Total quartz 9000 energy 0w30 UOA from a diesel?

Status
Not open for further replies.
they are geting the recommended oil at recommended interval, yet they fail at low mileages, as low as 15,000 even.

most are around 50,000 though
 
Originally Posted By: Jetronic
are there? Plenty of failed engines where I work, and if not the engine, failed turbo's.


Last few cars we did in my friend's garage;
07 Toyota Auris 2.0 D4D- HG and overheating. Reason: spot head overheating due to manufacturer error. Latef engines are modified.
07 Citroën Jumper 2.2 HDI, Puma engine- blown piston. Reason: injector failed.
99 FIAT Punto Sporting 1.2 16v- blown piston. Reason: HG went between number 1 and 2 cylinder allowing combustion mixing and overheating piston number 2.
08 PSA 1.6 HDI -turbo blown. Reason:clogged oil supply pipe for turbo due to a misuse by owners extending OCI and/or not following proper oil change procedure for this type of engine.

So in reality oil related issues today are rare, well at least in my experience.
 
i used to get on average 1 blown turbo per week in when I worked for peugeot. started with lease cars that had full dealer history, but soon private owners joined in the party.

also, the tensioner on the timimg chain between in and ex cam failed regularly, mostly on 2.0 and 2.2 engines

now I work for hyundai and mitsubishi and the party continues...

oh, and check here:
http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-mito/382494-multiair-failure-database.html

lots of spun bearings and thrown rods aswell on petrols
 
Esters would not have saved any of those engines because they are design/manufacturing faults and have nothing to do with the transition between boundary and hydrodynamic lubrication in a bearing.

Modern variable vane turbos usually fail because of unsympathetic driving from cold. They are at full boost at very low rpms before they have reach their ideal operating temperature.

This is the reason the turbo problems were first prevalent in lease cars (because they drive them with no respect) and then normal owners cars because the turbos get no time to warm up before they have to spin at max rpm.
 
The PSA 1.6HDi engines usually blow the turbos because of injector seals leaking combustion gases into the oil which overloads the oil with soot and clogs the oil pipes to the turbo.

After it has gotten so bad that the turbo has failed it's usually impossible to get all the carbon out of the engine. Some people (because they have not cured the injector seal problem) have replaced the turbo 3 times!!!
 
Even engines without leaking injector seals suffered with failed turbo's... at no point, and even today was the leaking injector seals determined as the cause for all the failed turbo's.

remember the 2.2 hdi (puma) in the boxer/jumper? It wasn't for sale for a while, customers received a free upgrade to 3.0 if they tried to order a 2.2. The reason was a fair number of engnes died, some as early as 700 km after delivery. While the cause was being investigated production was stopped. The cause was in the end to be found too high oil viscosity when (very) cold, causing the spray nozzles for the piston walls to get blocked. The design of the nozzles got changed I believe..

Not all engines failed though, and none got recalled to get the new nozzles, sosucks to be you if you buy an early specimen and pour an oil in with high viscosity when cold. If you're a careful driver when the engine is cold, it'll take a while though, but damage is being done nonetheless.
 
Originally Posted By: chrisri
Jetronic, never worked on a MA, and not much on a T-jet. What are issues on those engines?


sludge, and a fair number of the multiair units failed shortly after the first oil change (at 18k, 21k seems a typical mileage for failure). Still ongoing, though Alfa Romeo seems very forthcoming with goodwill if you have a full dealer history for maintenance, after the warranty period.

What oil is used by the Dodge Dart with the same engine? The OCI is reduced though, most likely due to sulfur in the fuel I would think?


Edit: no issues with the T-jet I'm aware of.

some turbo's went on the 1750 tbi though, again with 21k OCI
 
Last edited:
What I find most worrying with the diesel engines, is that the oil recommendations went from 10w40 to 5w40 B4, then 5w30 C2. Except for the 2.4, who always was kept on 5w40. Good mileage is not a concern for anyone considering a 210 bhp 2.4 though... Intervals went up from 12,000 to 21,000 miles or more.

The bottom end never changed, but there were a few changes in the design of the heads. I fear the longevity of the old units will not be matched by the newer ones if you stick to the recommendations. What will be left of a 2.9 hths and 10.x cst (kv100) oil after 10,000 miles, not even half of the current interval? Add to that fuel dilution and you'll have an engine ready for the scrapper at 150,000 miles. Also got stop start fitted now, which is even worse for long bearing life.
 
Originally Posted By: Jetronic
Even engines without leaking injector seals suffered with failed turbo's... at no point, and even today was the leaking injector seals determined as the cause for all the failed turbo's.

remember the 2.2 hdi (puma) in the boxer/jumper? It wasn't for sale for a while, customers received a free upgrade to 3.0 if they tried to order a 2.2. The reason was a fair number of engnes died, some as early as 700 km after delivery. While the cause was being investigated production was stopped. The cause was in the end to be found too high oil viscosity when (very) cold, causing the spray nozzles for the piston walls to get blocked. The design of the nozzles got changed I believe..

Not all engines failed though, and none got recalled to get the new nozzles, sosucks to be you if you buy an early specimen and pour an oil in with high viscosity when cold. If you're a careful driver when the engine is cold, it'll take a while though, but damage is being done nonetheless.


My ex firm bought 7 or 8 of those 2.2 Jumpers with puma engines. Only one went to 300k. I told him prior to buying to go with Ducato 2.3. But it was 2k € more expensive for basically the same van. No need to say he was very mad after first engine failure.
 
Originally Posted By: Jetronic
What I find most worrying with the diesel engines, is that the oil recommendations went from 10w40 to 5w40 B4, then 5w30 C2. Except for the 2.4, who always was kept on 5w40. Good mileage is not a concern for anyone considering a 210 bhp 2.4 though... Intervals went up from 12,000 to 21,000 miles or more.

The bottom end never changed, but there were a few changes in the design of the heads. I fear the longevity of the old units will not be matched by the newer ones if you stick to the recommendations. What will be left of a 2.9 hths and 10.x cst (kv100) oil after 10,000 miles, not even half of the current interval? Add to that fuel dilution and you'll have an engine ready for the scrapper at 150,000 miles. Also got stop start fitted now, which is even worse for long bearing life.


Engine will serve first owner just fine on C2 oil, but second hand market could easily end up like those 02-05 Renault diesels with every other car without engine.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top