I watched this great teardown of a 4L60E and they believe that someone put a bunch of some transmission additive in it by how the fluid smelled, I assume it was some type of stop leak. Just look at how f#%&2d all those seals are.
What happens when you put too much stop leak in a transmission.
- Thread starter blufeb95
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I believe... assumptions... do not tell us enough about what really happened.
I really like this guy’s videos. You can tell he knows his stuff.
I'm going with there was more in there than just Maxlife. ATP205 maybe or something of that ilk.
I don't think it's a fluid with extra seal conditioners, I assume they probably used a cheap stop leak product that uses a petroleum solvent as a seal expander and a lot of it especially if it was noticable in the smell of the fluid.
Probably. The O-rings look like you soaked them in brake cleaner. I've made that mistake once, on a proprietary throttle body seal. Thankfully I had another car to drive because there was no way that seal was going back where it was supposed to go.
I tore down a Ford AOD-E years ago that was that bad, Never did get a straight answer on what exactly was added to the ATF. But I smelled Brake Fluid as well as feeling it in the ATF (It's got a "Hot" feel to it)
What I was surprised about was the 5 Pinion rear carrier in a 245mm 4 cylinder 4L60E.
What I was surprised about was the 5 Pinion rear carrier in a 245mm 4 cylinder 4L60E.
Do you think that could have been something along the lines of they just happened to run out of parts that day and swapped that in, or it was some form of conscious decision to build them that way? Same with the roller bearings they seemed to be surprised with them being in there.
I'm always sortof amazed at the variability of something that you would think would be standardized from start to finish. Sure it costs more to put the roller bearings and 5 pinion planets in there, but is it really cost effective to build several different versions of the same transmission? I'm sure they analyzed it to death and figured out where they could cut costs, but you would still think that it would just be easier and cheaper to stock one thing, instead of 5-6.
GM rollerized the Reaction Shaft mid way through the 2002 model year & was standard from then on. It was a "As parts exhausted" type thing. They are correct about the wear to the 3-4 Hub interface splines on the Roller Reaction Shaft not being an issue on the Thrust Washer Style Reaction Shaft....But the Sun Gear Bushing would eat into the shaft.
Only a Transmission Man would get excited over something so stupid as a 5-pinion planet where it doesn't belong! I literally yelled at my computer screen when I saw it in the video.
At first....ONLY LS2, Light Duty LQ4, & LQ9 6.0L's got the 4L65E which had 5-Pinion carriers front & rear, Hardened Input Shaft, Hardened Stator Splines, & a 7 Friction 3-4 Clutch.
Only a Transmission Man would get excited over something so stupid as a 5-pinion planet where it doesn't belong! I literally yelled at my computer screen when I saw it in the video.
At first....ONLY LS2, Light Duty LQ4, & LQ9 6.0L's got the 4L65E which had 5-Pinion carriers front & rear, Hardened Input Shaft, Hardened Stator Splines, & a 7 Friction 3-4 Clutch.
I think the owner of that truck must have used something like this and failed to read the instructions. You are supposed to use it in a 1:10 ratio. one quart of stop leak to 10 quarts of ATF.
Recently, I changed an 18 year old original o-ring on one of our diesel tractors. That o-ring was hard as a rock and actually broke when I tried to remove it with a pick. I placed the o-ring in a 50/50 mix of 15w40 engine oil and Lubegard Platinum and let it sit for a couple of weeks. I removed it from the mixture expecting the Lubegard to have softened it up, but it was still as hard and brittle as the day I placed it in there. I should have put it in an atf/Lubegard mixture but I suspect that the results would have been about the same. It was an engine o-ring that runs in direct contact with engine oil, so that’s why I used what I used.
I don‘t think anything but a dedicated seal sweller (or something like brake fluid) could have caused what we are seeing in that video. I would love to know exactly what was used, in what quantity and for how long.
Recently, I changed an 18 year old original o-ring on one of our diesel tractors. That o-ring was hard as a rock and actually broke when I tried to remove it with a pick. I placed the o-ring in a 50/50 mix of 15w40 engine oil and Lubegard Platinum and let it sit for a couple of weeks. I removed it from the mixture expecting the Lubegard to have softened it up, but it was still as hard and brittle as the day I placed it in there. I should have put it in an atf/Lubegard mixture but I suspect that the results would have been about the same. It was an engine o-ring that runs in direct contact with engine oil, so that’s why I used what I used.
I don‘t think anything but a dedicated seal sweller (or something like brake fluid) could have caused what we are seeing in that video. I would love to know exactly what was used, in what quantity and for how long.
If a little is good, more must be better....right?
We had a “last ditch” trick... a tbsp of brake fluid in the trans if you just needed to get another couple of months out of a junker. I never did it to any on mine. That, and spray coca-cola in the clutch housing if it was slipping bad for that final drive to get it to the shop!
Always keep a spare quart of oil, old dex/merc, and a gallon of water in the trunk. I've never had to use them and hope I never do. In an emergency situation those three things may very well keep you on the road to get to help.
Some more from the same transmission
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Clearly some Quaker State motor oil found its way in there. I can spot it from a mile away.
I also like his videos.
This is also the reason why i always stick to the OEM manufacturer/filled ATF.
The oil has a right amount of seal swell/conditioner in it, there is no need to put extra in it.
When after x amount of year the seals are hardened or brittle the seall swell probably wont do anything but ruin the rest of it, rebuild with only the seals is your best bet.
Most of my mates always go full out with rebuilds and then complain that it costed so much money but 9 out of 10 times it is only a couple euro seal that is needed, no clutches, seals. solenoids, mechatronics etc..
This is also the reason why i always stick to the OEM manufacturer/filled ATF.
The oil has a right amount of seal swell/conditioner in it, there is no need to put extra in it.
When after x amount of year the seals are hardened or brittle the seall swell probably wont do anything but ruin the rest of it, rebuild with only the seals is your best bet.
Most of my mates always go full out with rebuilds and then complain that it costed so much money but 9 out of 10 times it is only a couple euro seal that is needed, no clutches, seals. solenoids, mechatronics etc..
Guess it would depend on how far you needed to go in for just the seals. I really couldn't see not replacing the wear parts if you're having to be tear it down that far to get to them. For me, it would depend on miles. On any of my cars, at this point, if there were a known seal failure, I'd have them completely rebuilt as well. The labor to get the trans out and torn down, might as well replace parts while you're in there.
Yes i meant that when youre doing it by yourself, ofcourse if you have to get it done by a specialist you might as well change some extra parts.
However most ''quality'' modern automatics for example the ZF 6 ZF 8 ZF 9 can easily last 400k+ miles without the mechanical side failing so there is no need to change the parts early.
The computer controlled mechatronics cause much less wear because slippage is reduced to a minimum in order to reduce fuel consumption etc..
This is also beneficial for the automatic and its oil.
Old automatics with mechanical operation or 3 or 4 speed automatics where basicly slipping half the time because the steps of the gears where too large. The newer 6 7 8 9 speeds+ automatics almost shift like DCT's And the torque converter lockup clutch is always applied except during the first couple of meters that you start driving and only very short amount of time during shifting so the loss is minimum.
Hence why modern automtatics have equal or better fuel consumption than a manual.
I will always take a modern automatic over a DCT.
MolaKule
Staff member
Whatever he dumped into that transmission reacted horribly with the ATF and increased the oxidation rate to make that kind of sludge.
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