top tier gas

i apologize if there is somewhere already on site but thought many of us might benefit from this info and stop buying additives and not knowing if we are helping the siutation. I am on my second tank so no observations yet but i have new car and old and the new car only has 5000 miles so i hope to make it last better with detergent gas enjoy all http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=27&article_id=9752&page_number=1
 
Messages
392
Location
Central Florida
Im sorry but Im just buying the "top tier" classification...Ive got a car that Ive run nothing but Shell gas for the first year...untill the knocking and pinging, then I switched to Chevron because I was told this was happening to me because of "bad gas"...and realize I only frequent the newest stations or the ones with the newest tanks....certainly Im partially to blame(driving habits, short trips) but Im not totally convenced detergents arent to blame as well. {quote]Buczynsky says the exact cause of engine deposits is not known. Gasoline contains over 200 different molecules, and so far, no one has isolated a particular brew that is more likely to cause engine deposits. GM and other manufacturers, however, noticed there were regional concentrations of fuel-system warranty claims and traced the problem to the fuel.[/quote] Oh no? They dont know what causes these deposits? Well how bout examining the deposits and figuring out this is a by product of in that chain of 200 molecules! I thought these companies employed chemists and engineers? I personally think gas quality(across the board, manufacture to manufacture) is (currently)crap! And that we the consumer are going to pay the price at the pump as well as at the service department...and friggin detergents arent the ansewer, they are part of the problem! Give me real gas!!!
 
Messages
392
Location
Central Florida
Yeah, could be(and as stated my driving habits)...and detergent gas could be the answer to everything as well...but are you totally satisified with the quality of gas youve been getting? Even with "top tier"? Well maybe you are satisfied...then again maybe you dont ask as much out of your car or gas. I personally expect a detergent gas to do what it claims to do...not gum up internals for the sake of making palletable gas that just gets by...especially at $2+ a gallon!
 
Messages
107
Location
SC
Question. Shell, for instance, is listed as a Top Tier retailer. Do ALL grades of Shell meet the Top Tier classification, or just the V Power? On a similar topic, is it true that the 87 octane Shell, for instance, comes out of the same tanker that delivered to the 2-pump convenience store up the street?
 
Messages
1,979
Location
Houston
"On a similar topic, is it true that the 87 octane Shell, for instance, comes out of the same tanker that delivered to the 2-pump convenience store up the street? " very possibly. the only advantage you have at the Shell station is that they will always get the same product, the conv. store may get leftovers from whatever tanker has a few gallons left after making the rounds. if you are picky about brands you probably don't buy gas at the convenience store anyway. At the convenience store you quite often get a major brand gas, you just don't know which one.
 
Messages
2,440
Location
snowblind in TX
You know when the tanker fills up at the rack the only difference is the additive package. Whatever brand he needs is just a pushbutton away on a keypad. Gas is gas, it all comes out of the same pipeline. Some cars like certain additive packs better than others. Even the no-name stations get the generic add packs in their deliveries. The only rule I have when buying gas is "Don't fill up when the tanker is dropping gas at the station".
 

Jay

Messages
1,607
Location
Idaho Falls, ID
The problem with gasoline is the paltry level of detergents set by the EPA--hence the Top Tier standard. In California, CARB sets the detergent level twice as high as the EPA, so the Top Tier standard isn't as important. We pay a lot of money for gasoline in this state, but it's good quality, low-sulfur fuel. Whenever I travel outside CA, I look for the top-tier brands or add detergent to the gas I buy.
 
Messages
1,680
Location
CT
Top tier are: QuikTrip Chevron Conoco Phillips 76 Shell Entec Stations MFA Oil Company what, no stop&shop  -
 
Messages
2,591
Location
MN
quote:
Originally posted by 1 FMF: Top tier are: QuikTrip Chevron Conoco Phillips 76 Shell Entec Stations MFA Oil Company what, no stop&shop  -
The Kwik Trip C stores in MN and WI are now Top Tier certified. There was just an article in the local paper about this and it is now on their website too. I think this Top Tier is BS and GM has problems with their injector design. There maybe some truth to the gas blends being the problem if the injector problems are localized. I know many people in my area with problems with injector fouling. All have GM vehicles. I have been buying fuel from Conoco stations that are supposed to be Top Tier and still have problems.
 
Messages
1,420
Location
Balto.
quote:
Originally posted by LTVibe: For Shell or any other oil company to be rated "Top Tier", all their octane grades must meet the same standards: "The deposit control performance of unleaded gasoline conforming to section 1 of this document shall be met at the retail level in all grades of gasoline..." http://www.toptiergas.com/deposit_control.html
True and also, in Shell's case, premium has even more detergency than required by top tier.
 
Messages
4,864
Location
Lakeville, MN
I saw the top tier signs at the local Kwik Trip also the other day (and no, this is NOT Quik Trip - they are different). Interesting to see since they historically have gotten gas from whichever terminal was cheapest around here. Perhpas they are now exclusively supplied by the same refiner that supplies Conoco/Phillips fuels in our market. (Note that we have three distinct separate refinery sources commonly used in the Twin Cities, with a fourth more common in northern MN).
 
Messages
1,187
Location
Southern Vermont
quote:
Originally posted by NovaMan: Shell regular and plus have twice the Top Tier requirement and premium (V-Power) has five times what's required to be Top Tier. http://www.shell.com/home/Framework?siteId=us-en&FC2=&FC3=/us-en/html/iwgen/news_and_library/press_releases/2004/top_tier_gasolines_06122004.html
========= Sorry, but you misread it. Regular and plus have over twice the EPA minimum. Premium V-Power has over five times the EPA minimum, which is also twice the Top Tier minimum. Shell also claims that the Premium V-Power can clean pre-existing deposits. No such claim is made for regular or plus grades. From the website you linked to: "Shell regular and Plus gasolines, which meet the “Top Tier” standard, also contain more than two times the amount of cleaning agents required by the EPA. Shell V-Power goes even further – it has more than five times the minimum amount of cleaning agents required by government standards and twice the cleaning agents required by the “Top Tier” standard. While the “Top Tier” standard is designed to protect engines from the future build-up of carbon deposits, Shell V-Power is specifically formulated to actively clean your engine as you drive giving it the ability to clean-up deposits that have already built up on intake valves and fuel injectors."
 
Messages
3,094
Location
Metro Detroit
quote:
Originally posted by tmorris1: I think this Top Tier is BS and GM has problems with their injector design. There maybe some truth to the gas blends being the problem if the injector problems are localized. I know many people in my area with problems with injector fouling. All have GM vehicles. I have been buying fuel from Conoco stations that are supposed to be Top Tier and still have problems.
So what about BMW, Honda and Toyota? Top Tier is not just GM after all. Do they all have injector problems? Could it actually be as they claim that EPA minimums aren't enough?
 
Messages
1,187
Location
Southern Vermont
BMW started having injector issues 20 years ago and was among the first to have their own tests of gasoline to ascertain what brands were most compatable with their injectors.
 
Messages
262
Location
Michigan
quote:
Originally posted by k1xv: Sorry, but you misread it. Regular and plus have over twice the EPA minimum. Premium V-Power has over five times the EPA minimum, which is also twice the Top Tier minimum.
You're right, my bad. I didn't read it especially carefully since it was 3:43AM when I posted it. [Duh!]
 
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