Various Mobil 1 formulas tested in HPL’s lab! Motor Oil Geek LSJr video

[Pablo]

While I can't swear to the validity of this 50 year old memory, I do recall seeing a gas chromatograph of the original Mobil 1 back in the 70s when first released that showed two POE peaks. One of our R&D guys interpreted it to contain TMP C7 and PE C7 at about 10% each. If true it would not account for an oxidation value over 100.

That said, hermetically sealed steel cans do not breathe and there should not be much head space in the can. The US Navy once opened a sealed steel can of jet engine oil that was some decades old and it still met all specifications, which are rather severe. Perhaps that old can of Mobil 1 was exposed to some extended high temperatures.

Great point. I think he was a little off on those comments.

 

[Indyxc]

Unless you need BMW approval, have a Porsche GT car, or want to run very long intervals there’s no apparent reason to use anything other than ESP X3/X4.

N55 BMW engine in a 2012 BMW 135. I don't care about the approval, it seems to carry LL01 at times. I'll change the oil often, so probably going with a cheap off the shelf option with Ow40 Euro. I like the ESP better, but it's pricey.

 

[chris719]

N55 BMW engine in a 2012 BMW 135. I don't care about the approval, it seems to carry LL01 at times. I'll change the oil often, so probably going with a cheap off the shelf option with Ow40 Euro. I like the ESP better, but it's pricey.

I'm sure the FS is fine. N55 do have sporadic rod bearing issues, but it's secondary to oil starvation mostly so I'm not sure any oil can help it.

 

[thescreensavers]

Love the data he is bringing to the table, I just skipped to the good parts.

I've subscribed and liked them all. I used Supercar in my Camaro and run the 0W40 FS in my Infiniti.

 

[Slick3914]

One thing that was more prominent in this video was that he did a good job of making the application distinctions relative to the indicated results. That has been lacking in many of his previous videos. Lubes are marketed to a specific application. Racing lubes don't need longevity; they offer excellent protection at very high stress levels. The oxidation vs wear control topic will have (or at least should have) different appeals to different users. Whereas road-going lubes intended for today's longer OCIs are going to be more focused on contamination levels (soot and fuel build up) and concern for emissions equipment, just to name a few.

And I would note that none of the differences/distinctions will matter one little iota to any BITOGer who still insists on changing the Mobil 1 (regardless of flavor) every 5k miles in his lightly used DD Camry ... There are WAY too many conversations around here that focus on the minute content nuances of various lubes, and yet they rarely ever result from folks who actually use these premium products to their full capacity where any delta would make an actual difference.

We’re still waiting for your videos…..

 

[goingplacesanddoingstuff]

While I can't swear to the validity of this 50 year old memory, I do recall seeing a gas chromatograph of the original Mobil 1 back in the 70s when first released that showed two POE peaks. One of our R&D guys interpreted it to contain TMP C7 and PE C7 at about 10% each. If true it would not account for an oxidation value over 100.

That said, hermetically sealed steel cans do not breathe and there should not be much head space in the can. The US Navy once opened a sealed steel can of jet engine oil that was some decades old and it still met all specifications, which are rather severe. Perhaps that old can of Mobil 1 was exposed to some extended high temperatures.

Do we know whether his can of old Mobil1 was fully sealed?

If it wasn’t, then I think his conclusion is fairly accurate for the present since oils now come in permeable containers.

 

[ka9mnx]

While I can't swear to the validity of this 50 year old memory, I do recall seeing a gas chromatograph of the original Mobil 1 back in the 70s when first released that showed two POE peaks. One of our R&D guys interpreted it to contain TMP C7 and PE C7 at about 10% each. If true it would not account for an oxidation value over 100.

That said, hermetically sealed steel cans do not breathe and there should not be much head space in the can. The US Navy once opened a sealed steel can of jet engine oil that was some decades old and it still met all specifications, which are rather severe. Perhaps that old can of Mobil 1 was exposed to some extended high temperatures.

From What I gathered in the video he held up a can of the original 5w-20 Mobil1 but when he mentioned the Mobil1 tested it was the later plastic jug of 5w-30.

 

[ka9mnx]

On many aircraft, we don't ever change turbine engine oils, and they too tend to oxidize through time, heat and use. In this case, oil changes simply don't help, and the engines are ultra reliable.

The P&W engines in our F-16's only had the oil changed when they were pulled at, if I remember correctly, 200 hours for tear down and inspection. Also, we rarely added oil between inspections. Oil we used was M1 in metal cans.

Oil samples were taken after every flight but I never got to see the results.

 

[Tom NJ]

The P&W engines in our F-16's only had the oil changed when they were pulled at, if I remember correctly, 200 hours for tear down and inspection. Also, we rarely added oil between inspections. Oil we used was M1 in metal cans.

It would not have been Mobil 1 as it is not approved for jet turbine engines and would fail. Jet turbine engines use POE based oil meeting 23699, 7808, or AS5780 specifications, along with engine builder and/or military approvals. Perhaps what you used was a Mobil jet engine oil such as Mobil Jet II, Mobil Jet Oil 254, or Mobil Jet Oil 387, all of which come in steel cans.

 

[Tifosi]

Q: Issue with Shear and oxidation can both be overcome by having a shorter OCI? If so, what is consider an acceptable short OCI? 5K miles/1 year, 5K miles/6 months or 3K miles/6 months? TIA.

 

[userfriendly]

I have always felt that M1 had way too many different versions and I wondered if some of them might be the same formula with different labels. So it’s nice to see that they do have different variations in their formulas. I would love to see these tests done with 0w20 and 5w30 though as they are probably the most common viscosities that people use these days.

Missing is Delvac 0W40, likely the best of the bunch.
Back in the day Esso XD-3 0W40 was my go to one size fits all where ambient temperature may dip below minus 35.
In addition, we had Delvac 15w50 in CJ-4.

 

[tired]

Just watched this video again. Am I missing something about the Truck & SUV formula? Seems like it is the one to beat. I don't see a lot on here about it.

 

[JAG]

Based on those tests, of the four non-Euro M1 oils tested, Truck and SUV beat them all, including the Extended Performance. I think it’s more rare in stores than regular M1 and M1 EP. Also, EP sounds like it must be better. It’s a shame that perhaps their best non-Euro oil doesn’t get the sales that it deserves.

 

[tired]

Based on those tests, of the four non-Euro M1 oils tested, Truck and SUV beat them all, including the Extended Performance. I think it’s more rare in stores than regular M1 and M1 EP. Also, EP sounds like it must be better. It’s a shame that perhaps their best non-Euro oil doesn’t get the sales that it deserves.

If I understand you correctly, the Truck & SUV is better than all non-Euro formulas. M1 ESP beats all of them though. Is that right?

Also, is the 0W-30 the same as 5W-30 in its composition? I feel like I read somewhere that the 5W-30 has a different base oil? Is everything that makes M1 ESP great present in the 5W-30?

 

[JAG]

If I understand you correctly, the Truck & SUV is better than all non-Euro formulas. M1 ESP beats all of them though. Is that right?

Also, is the 0W-30 the same as 5W-30 in its composition? I feel like I read somewhere that the 5W-30 has a different base oil? Is everything that makes M1 ESP great present in the 5W-30?

Yes to the first question and no to the second. Of all oils tested, the highest (best) PDSC results were M1 FS 0W-40 (80 min) and M1 Truck and SUV (75 minutes). 0W-40 FS had a lot of viscosity loss, as did 0W-40 Supercar. ESP x3 and C40 GT had good viscosity retention, but had relatively short PDSC times. All but one had strengths and weaknesses. Truck and SUV was the only one that excelled in PDSC and viscosity retention. If they were used in engine tests, there would be additional criteria. The more criteria there are, the less likely that one oil beats every other oil in every criteria.

ESP 0W-30 and ESP 5W-30 differ in composition. One difference is ESP 0W-30 having some ester base oil. I think ESP 0W-30 has more VIIs and lower net base oil viscosity. I have no clue about other ashless additive differences like the important antioxidant package. I cannot recall what differences there are in the metallic additive concentrations but the VOAs and UOAs can show you that.

 

[chris719]

Just watched this video again. Am I missing something about the Truck & SUV formula? Seems like it is the one to beat. I don't see a lot on here about it.

It doesn't meet Euro standards, and BITOG generally regards those as more stringent.

 

[MolaKule]

Some really good info scattered throughout this vid.

One other error was when he was discussing seal swell, about 3:15.

The original majority PAO Mobil 1 did have seal swell problems and caused some leaks.

The original Amsoil majority Diester formula never had any seal swell problems and saw no leaks.

 

[tired]

Yes to the first question and no to the second. Of all oils tested, the highest (best) PDSC results were M1 FS 0W-40 (80 min) and M1 Truck and SUV (75 minutes). 0W-40 FS had a lot of viscosity loss, as did 0W-40 Supercar. ESP x3 and C40 GT had good viscosity retention, but had relatively short PDSC times. All but one had strengths and weaknesses. Truck and SUV was the only one that excelled in PDSC and viscosity retention. If they were used in engine tests, there would be additional criteria. The more criteria there are, the less likely that one oil beats every other oil in every criteria.

ESP 0W-30 and ESP 5W-30 differ in composition. One difference is ESP 0W-30 having some ester base oil. I think ESP 0W-30 has more VIIs and lower net base oil viscosity. I have no clue about other ashless additive differences like the important antioxidant package. I cannot recall what differences there are in the metallic additive concentrations but the VOAs and UOAs can show you that.

So if you want all of the stuff that makes ESP good then you need to run the 0W-30? Can you run it in an engine calling for 5W-30?

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

In defense of idemitsu, she also drives like Danica Patrick.

She hits the wall one sixth of the time?

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

So if you want all of the stuff that makes ESP good then you need to run the 0W-30? Can you run it in an engine calling for 5W-30?

You’ve been here since 2011. The board hasn’t answered that 37,000+ times since then?

Yes, you can run 0w30 where 5w30 is recommended by the manufacturer and it meets the other certifications called for like API SP, etc.