Toyota TV commercial

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
No maybes. It was uncalled for, period.

However, I would love to hear more about your qualifications to discuss Japanese tradition and culture.

I'd also like to know more about your knowledge of exactly what went on inside Toyota's management during this crisis that informs you so well as to who was responsible for what.

You know, whenever you get a chance.



I don't have a beef with you, so why all of the animus/abject sarcasm??

OK, YES, it was uncalled for, happy now?

BTW; no, I do not have a doctorate in japanese studies/culture, but I have learned a good deal about the subject through my 55 years on this globe, and from having worked for the Nippon Giant/Juggernaut for a time (in a corporate parts distribution center, NOT a dealership!).
I HAVE seen first hand exactly what goes on, how they think, and was even a whistle blower on one of their attempted cover ups while I was there.

PLEASE DO NOT start the tired old 'sour grapes' [censored] like the TOYboyzz do in defense EVERY time I bring this up on this import biased site.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: dailydriver
I don't have a beef with you, so why all of the animus/abject sarcasm??

Because ranting and raving and calling for heads on sticks only perpetuates an environment in which knee-jerk reactions are more important than facts. It's blatantly obvious that Toyota is in the wrong. We can flesh out exactly how and to what extent, and what to do about it, through rational conversation. Acting like an animal prevents that conversation from taking place.

Let's not forget that Toyota got where it is because they were overly afraid of exactly the kind of thing that is going on now: bad publicity and bad feelings with virtually no factual basis. How many people actually know what the defect rates are, how long they hid the problem, and why they did what they did? No one even cares. Every time someone tries to talk publicly about it in those terms, they are either completely ignored or labeled as Toyota apologists regardless of what they are actually saying. People are content just to cry bloody murder. Of course Toyota is responsible for their mistakes, but it strikes me as a bit hypocritical to expect better from them when all we do is hoot and holler.

More broadly, I want companies to do things that make sense. A prerequisite for that is a customer base that reacts rationally. Any reaction that is irrational or obscures an important issue undermines that idea. Therefore, it is hostile to my interests -- and, whether you will admit it or not, to your interests as well.

We owe it to ourselves to act like adults here.

 

[Bryanccfshr]

+1

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
I don't have a beef with you, so why all of the animus/abject sarcasm??

Because ranting and raving and calling for heads on sticks only perpetuates an environment in which knee-jerk reactions are more important than facts. It's blatantly obvious that Toyota is in the wrong. We can flesh out exactly how and to what extent, and what to do about it, through rational conversation. Acting like an animal prevents that conversation from taking place.

Let's not forget that Toyota got where it is because they were overly afraid of exactly the kind of thing that is going on now: bad publicity and bad feelings with virtually no factual basis. How many people actually know what the defect rates are, how long they hid the problem, and why they did what they did? No one even cares. Every time someone tries to talk publicly about it in those terms, they are either completely ignored or labeled as Toyota apologists regardless of what they are actually saying. People are content just to cry bloody murder. Of course Toyota is responsible for their mistakes, but it strikes me as a bit hypocritical to expect better from them when all we do is hoot and holler.

More broadly, I want companies to do things that make sense. A prerequisite for that is a customer base that reacts rationally. Any reaction that is irrational or obscures an important issue undermines that idea. Therefore, it is hostile to my interests -- and, whether you will admit it or not, to your interests as well.

We owe it to ourselves to act like adults here.



I did not call for anyone's "head on a stick".

In fact, I have tried to show some restraint in this whole debacle (and I could have gone completely hog wild on TOY and it's worshipping supporters on here, due to the way they incessantly, blindly BASH any/everything from a domestic parent company).

But, NO MATTER WHAT YOU (and the others on here) say, I WILL continue to defend MY country's companies and products.

If that entails bringing up this TOY garbage to remind the GM/domestic manufacturer lambasting sheeple that their 'automotive deity' is NOT the epitome of perfection they believe it to be, then so be it.

I am even willing to accept a ban for this cause.

 

[mikered30]

 

[Hermann]

Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: Durango
If it's the same TV commercial that's running here in California then you know Toyota running scared. After the smoke clears Toyota may have to pull out.

Of what, the U.S. domestic market??!!
One could ONLY; hope, wish and pray for that brother!!!

But it ain't gonna happen, not with the loyal, brainwashed masses clinging to their TOYS until even death.

Dude, you really are as big of a jerk, as you appear to be. Nothing worse than a closed mind.

 

[cousincletus]

I'd like to see Toyota run out of the USA too. Too bad it's always our industries being run under.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: dailydriver
I have tried to show some restraint in this whole debacle (and I could have gone completely hog wild on TOY and it's worshipping supporters on here, due to the way they incessantly, blindly BASH any/everything from a domestic parent company).

"Unlike, sadly enough, our nation and it's foreign/Asian product brainwashed, sheeple, consumerist populace."
"But it ain't gonna happen, not with the loyal, brainwashed masses clinging to their TOYS until even death."

You call this restraint?


Originally Posted By: dailydriver
But, NO MATTER WHAT YOU (and the others on here) say, I WILL continue to defend MY country's companies and products.

Let me give you a piece of advice. If your defense consists of fighting bashing with bashing, I'm pretty sure your country's companies can do without it.


Originally Posted By: dailydriver
I am even willing to accept a ban for this cause.

How noble of you. But as much as I hate to break it to you, you should know that this doesn't make you more right, nor does it make people more willing to listen to you.

Except some forum mods, maybe. Just sayin'.

 

[javacontour]

Originally Posted By: cousincletus
I'd like to see Toyota run out of the USA too. Too bad it's always our industries being run under.


Yes, by American Executives!

The CEO of Toyota's entire team combined compensation isn't even as much as the top guy at GM.

No matter what you think of their respective levels of competence, you can't convince me that guy at the top of GM, driving it to bankruptcy is worth more than a team of 20 or more at Toyota.

So if American companies are being run under, it's an inside job. The folks at Toyota, or Honda or Nissan can't make the bad decisions for the US car companies.

If US companies die, it's because they were unable to adapt in a more competitive world.

Study history.

Don't you think the US was like China with respect to Europe a couple of hundred years ago? Business in Europe started to make things in "The Colonies" because there were advantages to making in there and shipping it back.

The tables are turning today. Other nations are becoming more competitive, and we have to work harder to maintain our current standards.

The same team doesn't win the Super Bowl or World Series every year. Some teams have good runs, and go on winning streaks. But those are temporary. Teams change, others get better, good teams get fat and lazy.

The other teams were getting better while were were/are getting fat and lazy.

Don't blame the other teams for getting better. They want to win just as much as you want the US to win.

Nobody wins by talking down the other team. You have to play the game, or win in the market place. Talk is cheap, results count.

That's true for Toyota, GM, or anyone else.

BTW, I'll remind you that it's those same executives of the US car makers that are closing the US plants, buying more parts from China, choosing to build more vehicles in Mexico, and still ask you and me to "Buy American."

Like I've said before, if they really mean that, then let them set the example by building a 100% American sourced car before they run another "Buy American" commercial.

Until they follow their own advice with the sourcing of their parts, where the board of directors sits really doesn't matter to me.

I'll buy what I like and what best suits my family.

After, isn't that what the executives at Chrysler are doing when they close the plant here in St. Louis and build the RAM truck in Mexico? If it's good enough for them, then it's gotta be good enough for my family.

 

[SuperBusa]

Every car company has it's issues/problems/recalls/TSBs ... it's just Toyota's turn to be the focus of attention. Next month it will be GM, Ford or Chrysler ... or whoever.

Nobody cares about Tiger Woods fiasco anymore - the same will be true about Toyota when the next hot news item surfaces.

Domestic vs. Foreign ... Ford vs. Chevy ... Democrats vs. Republicans ... X vs. Y ... it's all B.S. for feeble minds to argue about. Just some unbiased perspective.

 

[yeti]

superbusa -- i only read posts at random on threads of this nature, as much of their content is inane. of the ones that i have read, yours is the only intelligent one. maybe the mods will show mercy, and kill this thread. have a good night.

 

[artificialist]

Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Absolutely spot on. Toyotas and other imports are not really more reliable than Ford and GM. What is so annoying is the erroneous perception that is being created and perpetuated by the automotive media. It's not really factual.

YUP!
And I DO suspect some MAJOR payola to them from TOY, and Japan, Inc.

It's amazing just how easily brainwashed the American public really is, and how fast they forget what rustbucket Ps.O.S. the early Nippon/TOY products were, i.e.; Toyopets, Coronas, etc.

My dad got better service from his 1971 and 1979 Toyota Corollas than nearly everyone else he knew.

When you live where there is no road salt, the game completely changes.

And just how good where American cars of similar size? I see no praise for the Chevy Vega or Ford Pinto.

Anyway, Toyota did make their errors, but they are a fraction of what happened with other auto builders.

Electronic throttles will be a fact of life, because in order to pass tougher smog tests, engine management has to be more accurate than ever, and electronic throttles enable that.

Toyota would hardly be a dent in the US auto business if American small cars and trucks were equally as durable as the equivalent Toyota by the year 1987.

 

[Jonny Z]

Originally Posted By: dailydriver

PLEASE DO NOT start the tired old 'sour grapes' [censored] like the TOYboyzz do in defense EVERY time I bring this up on this import biased site.

Anything is BIASED, if you are in disagreement with it. LOL

 

[expat]

Originally Posted By: artificialist
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Absolutely spot on. Toyotas and other imports are not really more reliable than Ford and GM. What is so annoying is the erroneous perception that is being created and perpetuated by the automotive media. It's not really factual.

YUP!
And I DO suspect some MAJOR payola to them from TOY, and Japan, Inc.

It's amazing just how easily brainwashed the American public really is, and how fast they forget what rustbucket Ps.O.S. the early Nippon/TOY products were, i.e.; Toyopets, Coronas, etc.

My dad got better service from his 1971 and 1979 Toyota Corollas than nearly everyone else he knew.

When you live where there is no road salt, the game completely changes.

And just how good where American cars of similar size? I see no praise for the Chevy Vega or Ford Pinto.

Anyway, Toyota did make their errors, but they are a fraction of what happened with other auto builders.

Electronic throttles will be a fact of life, because in order to pass tougher smog tests, engine management has to be more accurate than ever, and electronic throttles enable that.

Toyota would hardly be a dent in the US auto business if American small cars and trucks were equally as durable as the equivalent Toyota by the year 1987.


I tend to agree, it is history that forms our perceptions.
If a product has 'Historically' been good, we assume it may be good.
I do not believe the latest domestics are that bad, But they have yet to produce a shinning icon of reliability to build a reputation upon.

 

[97tbird]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa


Nobody cares about Tiger Woods fiasco anymore - the same will be true about Toyota when the next hot news item surfaces.


I don't know about that: TW's fiasco didn't really kill people, did they?
It seems some Toyotas ..well, a LOT of them, can have the potential to kill you on the road. That won't be forgotten easily - people will think of this when they car shop for years to come - and they SHOULD:

It seems that Toyota has been b.s.sing customers and lying to them about those defects (sudden acceleration) for years and always blamed the customers that they "pushed the wrong pedal" etc etc, when they contacted Toyota around 2006-2007.
If those reports are true, they should be sued.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: 97tbird
It seems some Toyotas ..well, a LOT of them, can have the potential to kill you on the road.

Well... Sorta.

The same gas pedal was used in MOST of their lineup, including most of their top sellers. That's one reason why it affected so many people, and it's the main reason why all those models had to be recalled. By the same token, the actual defect rate is not as big as it appears based on the size of the recall, and thus neither is the actual risk involved in driving any given Toyota.

Of course, any death due to a stupid oversight is one too many, which is why the real problem is what you alluded to here:


Originally Posted By: 97tbird
It seems that Toyota has been b.s.sing customers and lying to them about those defects (sudden acceleration) for years and always blamed the customers that they "pushed the wrong pedal" etc etc, when they contacted Toyota around 2006-2007.
If those reports are true, they should be sued.

Everything I am reading, hearing, and seeing says that Toyota easily could have caught the problem sooner if they had looked into the early reports more diligently instead of just settling the lawsuits and moving on. This is one thing the domestic auto makers have been much better about in recent history.

It also appears that Toyota can and will be sued. A lot.

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: 97tbird
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa


Nobody cares about Tiger Woods fiasco anymore - the same will be true about Toyota when the next hot news item surfaces.


I don't know about that: TW's fiasco didn't really kill people, did they?


There are a lot of things in the world that kill people every day that are caused by human over site. These things happen, and as these kinds of incidents increase then people start focusing and investigating to find the root cause ... then everything becomes more clear. Just to name a few that come to mind - I'm sure this is one small slice of the pie:

Ford SUV Goodyear tire incident.
Many different ecoli contaminated food incidents.
Pinto gas tank explosions.
GM pickup side gas tank explosion (tank outside of frame rail).
Suzuki motorcycle cam-chain tensioner failures, causing engine lockup and crashes.
Various infant deaths due to dangerous product designs.
Various Chinese lead and other dangerous chemicals used in products.

Just search the internet for dangerous consumer products and you will find hundreds.

Yes, the problem Toyota has is not trivial, and it needs to be resolved. Toyota seems to be making every effort to do so - just like any other big high profile company would probably do. If they knew about this problem and were trying to cover up things long before this all hit the fan, then that isn't right - the lawsuits will have to figure that one out. But remember it may take some time for enough incidents and evidence to point to a particular problem and the root cause. Nobody forces anyone to buy something they don't want ... so if some people still want to defend and buy a Toyota after all this B.S. then who cares ... it's their choice and nobody else.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Ford SUV Goodyear tire incident

Did you mean Firestone?

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Ford SUV Goodyear tire incident

Did you mean Firestone?


Yeah ... one of the American made tires ...

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Ford SUV Goodyear tire incident

Did you mean Firestone?


Yeah ... one of the American made tires ...

They've been owned by Bridgestone, which is Japanese, since 1988. LOL.