US Car Sales Down Steeply

[Win]

quote:

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Originally posted by ScottB:
There's a handful of cool-looking vehicles, for sure, but I think it's obvious that people want reliable, updated, and good-looking cars.

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I have to wonder whether looks are that important. Looks are always subjective, but it doesn't seem like there are very many real lookers out there right now until you get into the higher priced car lines.

One thing that GM NA needs to look at it is better allocation of their production resources to cars that could sell well. I'm no rocket scientist, but it does seem straight forward that you ought to ramp up production of what people want, and taper off what sells slowly.

I was at the local Pontiac lot Tuesday and not a convertible G6 or a Solstice to be found. I buy when I am in the mood to buy, and if they had one of those around in an option package and color I liked, they had a better than 50/50 shot at a sale.

 

[ScottB]

Win: you are correct, and I've posted that here a number of times.
I tried to get a Solstice, and they were nowhere to be had - sans ebay.
Allthewhile, you can pickup 100 F-150's, Hummers, Yukons, Escalades, etc. etc. on any lot.

They can't shift and/or predict production to save their lives, sadly.

Scott

 

[ToyotaNSaturn]

MODERATOR REQUEST: Please shorten the URL link in the orginal post.


Thank you!

 

[vad]

quote:

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Originally posted by Win:
Now that Holden is the third largest design studio in GM, and Holden's old designer is now chief at GM North America, things should improve quickly here in NA.

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Things won't change quickly or at all just because a potentially great designer took a lead position at GM, which is the epitome of bureaucratic incompetence.

 

[carock]

The one thing that stands no chance of saving GM is rearranging their organizational charts again.

 

[ScottB]

I have to tell you guys that my coworkers have the following:
Yukon
Escallade (sp?)
Suburban

They're all 2001 and up. They are always having something replaced/fixed in the shop.
Not minor stuff either.
The Subby guy just found out Tuesday that he needed to replace both heads - cracked!

I'm always taking one of them to the dealer to get work done.
Sorry, but that's a good cross-section of US-made SUV's and I'm not even impressed.

Big, ugly, overpriced, and certainly not as reliable as the counterparts from elsewhere.

Say what you like, but that's reality and it's one reason why they're going down down down.

Scott

 

[brianl703]

If I had to take a guess it was probably a problem that was covered under the Federal 8-year, 80,000 mile emissions warranty.

 

[JHZR2]

quote:

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Originally posted by Volvohead:

quote:

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Originally posted by ALS:
How many cars have been sold in the last 3 years should be the question? Lets face it a lot people have already bought their "new" car over the last few years. How many are really in the market for a new car or truck no matter what price or incentives the manufactures put on the window sticker?

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Apparently where a new Toyota is concerned, quite a few.

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Thats because people predisposed to buying toyota and honda will do so even if there are far better deals elsewhere... Lets remembr thatthe used car pricing of toyota and Honda makes no sense whatsoever compared to new car pricing... as a result of the hardheadedness of people looking to buy these cars. IMO new is always the better deal in these makes, but I digress.

Toyota and Honda dont exacty ever have spectacular 'sales' the likes of GM and Ford. People interested in GM/ford offerings were tempted by the good deals, and moved on it when the deal was there. The toyota nd honda people didnt have super-good deals, and as a result, didnt have to buy then and there, nd so their purchases are much more 'normal' inline with history.

JMH

 

[JHZR2]

quote:

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Originally posted by H2GURU:
I just took a "98 Corolla to the dealer with CEL problem and after 8 years it was taken care of for ZIP!

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Are you sure this wasnt because it as due to an O2 sensor or similar thing that was covered under a 10yr/100k warranty??? My father's 94 previa has a 10yr/100k warranty on all of it... though we didnt need to replace a thing.

JMH

 

[PandaBear]

quote:

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and we get "US models" from Ford and GM. Interesting that both companies are making money elsewhere in the world too. There's a lesson in there somewhere but no one seems to be listening.

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Not just the domestic, I absolutely want to wack Honda for the last/current generation of bloated Accord while the rest of the world enjoy TSX as their accord.

 

[JHZR2]

yeah but the TSX without all the acura doodads and fancy electronics is just another economy car. Nothing special.

JMH

 

[XS650]

quote:

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Originally posted by JHZR2:
yeah but the TSX without all the acura doodads and fancy electronics is just another economy car. Nothing special.

JMH

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At it's roots it's an excellent handling good performing compact sedan. Definitely Euro class handling. That's the market it (Euro Accord, which is what the TSX is) was designed for.

 

[H2GURU]

To be successful in a business that sells things to customers, you have to know who your customers are. If you want to stay successful you have to make what they want and, somestimes, make what they NEED even if the customer doesn't know it yet. The Asian manufacturers make a heck of a product and stand behind it. I just took a "98 Corolla to the dealer with CEL problem and after 8 years it was taken care of for ZIP! Because these manufacturers are from natural resource poor areas, they built very effecient vehicles and they probably knew this going forward. They were late to the "dance with their larger SUVs and that will turn out even better for them even though they saw it as a waste of fuel at the time. Too bad for the US auto workers that the MEATHEADS at the top that got paid rather well to rudder their ship were too busy doing nothing and many will suffer because of this. Many cuts will be made, even at industries entirely unrelated to the automotive field because a precedent of huge GIVE-BACKS has been established, or will be soon enough. Anyone employed by someone else will feel this pain in varrying degrees.

 

[Papa Bear]

H2GURU: I have a '98 Corolla with cel P0441 . How did you get yours fixed N/C ??
P.B.

 

[outersquare]

quote:

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Originally posted by XS650:

quote:

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Originally posted by JHZR2:
yeah but the TSX without all the acura doodads and fancy electronics is just another economy car. Nothing special.

JMH

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At it's roots it's an excellent handling good performing compact sedan. Definitely Euro class handling. That's the market it (Euro Accord, which is what the TSX is) was designed for.

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double wishbone suspension at all 4 wheels too

 

[Auto-Union]

I had a TSX loaner...FAT!

 

[Win]

quote:

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Originally posted by XS650:
I've noticed that appoligists for the US auto industry use the word "percieved" a lot.

It's very similar to a word the US auto industry uses when talking about foreign competition "perceived".

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I drove a Honda today, for the first time in 23 years. It was a 2003 Honda Accord, 2.4 four cylinder VTEC, four door, auto, with 50K miles.

I took it out to fill it up (top tier 87 octane), and drove it about 25 miles after that, mixed highway and around town. It had a rattle in the passenger door, another smaller rattle in the driver door, and the passenger seat back rattled.

The body looked to be put together OK, but nothing great. The panels were thin compared to the panels in my GTO. The windshield had a crack from what looked to be a very minor stone encounter.

The carpet in the passenger compartment was either wearing through, or pulling loose from an attachment point. The plastic on the dash and door tops was OK, nothing great, the rest of the plastic looked cheesy cheap. The cloth on the seats looked no better than the cloth in my cheap '99 S-10, and did not appear to be wearing well. Actually the S-10 cloth is better. The 2003 cloth was better than the potato sack cloth I had in my old Honda, although that's not saying much.

The quality of the materials was vastly inferior to the quality of materials in my GTO - it's not even a fair comparison.

The steering was vague, the brakes grabby and not very progressive thereafter (I'm sure the brakes and tires were as fitted OEM and maybe new replacements would improve the steering and braking). It rode fine, pretty good actually, and the auto tranny shifted well without any judder on pick up, and didn't hunt for gears, but I can say the same about the GM Hydra Matics that I have in my cars.

The 2.4 VTEC was a joke. I kept waiting for the VTEC to kick it in but it was gutless from off idle to 6250 rpm where it would shift (my V12 revs higher, a LOT higher, than that. For that matter, my pushrod LS1 revs at least that high). I couldn't tell VTEC did a darn thing. You could shave, make a few phone calls, etc., waiting for this thing to hit 70.

On it's very best day, this is a mediocre car. GM is easily building cars as good as this car, and better looking.

 

[brian fix]

At work when we specifie a project,we only use union workers ,because they are much better trained to perform the task,plumbing,electrical steam fitting etc,as we are a health care facility,union workers do a better job in all facits on produce,its the management grubbing for their way over paid jobs,and over staffed positions.BL

 

[Auto-Union]

quote:

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Originally posted by Win:

quote:

---

Originally posted by XS650:
I've noticed that appoligists for the US auto industry use the word "percieved" a lot.

It's very similar to a word the US auto industry uses when talking about foreign competition "perceived".

---

I drove a Honda today, for the first time in 23 years. It was a 2003 Honda Accord, 2.4 four cylinder VTEC, four door, auto, with 50K miles.

I took it out to fill it up (top tier 87 octane), and drove it about 25 miles after that, mixed highway and around town. It had a rattle in the passenger door, another smaller rattle in the driver door, and the passenger seat back rattled.

The body looked to be put together OK, but nothing great. The panels were thin compared to the panels in my GTO. The windshield had a crack from what looked to be a very minor stone encounter.

The carpet in the passenger compartment was either wearing through, or pulling loose from an attachment point. The plastic on the dash and door tops was OK, nothing great, the rest of the plastic looked cheesy cheap. The cloth on the seats looked no better than the cloth in my cheap '99 S-10, and did not appear to be wearing well. Actually the S-10 cloth is better. The 2003 cloth was better than the potato sack cloth I had in my old Honda, although that's not saying much.

The quality of the materials was vastly inferior to the quality of materials in my GTO - it's not even a fair comparison.

The steering was vague, the brakes grabby and not very progressive thereafter (I'm sure the brakes and tires were as fitted OEM and maybe new replacements would improve the steering and braking). It rode fine, pretty good actually, and the auto tranny shifted well without any judder on pick up, and didn't hunt for gears, but I can say the same about the GM Hydra Matics that I have in my cars.

The 2.4 VTEC was a joke. I kept waiting for the VTEC to kick it in but it was gutless from off idle to 6250 rpm where it would shift (my V12 revs higher, a LOT higher, than that. For that matter, my pushrod LS1 revs at least that high). I couldn't tell VTEC did a darn thing. You could shave, make a few phone calls, etc., waiting for this thing to hit 70.

On it's very best day, this is a mediocre car. GM is easily building cars as good as this car, and better looking.

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Yeah, right!

 

[Bamaro]

Unions are partly to blame. Because of contracts signed years ago (I know, mgt signed them) GM has a hard time building a car at a competative price so they probably take shortcuts as a result. The assembly plant closed here a year ago and the laid off workers still draw 90% of their pay. Also, retirement/health costs alone contribute over 1000/vehicle additional costs that the asian companies dont have to pay.