Timing belt replacement

[dlundblad]

Happy Tuesday BITOG.

I am going to attempt to do a timing belt change this weekend on the Volvo S60. I have watched a few Youtube videos (both did not use a camshaft holding tool) and I have a Haynes book in the mail too. Seems like a somewhat simple process, but once the marks on the intake and exhaust cams and crankshaft pully are lined up, obviously you don't want them to move.

In a video I watched, after the guy put a ratchet on the crankshaft and turned it 2 complete turns he noticed they moved and he had to redo it? What does this mean exactly? The video skipped over this part.. Did he just move them into place by hand or did he have to put a wrench back on the crankshaft pulley? Also, once they move after they are no longer held together with the belt, wouldnt the exhaust cam, intake cam and crankshaft be free to move wherever and be difficult to get back into place?

Here's the video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IK_zH8g8Fow
The part of the video in question is around 13:55.

 

[JC1]

It means that the cam is not in the correct position. I did the timing belt on a 3 liter V6 Toyota sienna. For my job I had to remove the belt and reset the timing marks with a ratchet turning the cams or crank in the direction or rotation which was clockwise.

If your a novice like i was this is the most important step in the job. I had to re thread my belt and reset the cams or cranks 10 times. What I learned was that I wasnt retightening the tensioner in the correct way. For that motor there were two bolts that you should alternate tightening two rotations at a time doing it slowly. Doing that part fast made the timing belt jump and knocked one of the cams out of alignment.

Once everything was in I checked for the timing marks to align up at least rotating 720 degress (two full rotations of crankshaft) 10 times.

Don't be in a rush to do this job.

 

[Kira]

It's early and I have to get out the door so I'll be brief.

Turn the cranksft so the marks line up then go past another 3/4 turn then GO BACKWARDS to line up the marks.
This brings the vvt system back to its "0".

Mine stayed put without aid the second time I did it but the first time I did it I tied the 2 cam sprockets together (before I removed the belt) with stout twine and had no problems.

When I return home I'll look at the video but I gotta run like a dear now. Cheers, Kira

 

[RooflessVW]

Mark the old belt and sprockets with a paint marker. Line the new and old belts up, and mark the exact same teeth.

If the marks line up, car is in time.

 

[eljefino]

The problem you'll face is the compressed valve springs really want to twist the cam either forward or backwards from TDC. I can handle one cam pretty easily but two is iffy. The cam casting should have a "flat" you can put an open wrench or vise grips on to get them all lined up on. Sometimes it's easier/ mandatory to match the sprockets to the belt before they're bolted to the cams, and to then hold the mess with one hand while rotating the cam with the other to get the sprocket key lined up.

I fake it all out by letting the cam sit at a naturally relaxed position and making the crank match. Usually about 3 teeth forward from TDC. Then I go through and double check by rotating a couple times.

 

[yvon_la]

i could be wrong but usually there a pin to be used to lock the cam shaft gear and various other gear in place. maybe they dont lock them in place with pin in place anymore? if you cant lock the timing gear crank gear and all the need to be locked i wouldnt mess with this job ! dont hammer the crank pully there is likely a puller tool for that job !

 

[SHOZ]

On my Accent 4 cyl, if I didn't keep the belt tight on the pull side when putting it on it would slip and the cam would move and be off a tooth every time when started. There has to be no slack at all between the crank and cam. I use a plastic hammer to slowly slip the belt over the cogged cam sprocket.

 

[Huie83]

If you can get a tool to hold your cam gears in place I'd highly recommend it. It will keep you from having to reset them after you knock them out of alignment like you inevitably will 5-6 times being your first timing belt change.

I just completed a timing belt job on my Subaru EJ25D, this is a quad cam motor so lots of timimg marks to line up. The left side cams are under valve spring tension when they are lined up and I knocked them out of alignment 4-5 times before I got it right. If I would have just spent the $50 on the cam sprocket tool to hold them in place I would have saved myself a ton on of aggravation....

Its a fun job though once you figure out the tricks for your vehicle.

One more thing to mention, make sure you replace all the idler rollers and belt tensioner ( if it has one) while you are in there. You don't want to have to do the job again in 10K when they go bad.

 

[cptbarkey]

Another vote for a cam lock tool. The net cost will still be fractional versus having someone do the job for you.

 

[mazdamonky]

I just used two adjustable wrenches and a zip tie to lock my cams in place. Put on the belt, cut the zip tie, engine turned over. If i am off by one tooth in either direction, my engine won't turn over completely I learned doing it before on another protege so I was looking for a better way to hold it still and noticed there was a hexagonal shaped spot on the cams.

 

[WobblyElvis]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
Mark the old belt and sprockets with a paint marker. Line the new and old belts up, and mark the exact same teeth.

If the marks line up, car is in time.


Roofless is absolutely right.

I would add a word of caution. Never rotate a shaft by itself more than a tooth or two unless the belt is on correctly. Rotating a shaft by itself [no belt on it] can cause internal engine damage.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: WobblyElvis
Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
Mark the old belt and sprockets with a paint marker. Line the new and old belts up, and mark the exact same teeth.

If the marks line up, car is in time.

Roofless is absolutely right.

I would add a word of caution. Never rotate a shaft by itself more than a tooth or two unless the belt is on correctly. Rotating a shaft by itself [no belt on it] can cause internal engine damage.


It can if the engine is an interference type, but if not then it won't. On my 1MZ-FE you can rotate the camshafts and the crankshaft independently of each other.

 

[berniedd]

Lock the cam gears in place before you remove the belt. I use a long bolt and nut with large washers at each end. The bolt goes in the space between the cam gears and the washers keep the gear teeth steady after I tighten the nut. I snowpake the old belt and gears and crankshaft before I get the belt off, then mark the same spots on the new belt before I slip it on. Never try to turn any gear before the belt is on securely.

 

[Astro14]

There isn't a readily available cam locking tool for this engine. The cam locking tool (seen here: http://www.amazon.com/Camshaft-Crankshaft-Alignment-Locking-Fixture/dp/B00AVLU3ZK )is used for camshaft seal replacement and locks the cams from the other side of the engine, requiring engine mount removal and replacement of the intake cam cover. That would add several hours to this job. If your cam seals are leaking, then you need this tool, and you should replace your PCV system which is what generally causes cam or crank seal leaking.

But locking the cams is not needed for this job anyway.

This is an interference engine. The timing marks are on the timing belt cover (that has to be removed to gain access, then partially re-installed to see the marks).

Turning the engine over twice resets all the marks to their starting point, and allows you to see if you missed a tooth through insufficient belt tension, or a cam moving slightly while the belt was installed.

Of the six or so times that I've done this job on my two Volvos, I was off by a tooth twice. I discovered that by turning the engine over twice and then realigning that one cam (exhaust in both cases) and moving the belt one tooth. Slacken the belt, but don't remove it. Move it just the one tooth on the pulley that is off.

IF you find that you're off by one tooth, fix it and then turn the engine over again to be certain.

Some Volvo specifics:

1. if this is the first belt change (90,000 to 120,000 miles, depending on year), then leave the water pump. Volvo pumps usually go to 180+. If this is the second belt change, then do the water pump. Use OE parts for the water pump. It adds 30 minutes to a timing belt change to replace the water pump. If the pump starts weeping, you're pulling the timing belt to replace it.

2. Replace the idler and tensioner pulleys. They are usually what fails, not the belt itself. Buy a set.

3. This is an interference engine.

4. The tensioner setting is temperature dependent. When at 68F, the tab should be in the middle of the bracket to have the correct tension.

5. If you're going to pull the crankshaft pulley, you'll need a holding tool. Some guys claim that they can change the belt without removing that pulley. I don't see how they did it, so I recommend that you either fabricate a tool, or buy one like this: https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/volvo-crankshaft-holding-tool-cta-2247-2248-1

6. The 4 pulley bolts are angle-torqued. They are very, very tight for their size. The center nut goes to 180NM. You'll need that counterhold and a good breaker bar.

7. This is a good resource for your car:
http://www.volvoxc.com/resources/how-to/ while focused on the XC, it's the same chassis and engine.

8. Here are instructions for doing the job: http://www.volvoxc.com/0/resources/how-to/pdf/timing-belt-replacement.pdf

9. The timing marks are on the cover. There is parallax error from where you see them, unless you hold a mirror (my recommendation) so that your line of sight is straight from pulley to timing cover notch. Highlight the pulley marks (which are a machined dot) with a red sharpie to help with contrast.

PM with questions.

Cheers,
Astro

 

[BigD1]

After watching that video, I am wondering why the belts are not marked. The Volvo 240 Contitech belts are manufactured with alignment marks to help keep every thing in time. I know the cover has the two timing marks, but it just seems to me if the belt was marked it would be a lot easier to keep the cam sprockets in time.

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted By: BigD1
After watching that video, I am wondering why the belts are not marked. The Volvo 240 Contitech belts are manufactured with alignment marks to help keep every thing in time. I know the cover has the two timing marks, but it just seems to me if the belt was marked it would be a lot easier to keep the cam sprockets in time.


It would be nice...

The belt on my 245 Turbo (B21FT) was marked. So was the belt on the 3VZE in the 4 Runner.

I see posts all the time in the Volvo forums about timing being off following a belt change by a "professional mechanic"...between the parallax error with the marks, and the difficulty in getting around the crank pulley, I'm certain those belts would be easier if marked.

The only issue with marking is that the crank pulley can't be seen from below. So, you couldn't see that mark. The crank mark on this engine is when a little notch in the crank pulley lines up with a tiny cast boss on the oil pump housing. The belt underneath is impossible to see, and it's easy to imagine that belt sitting on top of the crank pulley teeth, then slipping into the teeth as the belt is tensioned, with a 50/50 chance that it skips on to the correct spot...so, yeah, easier if marked, but it still would have to be checked!!

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: Astro14
There isn't a readily available cam locking tool for this engine. The cam locking tool (seen here: http://www.amazon.com/Camshaft-Crankshaft-Alignment-Locking-Fixture/dp/B00AVLU3ZK )is used for camshaft seal replacement and locks the cams from the other side of the engine, requiring engine mount removal and replacement of the intake cam cover. That would add several hours to this job. If your cam seals are leaking, then you need this tool, and you should replace your PCV system which is what generally causes cam or crank seal leaking.

But locking the cams is not needed for this job anyway.

This is an interference engine. The timing marks are on the timing belt cover (that has to be removed to gain access, then partially re-installed to see the marks).

Turning the engine over twice resets all the marks to their starting point, and allows you to see if you missed a tooth through insufficient belt tension, or a cam moving slightly while the belt was installed.

Of the six or so times that I've done this job on my two Volvos, I was off by a tooth twice. I discovered that by turning the engine over twice and then realigning that one cam (exhaust in both cases) and moving the belt one tooth. Slacken the belt, but don't remove it. Move it just the one tooth on the pulley that is off.

IF you find that you're off by one tooth, fix it and then turn the engine over again to be certain.

Some Volvo specifics:

1. if this is the first belt change (90,000 to 120,000 miles, depending on year), then leave the water pump. Volvo pumps usually go to 180+. If this is the second belt change, then do the water pump. Use OE parts for the water pump. It adds 30 minutes to a timing belt change to replace the water pump. If the pump starts weeping, you're pulling the timing belt to replace it.

2. Replace the idler and tensioner pulleys. They are usually what fails, not the belt itself. Buy a set.

3. This is an interference engine.

4. The tensioner setting is temperature dependent. When at 68F, the tab should be in the middle of the bracket to have the correct tension.

5. If you're going to pull the crankshaft pulley, you'll need a holding tool. Some guys claim that they can change the belt without removing that pulley. I don't see how they did it, so I recommend that you either fabricate a tool, or buy one like this: https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/volvo-crankshaft-holding-tool-cta-2247-2248-1

6. The 4 pulley bolts are angle-torqued. They are very, very tight for their size. The center nut goes to 180NM. You'll need that counterhold and a good breaker bar.

7. This is a good resource for your car:
http://www.volvoxc.com/resources/how-to/ while focused on the XC, it's the same chassis and engine.

8. Here are instructions for doing the job: http://www.volvoxc.com/0/resources/how-to/pdf/timing-belt-replacement.pdf

9. The timing marks are on the cover. There is parallax error from where you see them, unless you hold a mirror (my recommendation) so that your line of sight is straight from pulley to timing cover notch. Highlight the pulley marks (which are a machined dot) with a red sharpie to help with contrast.

PM with questions.

Cheers,
Astro


It was my understanding the crankshaft holder wasn't needed if a pneumatic impact gun was used?

 

[Astro14]

It had better be a good gun. 100K and ten years of corrosion backing up 180NM...that's potentially a lot more difficult than a lug nut or wheel bolt.

My IR 231 wasn't up to the task.

My 1/2" breaker bar was.

After I fabricated a holder from steel bar stock.

My IR 2135Ti gun might be up to it...it's a much better gun...but I didn't own it the first time I did a Volvo timing belt..

But how will you set 180NM when you put it back on? Just hit it with the gun and hope for the best? Further, how are you going to hold it to get the torque right on those pulley bolts? Go a bit over on those and you'll snap them right off, creating more problems.

As I said, guys claim to be able to do this job with the crank pulley/balancer in place.

I can't validate that claim.

I can say that I was unable to do this job without a crank holder.

 

[Silk]

You don't need to remove the crank pulley on the 850, it's the same engine, but could be different. That crank pulley mark is really hard to see.

 

[Astro14]

True. Crank pulley stays on on the 850. Owned one of those a while back. Timing belt was pretty easy.

But the S60/V70 P2 chassis is slightly different...and the timing belt is a lot harder. Right front wheel has to come off, that serpentine belt pulley has to come off, etc...