Tightening OEM Honda oil filters

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rationull

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I just changed the oil on my Civic, and this time I'm using an OEM Honda filter. Something felt weird when tightening it .. I've used Honda filters once or twice before but I can't remember if they worked this way.

The tightening instructions printed on the filter are pretty standard -- 3/4 turn after gasket contact. What's weird is that I made gasket contact, proceeded to turn another 3/4, and at that 3/4 point the filter immediately got really tight, and I couldn't tighten it any more. With other filters it seems like the norm is that it gets progressively harder to turn, instead of suddenly getting hard to turn.

The gasket on these filters has a circular cross section instead of rectangular like most filters (i.e. the contact surface is round, not flat). Does this give the gasket more bite when it becomes compressed?

I don't really think anything's wrong (although I will check for leaks after a short drive tomorrow). Has anyone else noticed this behavior from Honda filters (or others that might have rounded gaskets?) If it's intentional then I think it's a pretty cool feature -- makes it really easy to get the correct torque.

EDIT: Just to be clear, the filter isn't cross threaded or anything. It came back off just fine and I tried to tighten it 3 times. Each time it got tight "exactly" at the 3/4 turn mark past gasket contact.
 
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I wonder if the round gives more allowing the can to hit the flange? Tighten it down on a piece of paper and see if you can pull it out.
 
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It looks like what's on that Denso diagram and also the same as the S2000 picture (although the filter can is a different size -- IIRC Honda only specs two filters, one for the S2000 and one for everything else).

Sounds like it's supposed to work this way. I think it's a really cool design.
 
Originally Posted By: rationull
It looks like what's on that Denso diagram and also the same as the S2000 picture (although the filter can is a different size -- IIRC Honda only specs two filters, one for the S2000 and one for everything else).

Sounds like it's supposed to work this way. I think it's a really cool design.


Until it corrodes to the block and then becomes very hard to remove.
 
Why would it corrode where a normal gasket would not? My understanding so far is that the rubber is still the only thing touching the block, but it can't compress further because of the flange. Or am I wrong and the flange is actually touching the filter mounting surface?
 
Originally Posted By: rationull
Why would it corrode where a normal gasket would not? My understanding so far is that the rubber is still the only thing touching the block, but it can't compress further because of the flange. Or am I wrong and the flange is actually touching the filter mounting surface?


Not sure about that particular design, but there was a case on here where somebody had a bugger of a time getting their o-ringed filter off because the metal had come in contact with the block.
 
Originally Posted By: rationull

The tightening instructions printed on the filter are pretty standard -- 3/4 turn after gasket contact. What's weird is that I made gasket contact, proceeded to turn another 3/4, and at that 3/4 point the filter immediately got really tight, and I couldn't tighten it any more. With other filters it seems like the norm is that it gets progressively harder to turn, instead of suddenly getting hard to turn.


It probably uses a round O-ring instead of the thick flat gasket like on most filters. Toyota filters use an O-ring too ... and with the O-ring setup the O-ring will compress until the the metal base contacts the filter seat. The filter will not turn beyond that point. I'll bet the can has hit the seat, thereby stopping all turning no matter how much force you put on the filter. Seen this many times using OEM Toyota filters on my Tacoma.
 
Originally Posted By: rationull
Why would it corrode where a normal gasket would not? My understanding so far is that the rubber is still the only thing touching the block, but it can't compress further because of the flange. Or am I wrong and the flange is actually touching the filter mounting surface?


Yes, the flange bottoms out on the metal filter seat. Look at the seat, and you will see slight marks on it from metal-to-metal contact.
 
Not where the O ring seals
21.gif
Someone take an image of the engine side of this marriage. It would be simple if it had a groove for the O ring, but that would kinda restrict the filter selection a bit ..or so I reason.
 
Yeah I realized that shortly after I posted -- I guess as long as the o-ring/gasket still contacts on a relatively flat part any little "cuts" that show up wouldn't hurt anything.

No o-ring groove where the filter touches the block, and "normal" filters with flat gaskets (such as the Wix/Napa Gold spec'd for this application) work just fine with no leaks.

Here's a pic I found online that shows the mount point (forgive the size -- it's not mine). You can even see marks that are presumably from the OEM filter cans:


oilpan.JPG
 
Originally Posted By: rationull
That can't be good, can it? Seems like it would eventually screw up the seat.


I always check the filter's base lip area that will contact the engine seat area to make sure the filter doesn't have any gouges, etc that could chew up the aluminum seat.

Once the filter stops, then it's tight. Don't force it more if the filter can bottoms out on the seat on the engine side.
 
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