Toyota mileage scam? Why the difference?

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OilFool

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I just posted in another topic about ethanol and it reminded me of this, so let me wonder out loud and see what ideas you can throw out.

Driving to and from New Jersey and South Carolina... Toyota Tacoma and Toyota Sienna
My girl and I do this three times a year together, yet in separate vehicles. (for animal rescue)

She follows me, we stop for gas together, everything exactly the same, so traveling closer or further to gas stations is taken out of the equation.
My odometer shows 759 miles driven
Hers only shows 706 miles driven

Tires were brand new on both vehicles for one trip down and up and properly sized to OE equipment. Same results. Tread wear discrepancies are thrown out on that alone.

So, maybe Toyota does not compensate for tire/gearing differences between the Tacoma models/trim lines...
Base, Pre-runner, X-Runner, TRD and so forth?
The Sienna only came with one tire/wheel size and auto trans, but Tacomas tire/wheel combos can vary as well as transmissions. From the Automatics to the manual 5 and manual 6 speeds.

So mileage-wise, either her van is "aging" slower or my Taco is "aging" quicker, either way, resale values could be hurt if all things were equal.
 
In my 2008 Tacoma TRD the speedo was off on the OEM 265/70-16 tires. I run 265/75-16 tires now, which has corrected the speedo (verified by GPS).
 
Originally Posted By: NMBurb02
Wow, that's 7.5% difference! Have you run any calculations to see what your odo would show with different tires/tranny/gearing?



No. Never really thought about it until typing in another thread on here.

But EVERY "mile" is the same when we make these trips. We don't change lanes in the exact spot, but when I go over, she goes over... gas station distances are ruled out immediately and it just so happened that we both needed tires and could not pass up the offer we got, so it rules out tread depth and rotations of the tires.
 
I've heard it said that no two cars come off the assembly line with the speedos (and by extension odometers) calibrated the same.

Unless you have a GPS speedo, +/- 7.5% between two different cars is probably not too bad of a margin of error.

Does either of the vehicles in question have a tachometer? Calculate your speed in top gear at, say, 3000 RPM, then go for a drive and compare the speedo reading at 3000 RPM to what you calculated.
 
Originally Posted By: MinamiKotaro
I've heard it said that no two cars come off the assembly line with the speedos (and by extension odometers) calibrated the same.

Unless you have a GPS speedo, +/- 7.5% between two different cars is probably not too bad of a margin of error.

Does either of the vehicles in question have a tachometer? Calculate your speed in top gear at, say, 3000 RPM, then go for a drive and compare the speedo reading at 3000 RPM to what you calculated.


I would believe it more so when everything was analog. Before drive by wire and "fake" gas pedals.

Both have Tachs... Will do when possible.
But the whole thing is, resale value. Not for me, but others. We are both driving them into the ground.

Base trims vs. premium trims... Base model can show less miles driven and the premium can show more miles hurting resale even more. I was talking Tacos to Tacos there for an example.
 
That's a huge difference. Not normal variation. The speedometer should read high, but the odometer should have a near-exact reading.

Which one is correct?

TireRack.com has the spec for rotations-per-mile for many of its tires. You'll see that it varies between tire models of a specific size, but not by much.

Tread wear matters less than a simple calculation would predict, since a radial tire travels on the belt circumference rather than the outside tire circumference. The tread blocks 'squirm' to match the flattened part of the belt.
 
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Originally Posted By: NHGUY
Time for the feds to investigate this and fine them again....

And make a vehicle donation to my gal
grin.gif
... (she is 501c3)

They were already impressed with the exceptional cleanliness of her 1MZ-FE sludge box, all while possibly giving them some ammo against consumers.
 
Originally Posted By: djb
That's a huge difference. Not normal variation. The speedometer should read high, but the odometer should have a near-exact reading.

Which one is correct?


Honestly, I don't really know. It seems to be hard to tell unless two vehicles stop at the same spots and such.
When we drive alone, we don't always stop at the same gas stations for many variables in MPG... Temperature, speed, wind direction, Sometimes a station will be a few miles off the interstate. Some may be closed... Making you drive more or less than usual.

But you get the whole point of we did/do everything the same and that threw out many variables.
 
Originally Posted By: OilFool

That is SPEEDometer. Not ODometer


OK, you are right. How about this:

Quote:
there are no federal laws that require manufacturers to ensure odometers are accurate. Rather, there are simply guidelines by the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) manufacturers may follow that call for a margin of error of 4 percent.


http://www.wsfa.com/story/19769079/tests-show-odometers-inaccurate-regardless-of-make-model

the 7.5% is still within the +/-4% x 2 (2 cars).
 
7.5% extra mileage is important for your warranty and resale if it is rather new.

Honda settled a lawsuit over this issue.
Use a gps to measure distance and compare to odometer reading or use highway markers to measure distance.


http://www.autoblog.com/2007/02/19/odo-uh-oh-honda-extending-warranties-on-6-million-cars/

"By John Neff RSS feed
Posted Feb 19th 2007 12:25PM
Honda has decided to settle a class-action lawsuit that alleges its odometers were racking up miles too fast. The automaker says odometers on some 6 million Hondas affected by the suit were accurate to within 3.75% on the high side. The NHTSA doesn't regulate odometer accuracy, and the only industry standard is a voluntary one set by the Society of Automotive Engineers that says odos should be within +/-4%. While the car's affected by the suit fall within that range, Honda recognized that its customers expected their odometers "would be based on zero," and they weren't. "
 
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Originally Posted By: OilFool

That is SPEEDometer. Not ODometer


OK, you are right. How about this:

Quote:
there are no federal laws that require manufacturers to ensure odometers are accurate. Rather, there are simply guidelines by the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) manufacturers may follow that call for a margin of error of 4 percent.


http://www.wsfa.com/story/19769079/tests-show-odometers-inaccurate-regardless-of-make-model

the 7.5% is still within the +/-4% x 2 (2 cars).


Originally Posted By: IntegraVT
According to this article I saved from Honda's odometer settlement, http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/money/autos/2007-02-19-odometer-usat_x.htm -

Quote:
The Society of Automotive Engineers' voluntary standard is plus or minus 4%, or no more than 4 miles high or low in every 100 miles.





Well, that seems to settle it. Thanks guys!

700 miles = 28x2=56
And it's 53 miles difference between us.
 
If someone is more erratic on the gas, and corrects more with the steering wheel because the ALIGNMENT is off...

Well that could be your problem right there.
 
Not MPG... just "miles" covered over a distance. Odometer...
Two cars, same exact route, same exact conditions, 53 miles more in one vehicle or 53 miles less in the other.
With the one time we drove on brand new tires... mount, balance, (free-lifetime)alignment and headed home.
 
With profiles in 5% increments, for any chosen width it's generally possible to choose a profile to keep the odo within about 1.5% to 2% percent of standard. So 7.5% really is unexpected, unless the profile on one of the cars was chosen as a fashion statement rather than for correct rolling circumference.
 
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