. I was just trying to point out, and I'm sure most of everyone knows this, that Amsoil uses good chemicals and additives to make there oils. Its not like they are working with no-name components. BTW, since I drive 50k miles per year, I'm going to extend my sample of S2000 to about 15K miles and then have it analyzed. This should take another 1.5months. So I should be able to shed light on whether Amsoil can go the distance bc time is not a factor in my case. At 15k miles, the oil will only be 4 months old. [Wink] [ February 02, 2003, 07:19 PM: Message edited by: buster ]
 

Patman

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quote:
Originally posted by Mike: I have used snythetics since 1977 and hav only did an oil analysis once! It came back saying oil was still good, so I never seen any more need for it.
There is a huge need for it! You can't say that because a certain interval worked well for one car that it'll work the same for all cars. IMO it's foolish to go beyond 10k with any oil without oil analysis to prove things are ok. If you don't want to spend the money on analysis, then you shouldn't be pushing the oil past 10k. (and even that high is kinda scary without analysis, no matter what the oil)
 
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quote:
I also completely agree that there are some (many?) waaaay over the top AMSOIL salespeople out there. As much as I'd like to start muzzling some of them, and deleting lots of web page content, no one died and made me the sales censor. In typical free-market fashion, I'll not support those folks that I don't feel comfortable with or agree with. And I also recognize (more and more as time goes on) that my ignorance will make some companies' products look 'too good to be true' and I'll miss a good opportunity. ((I got an AMSOIL catalog from a gent in Colorado about 5 years ago. After waving the BS flag around the living room, I tossed the catalog in the wood stove.)) But I can separate the independent dealer's religious zeal from the company and their products. Just my $.02.
I agree with this. This is waaay off topic now but when people complain about the product, they should realize that Amsoil is half Mobil 1 and half Lubrizol. So why have any doubts? Different markets too. Amsoil is in the specialty market along with Redline and Royal Purple. Mobil is the last great OTC synthetic oil and is of top notch quality. I think we should drop this. I agree Patman, going beyond 10K is a littel nuts anyway and to recommend 25k drains is not to smart IMO [Smile] [ February 02, 2003, 12:11 PM: Message edited by: buster ]
 

Mike_dup1

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quote:
Originally posted by Patman: [QUOTE]IMO it's foolish to go beyond 10k with any oil without oil analysis to prove things are ok. If you don't want to spend the money on analysis, then you shouldn't be pushing the oil past 10k. (and even that high is kinda scary without analysis, no matter what the oil) [/QB]
I have been doing it for aLl this time and see no reason to change. I have over 30,000 on my 2001 GMC and about 8,000 on my 2002 T/A , Both are scheduled for oil changes next October, no matter what the miles. That's how confident I am. IMO, changing the oil and doing analysis is a waste of time. If on the other hand you are planning on changing the oil based on the results of analysis, thats a different story. But, correct me if I am wrong but some are changing oil at 3000 miles, testing it and will never go beyond 3000 miles for fear the engine was blow up. One person told me they park the car till the can get it changed, afraid if they go over it the end of the enigne. Thats how scared the quick lubes have some elderly customers. I heard a rumor they were going to put a $5 a qt tax on petroleum motor oil, like they did with the smokes. HOLD ON THERE, Thats just a joke [LOL!] but it may not be very far fetched. fyi I was goiing to try the place advetised here but they have told me they are swamped and it will be a long wait just to get a sample bottle. I hope you guys are getting a commission. [ February 02, 2003, 12:35 PM: Message edited by: Mike ]
 
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Andy H Another big additive supplier to oil blenders (of which Amsoil and Schaeffer are examples) is ChevronOronite. There are others. I don't know who buys from whom. Petro-Canada produces one of the better Group III base oils; I don't know if they also produce a PAO. There must be other sources of PAO than ExxonMobil. Mobil 1 is suitable for extended drain intervals as indicated by their ACEA A3 or A5 ratings, and MB229.3 and MB229.5 ratings. No, they don't market the oils as such in the U.S. Engine makers don't tell folks that some oils are good for longer drain intervals than others, and most U.S. consumers and most mechanics don't believe when told and think that 3000 mile ODI is a virtue. Anyway, ExxonMobil isn't going to stick their financial neck out telling folks to run oil longer than the engine maker's recommendation for ODI with warranty concerns and all that. And...the one and only goal of all these oil companies is to maximize profit. Their marketing staffs tell them what to blend and how to label and promote it. ExxonMobil choses to be fully API certified, ignore extended drain intervals, and make their money. Amsoil choses to mainly ignore API certification, promote extended drain intervals, and make their money. Ken [ February 02, 2003, 12:40 PM: Message edited by: Ken2 ]
 
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quote:
Originally posted by 59 Vetteman: Andy, I thought that the VW TDI required an oil with a VW 505 spec. A few non-snythetic oils meet this requirement. VW uses a Group III for Dealer change under warranty. Now I am confused. Please set me straight on this.
The '96 Passat TDI originally called for a VW 505 or API CD lube and didn't specify petroleum or synth. There were two VW tech bulletins sometime in '99 that mandated using only synthetics in the engines. The largest problem, as I understand it, is that the piston rings are pretty high and the petroleum was burning and plugging the lands. The dealer sells a 'made for VW' Castrol Syntec for these engines, tho I don't think it meets VW505. Even in a car of this vintage, my 7500 mile drain requirement in the US is a 10K drain in the Bundesrepublic. By this standard, even my 9K changes aren't 'extended'.
 
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quote:
Originally posted by G-Man II:
quote:
Originally posted by Andy H: Contrast the path Mobil choose to take with M1. It was also a 25K/1 year oil. There were acceptance probs here, and probably a couple of other problems as well. Instead of sticking with that goal and improving the product first, cost second, the decision was made to lower the change interval and formulate the product for a 7500 mile/1 year change.
I don't believe this for a second. The current formulation of Mobil 1 is FAR better than the original in every respect. Mobil chose to stop advertising 25,000 mile drain intervals because it directly conflicted with what auto makers recommended (since they didn't distinguish between conventional and synthetics when it came to maintenance intervals). Continuing to advertise maintenance practices which went against what the car makers required would have ensured Mobil never got any OEM fill contracts for Mobil 1, so in one sense this was a marketing decision, and it's obviously paid off. Mobil 1 is the factory fill for the Corvette, the Cadillac XLR, the Dodge Viper, every Porsche, every Mercedes AMG model, and every Aston Martin. As for Mobil 1's extended drain capabilities, their ACEA ratings and meeting certain European OEM specs show that, even though Mobil doesn't market the oil as having any particular mileage capability.

I think you confirmed my thoughts here. I agree that marketing is a huge player here, but the bean counters and marketing types gather around the 'lab rats' and tell them how much cash they can spend on additives and how many sales they will lose for each cent the price increases. Different companies choose to favor different sides of the triangle. Mobil 1 chose market acceptance and high volume/lower profit per quart as their sales model. I agree - from what I've seen here, M1's latest formulations are better than their earlier ones. Bottom line, tho, also from what I've see here, is that Mobil's recommendation to not exceed 7500 miles on their oil or filters is usually warranted here in the 'States. And for modern U.S. cars, this is the 'standard' change interval.
 
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