Toyota dealer uncertainty in the oil viscosity used

Messages
5,291
Location
Paramount, California
So, it's been one year since my car was manufactured in August 2019, and I took it to a local Toyota dealer today for the yearly oil change with the odometer at 5,851 miles, wearing my mask of course. This would be the first oil change since the factory fill, and it's a courtesy maintenance service during the first two years.

I chose this particular dealer because it was highly rated after I had bad experiences the last couple of times I took my car to another dealer. The other dealer put a P-metric tire instead of an ISO-metric tire, forgot to put on the valve caps, and forgot to put on the coolant reservoir cap.

I looked at the service request the service advisor printed out, and it showed SAE 0W-20 instead of the officially recommended SAE 0W-16. I showed it to him, and he showed me that on his computer it's showing the correct SAE 0W-16 viscosity and the technician would go with the latter. He convinced me that what was on the paper was perhaps some generic viscosity grade.

He said it would take about two hours; so, I decided to have a three-mile walk to do some shopping at Target and Smart & Final in 90-degree humid weather, carrying a heavy bag on the way back, which wasn't actually that bad, as I badly needed some exercise and sun with our coronavirus-restricted situation here. The car was ready about 20 minutes after I returned. They also gave it a courtesy wash in their very basic car wash even though I had later declined it when I saw and rethought it. I examined the valve caps and under the hood to make sure no caps were missing this time. Then I sat in the car and looked at the sticker on the window: "0W-20."

Should anyone care about this? Of course, everyone should. It has nothing to with whether 0W-20 is OK in this car or not. It has to do with principle. When you take your car to the dealer, you expect them to follow the official recommendations, whatever they are. If they don't, then you have little reason to trust what they are doing. What was the viscosity used by the technician? Did he bother to look at the oil-filler cap? I will never know. Sometimes you wonder if they have changed the oil at all.
 
Messages
172
Location
Los Angeles
They probably went with what was in the bulk drum since its a comp change. Best case scenario the computer is wrong throughout so the sticker is wrong as well.
 
Messages
4,865
Location
Pittsburgh,PA U.S.A.
They probably went with what was in the bulk drum since its a comp change. Best case scenario the computer is wrong throughout so the sticker is wrong as well.


Was the sticker filled in by hand by the technician. If it was there is a good chance that what the technician wrote is what was put in.
 
Messages
11,239
Location
Florida, Cape Coral
I agree that the dealer should put in the recommended viscosity of 0w16, unless the manufacture is put in optional viscosity. As stated, it is the principle of doing what they are supposed to do and not what they do. Complain to management and if you get rebuffed, then go to the district manager. Ed
 

CKN

Messages
5,958
Location
Utah
I agree that the dealer should put in the recommended viscosity of 0w16, unless the manufacture is put in optional viscosity. As stated, it is the principle of doing what they are supposed to do and not what they do. Complain to management and if you get rebuffed, then go to the district manager. Ed

Unbelievable...........
 
I try to stay away from dealers for this reason. Some cars don't really care what goes in them and your Toyota is probably one of them. I have two VW TDI cars and one came with a maintenance plan. They changed the oil and put high saps oil in it which is probably the worst thing that could go in there. They said it is fine, they use it in all their cars. I don't think that is fair to the customers. While it does bring in business in some instances, it isn't fair. I would make them put the right oil in there and watch them pour it in. That is exactly what I will do with VW next time. I changed it myself to the correct oil this time.
 
Messages
5,224
Location
NJ
It's a free oil change on a car that is barely driven. I wouldn't worry about it. Have to choice our battles and this isn't one I'd choose to fight or give another thought about. In 20 years, when you crack 100k miles, the engine will be in fine shape no matter 0w16 or 5w30 or anything between.
 
Messages
402
Location
AZ
Call back and ask if the -20 they used is a GF6A or GF6B oil. Keep the -20.

Tidbit:
The SAE 16 Viscosity Grade

On April 1, 2013 the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) introduced a new viscosity grade called SAE 16. This is a new high temperature viscosity grade hence it's not 16W just simply 16 or SAE 16. This is the lowest high temerature SAE engine oil viscosity grade yet, replacing SAE 20 in this role. The introduction of this viscosity grade is another step towards motor oils providing better and better fuel economy and such oils will most likely to be first recommended by companies that emphasize fuel economy oils (e.g. Ford, Honda).


When the first SAE 16 oils will appear (likely as 0W16 and 5W16 oils) they will only be suitable to be used in vehicles where the engine is designed to operate with such a low viscosity oil. Just as 5W20 and 0W20 oils these oils will also be unsuitable to be used in older engine designs since it would not provide sufficient wear protection on operating temperature.


The number 16 itself does not have a special meaning it does not point at any specific oil property, it is only the name of the viscosity grade. SAE decided to choose a number that breaks the must-be-divisible-by-5 rule to avoid any mix-up with the winter viscosities. SAE 15 would have been easy to confuse with 15W (even though the very same problem did not influence SAE's decision when SAE 20 was introduced).


With the introduction of SAE 16 the limit on 100 °C viscosity for SAE was changed from 5.6 cSt to 6.9 cSt minimum. SAE 20 oils didn't make use of this interval so far and the limits for SAE 16 partially extend to this segment. For an oil to be of SAE 16 viscosity grade its viscosity on 100 °C must be between 6.1 and 8.2 mm2/s and its HTHS viscosity must be at least 2.3 mPa*s.


The official SAE viscosity grades are now 0W, 5W, 10W, 15W, 20W, 25W, 16, 20, 30, 40, 50 and 60. SAE is considering introducing the 12, 8 and 4 viscosity grades when there will be demand by the car manufacturers. This also outlines the likely direction of the lubricant development: oils will become ever thinner but their advanced chemistry must make sure that they still provide the same or better protection as their older, thicker counterparts did.
That's the min #, and it's low.
 
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Messages
140
Location
Lafayette, Louisiana
If I’m not mistaken 0w20 is an option if 0w16 isn’t readily available. Same verbiage on Amsoil’s product guide. I’d assume they’d have a bulk tank of 0w16 by now which is odd that they’d use 0w20 unless they were somehow out which I doubt.
 
Messages
402
Location
AZ
Should anyone care about this? Of course, everyone should. It has nothing to with whether 0W-20 is OK in this car or not. It has to do with principle. When you take your car to the dealer, you expect them to follow the official recommendations, whatever they are. If they don't, then you have little reason to trust what they are doing. What was the viscosity used by the technician? Did he bother to look at the oil-filler cap? I will never know. Sometimes you wonder if they have changed the oil at all.
The manual does say "if 0w16 is not available, use 0w20". So they perhaps didn't have -16 available and did what the manual said to do? Call and ask if they have 0w16 for oil service.
 
Messages
3,334
Location
Parts Unknown
The manual does say "if 0w16 is not available, use 0w20". So they perhaps didn't have -16 available and did what the manual said to do? Call and ask if they have 0w16 for oil service.
But what kind of Toyota dealership doesn't have 0w16 on hand? Especially in California where hybrids and plug-in hybrids are popular.

Best thing to do is call Toyota corporate and open a case file.

What part number is listed?
0w-16 is 00279-16QTE
0w-20 is 00279-0WQTE
 
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Messages
402
Location
AZ
But what kind of Toyota dealership doesn't have 0w16 on hand? Especially in California where hybrids and plug-in hybrids are popular.

Best thing to do is call Toyota corporate and open a case file.

What part number is listed?
0w-16 is 00279-16QTE
0w-20 is 00279-0WQTE
Nice save on the oil mis-quote (quick edit).
But all their oils have all sorts of part numbers, even for same "grade".
 

Gokhan

Thread starter
Messages
5,291
Location
Paramount, California
The window sticker was printed.



I now understand the problem the dealer is having. They have this "10KSYN Service - 10,000 Mile Complimentary Service - Synthetic Oil Vehicles" code in the service request, which automatically brings up 0W-20. They don't seem to have any room for 0W-16 in their service codes.

Looking at the part number, they conveniently list it as "00279SYN," which is one number short of being identifiable as 0W-16 or 0W-20.

I really doubt the technician actually looks at the oil-filler cap.

There is no excuse for 0W-16 not being available at the Toyota dealer. It has been in use in the Camry Hybrid since 2018.
 
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Messages
3,334
Location
Parts Unknown
The window sticker was printed.



I now understand the problem the dealer is having. They have this "10KSYN Service - 10,000 Mile Complimentary Service - Synthetic Oil Vehicles" code in the service request, which automatically brings up 0W-20. They don't seem to have any room for 0W-16 in their service codes.

Looking at the part number, they conveniently list it as "00279SYN," which is one number short of being identifiable as 0W-16 or 0W-20.

I really doubt the technician actually looks at the oil-filler cap.

There is no excuse for 0W-16 not being available at the Toyota dealer. It has been in use in the Camry Hybrid since 2018.


Your next step:

 
Messages
517
Location
California
Gokhan to Toyota dealership service manager:
"Do you know who I am ?"

Insist that they special order one quart bottles of TGMO 0W16 SP.
Watch them drain the oil out and pour these one quart bottles in,
one at a time.
 
Messages
2,077
Location
NC
Sneaky that the part # leaves out the last digit. I wouldn’t be surprised if they don’t carry 0-16 in bulk and therefore just pump bulk 0-20 in all Toyota’s that need a 0-16 or 0-20 weight. 99% of folks probably don’t even care or know what oil goes in their cars.
 
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