unk bulk 5w-20 w/ 1 qt of MMO. 5.7 Hemi 4,133 OCI

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tackleberry625

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Comments from Blackstone:

“Universal averages show average wear for this type of engine after about 5,100 miles on the oil.
This oil wasn't in use that long, and wear metal accumulation was low and in the correct balance, so no evident problems with internal engine components using the oil exist. Silicon was much higher than average. It can represent either harmless silicone-based product, or dirt. We doubt it's dirt since wear looks okay, but we recommend checking air filtration, just in case. No fuel or signs of coolant were present, and low insolubles show good oil filtration. Looking solid!”

2008 Dodge Charger police/pursuit vehicle. Mileage on vehicle is 24,200. Mileage on oil was 4,133. Oil filter was Napa Gold. Unk bulk 5w-20 oil with 1 quart of MMO added at the beginning of the OCI when the oil was put in service (6 quarts oil, 1 qt MMO = 7 quart sump). During the OCI, the vehicle was pushed hard on a daily basis. 10-15 idle to full throttle take offs and then redlines during each time on each shift. At times, the vehicle idles for hours at a time. Universal Averages are on the right.



ALUMINUM 1/2
CHROMIUM 0/1
IRON 11/19
COPPER 39/41
LEAD 1/1
TIN 2/0
MOLYBDENUM 13/74
NICKEL 0/1
MANGANESE 1/1
SILVER 0/0
TITANIUM 0/0
POTASSIUM 8/2
BORON 12/45
SILICON 30/9
SODIUM 19/21
CALCIUM 1687/2237
MAGNESIUM 14/76
PHOSPHORUS 641/646
ZINC 764/789
BARIUM 5/0


SUS Viscosity @ 210°F – 51.9 / 46-59
cSt Viscosity @ 100°C – 7.86 / 6.0-10.2
Flashpoint in °F – 400 / >355
Fuel % - < 2.0
Antifreeze % - 0/0
Water % - 0/ Insolubles – 0.3/ NO TBN
 
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Very Impressive results!

I am using MMO in my oil now as well in a few vehicles (been using in the gas for a while now), but have bumped my normal 5W20 weights to 5W30 to compensate for the slight thinning that MMO can do.

I see the MMO appears to have thinned your 5W20 to the lower end of the 20 range, but wear was still exceptional - especially considering all the idle time this OCI had.

Even with the solvents MMO contains that everyone gets all up in arms about, this is now the second or 3rd impressive analysis I have seen using MMO - starting to see a trend here.
 
I have been using MMO for years (approx 16 or so) but this is the first time I did a UOA with it. I mainly did this to prove all of the MMO bashers wrong and to show that MMO does not destroy your engine oil or harm your engine by washing the oil off your cylinder walls because of the solvents in the MMO.
 
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Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
Very Impressive results!

I am using MMO in my oil now as well in a few vehicles (been using in the gas for a while now), but have bumped my normal 5W20 weights to 5W30 to compensate for the slight thinning that MMO can do.

I see the MMO appears to have thinned your 5W20 to the lower end of the 20 range, but wear was still exceptional - especially considering all the idle time this OCI had.

Even with the solvents MMO contains that everyone gets all up in arms about, this is now the second or 3rd impressive analysis I have seen using MMO - starting to see a trend here.


I don't know if the MMO thinned out the oil or if it was thinned because of the abuse the vehicle takes on a daily basis and the oil was just simply wearing out already. I did not spend the extra money and get a TBN because I have to have the oil changed every 4K per policy. I did notice the engine had less "clacking" when it idled during the OCI with the MMO. It's a hard noise to explain. The closest thing that comes to mind is when the car idles, the engine sounds like it has worn out hydraulic lifters and they are loosing their prime. I was told by Dodge that it was a "normal HEMI sound". When I had the MMO in, the noise was barely noticeable if at all.
 
Originally Posted By: tackleberry625
I did notice the engine had less "clacking" when it idled during the OCI with the MMO. It's a hard noise to explain. The closest thing that comes to mind is when the car idles, the engine sounds like it has worn out hydraulic lifters and they are loosing their prime. I was told by Dodge that it was a "normal HEMI sound". When I had the MMO in, the noise was barely noticeable if at all.


I have heard the hemis do seem to have quite of bit of valvetrain "clatter".

This is also not he first time I have heard MMO in the oil reduces engine noise, seems to be from the friction reduction it is known for.
 
Originally Posted By: sw99
Very nice UOA in a police car! I know our cops drive the cars like they stole them...



yup, I do the same but not by choice. When people are traveling 85mph up to 126mph, i have to push the car hard to run them down. I was impressed with the UOA myself.
 
That's some tough bulk oil....overall good UOA for the usage. MMO flows like water through the valvetrain. Used it on several occasions to free dirty hydraulic roller lifters.
 
Nice results with the qt of MMO. I'm impressed, my father always said it was the real deal.

AD
 
Originally Posted By: Rabbler
Does this car have the MDS system?
That would probably account for some valve train noise.


Sorry it took me so long to get back, I was out of town for a while. Yes it does. I get 23-24 mpg when I am able to keep my foot off the gas. You mainly hear the noise when the engine is idling. It almost sounds like the car has worn out hydraulic lifters that are trying to get oil. It is much louder when I do not use the MMO.
 
Originally Posted By: ADFD1
Nice results with the qt of MMO. I'm impressed, my father always said it was the real deal.

AD


I have never had any problems with MMO.
 
Originally Posted By: tackleberry625
Originally Posted By: Rabbler
Does this car have the MDS system?
That would probably account for some valve train noise.


Sorry it took me so long to get back, I was out of town for a while. Yes it does. I get 23-24 mpg when I am able to keep my foot off the gas. You mainly hear the noise when the engine is idling. It almost sounds like the car has worn out hydraulic lifters that are trying to get oil. It is much louder when I do not use the MMO.


That is indeed a normal Hemi sound. Actually, its pretty normal for any pushrod engine with an awkward valvetrain geometry like a Hemi has. Big-block Chevies used to make that noise. The 426 Hemi made that noise. The old polyshperic head Chrysler smallblocks did too. Its just the lateral movement of some parts in the rocker train as the clearances close up when the valve starts to lift.
 
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: tackleberry625
Originally Posted By: Rabbler
Does this car have the MDS system?
That would probably account for some valve train noise.


Sorry it took me so long to get back, I was out of town for a while. Yes it does. I get 23-24 mpg when I am able to keep my foot off the gas. You mainly hear the noise when the engine is idling. It almost sounds like the car has worn out hydraulic lifters that are trying to get oil. It is much louder when I do not use the MMO.


That is indeed a normal Hemi sound. Actually, its pretty normal for any pushrod engine with an awkward valvetrain geometry like a Hemi has. Big-block Chevies used to make that noise. The 426 Hemi made that noise. The old polyshperic head Chrysler smallblocks did too. Its just the lateral movement of some parts in the rocker train as the clearances close up when the valve starts to lift.


The service guy at Dodge said the same thing. I was worried because of the noise. I had a 79 Trans Am with a 400 CI Pontiac engine and it began to make the same engine sounds. I bought the car used with a lot of miles on it. I replaced the cam and lifters, because it sounded like the lifters were tapping, and the sound went away. I never really worked on Mopar products much mainly Ford and Chevy (GM). Guess that's the sound of newer Mopar engines.
 
According to their website, they are just a supplier.

They supply Shell, Castrol, Coastal, Motorcraft, 76 and Kendall.

So I guess the bulk oil could be one of these.
 
So was it the thinned oil that quited the valve train noise. May be better flow? Or was it some cleaning? Might be interesting to see if with a fresh oil change and no MMO, whether or not the valve train is still quiter or gets back to noisy.

I read a prior post about your wifes Honda ride that had seen some MMO, and did not see any improvement, in valve noise, nor rough idle. You had mentioned that ARX turned that motor around.

Would be interesting to see if ARX had the same effect on this hemi motor, perhaps just running a 3 ounce maintenance dose. Just throwing this out for kicks.
 
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