What does this tell us?

[SteveD2]

What do we know from this MSDS data? SYNTHETIC HYDROCARBON BASE Oil Chemical Name: 1-DECENE, HOMOPOLYMER, HYDROGENATED CAS68037014 > 55.00% DECANOIC ACID, ESTER Chemical Name: DECANOIC ACID, ESTER WITH 2ETHYL2(HYDROXYMETHYL)1,3 PROPANE CAS11138606 < 15.00%

 

[dragboat]

A synthetic oil

 

[SteveD2]

Yes, and.... Ken

 

[Propflux01]

It tells me I don't know Jack about chemistry!!!

 

[Patman]

What we need is for someone on here who can read MSDS sheets to fully explain to us what to look for, in other words tell us what it would say for a PAO/ester based synthetic and what it would say for a group 3 based synthetic.

 

[mormit]

It's 55% PAO and 15% Ester. Are these the only basestocks listed on the MSDS? 70% basestock seems really low for a groupIV/V oil. I though it should be about 80%, maybe a little more. What oil is this?

 

[palmerwmd]

The top one is a group IV as evidenced by the "polymer" term. The second one is a group V. Which oil is it and which viscosity? Fred...

 

[OneQuartLow]

quote:

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Originally posted by Ken: What do we know from this MSDS data? SYNTHETIC HYDROCARBON BASE Oil Chemical Name: 1-DECENE, HOMOPOLYMER, HYDROGENATED CAS68037014 > 55.00% DECANOIC ACID, ESTER Chemical Name: DECANOIC ACID, ESTER WITH 2ETHYL2(HYDROXYMETHYL)1,3 PROPANE CAS11138606 < 15.00%

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The percentages make it simpler. I take "synthetic hydrocarbon base oil" and "hydrogenated" to be a hydrotreated dino base (group 3). I've seen it referred to as hycrocracked, hydrotreated, hydrogenated, and of course "synthetic". "Decanoic Acid, Ester" seems clear. So >55% Group 3 + <15% Ester? 0-29% additives? I wonder how much they actually vary the percentage of base oil... I agree, it would be nice to have MolaKule or someone list key properties and walk us through a few MSDS translations. If MSDS data can have "synthetic" attached to a dino base then they might become even more difficult to read for the rest of us. David

 

[OneQuartLow]

Wow. My reply was to Patman's last post but I got distracted. If you two say the main ingredient is >55% PAO then I need more assistance.

 

[MolaKule]

SYNTHETIC HYDROCARBON BASE Oil Chemical Name: 1-DECENE, HOMOPOLYMER, HYDROGENATED CAS68037014 > 55.00% ** This is a PAO. DECANOIC ACID, ESTER Chemical Name: DECANOIC ACID, ESTER WITH 2ETHYL2(HYDROXYMETHYL)1,3 PROPANE CAS11138606 < 15.00% ** This is an ester, the acid used to make the ester is decanoic acid and it is reacted with an ethyl type alcohol derived from propane. The term polymer simply means a "repeating unit." A "monomer" is a single molecule, or compound, that can join with other molecules or compounds to form a polymer, or repeating chain of monomers. The term "Polymer" doesn't not necessarily infer that it is a Synthetic ingredient. [ November 10, 2002, 03:57 PM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]

 

[Pablo]

quote:

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SYNTHETIC HYDROCARBON BASE Oil Chemical Name: 1-DECENE, HOMOPOLYMER, HYDROGENATED CAS68037014 > 55.00% DECANOIC ACID, ESTER Chemical Name: DECANOIC ACID, ESTER WITH 2ETHYL2(HYDROXYMETHYL)1,3 PROPANE CAS11138606 < 15.00%

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This tells me that msds's can be weasel worded! Blatant lieing is not allowed, but obfuscation and euphimisation are encouraged. Mainly to slow stealing "trade secrets", hide things like the base oil is not really synthetic (old definition) and with some compounds to make them seem "less hazardous" or even less costly to ship. I used to write the MSDS's for the compounds I developed as a chemist. No, not in the petroleum industry....chemicals for Printed Circuits, etc..

 

[MolaKule]

"SYNTHETIC HYDROCARBON BASE Oil" There many types of synthesized hydrocarbon base oils, of which PAO is but one, but one of the best known. Polyisobutylene is another, and is used as an oil thickener (in high vis form) and can be used as a 2-cycle base oil in low vis. (thin) form. EOP is another synthesized hydrocarbon similar to PAO and was recently developed by Pennzoil chemists.

 

[SteveD2]

The part I left out of this MSDS is: --or-- ISOSYN Base Oils and the ZINC ALKYL DITHIOPHOSPHATE anti-wear agent. So now we know that this is Chevron Supreme Synthetic. ISOSYN is Chevron's trademarked name for, "Special hydrocracked Group II base oil that can rival synthetics in critical engine performance tests. Group II base oils are more highly refined than Group I base oils which allows the oil to withstand "oxidation", or chemical breakdown, at higher operating temperatures common to today's engine designs." Does this mean that Chevron can blend either PAO or ISOSYN Group II (or maybe a mixture of the two) plus the ester and package any of these blends as their "Supreme Synthetic"? Would ISOSYN be considered a Group II+? The MSDS lists all four viscosities as having the same list of ingredients. Ken

 

[palmerwmd]

Hmm the "or" part sounds pretty omninous... Seems like they have left themself the ability to sell this oil as a synthetic with a #II base stock.. Fred....

 

[MolaKule]

I seem to recall a similar thread in which the same or very similar MSDS came up. I think what they mean is that they can substitute a full synth PAO/ester for a group III base oil; hence the "OR." [ November 10, 2002, 09:16 PM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]

 

[Pablo]

did I use the term "weasel worded" in my post.....NOT that any company is immune from this sort of thing. It's usually called the Marketing Department.