Thicker oil for performance ?

Messages
48
Location
Turkey
hi, i read about oil performance articles and im confused. i have 100k miles 2lt ford pinto engine with motul 6100 10w-40. people say 10w-60 is really good and gained performance. my oil pump will stress while pumping no. 60 inside my engine ?? i dont think so number is big but its more liquify than 10w, i wanna be sure about this. a mechaid said,you running engine with LPG and no carbon inside of cyclinders, there could be space near pistons and thick oil will fill it, high compression high power i found this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZUUllfRvYM a thick oil really good for performance even new engines ?
 
Messages
8,051
Location
Michigan
No, thick oil (60-weight) is not good for performance. 40 is probably even thicker than needed for the Ford 2L Pinto engine, but it's closer to being correct than 60.
 
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Messages
13,616
Location
Frisco, TX
Hi Dogan, In general, thicker oil will cause more parasitic drag and make the oil pump work harder. This robs the engine of horsepower and can make it slower to rev. It also tends to generate more heat. So yes, you are correct that thicker oils are not going to help you "gain performance". The general rule is that you want the oil to be "as thin as possible, but as thick as necessary." In other words, you want it to be as thin as possible that still maintains proper oil pressure and keeps things protected. Thicker oils are not always better.
 
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3,435
Location
FL
No...you want oil just thick enough for protection. A new engine will lose performance when you use thicker oil than needed.
 
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10,146
Location
Burlington, Ontario, Canada
I agree with all the above posters. All other factors like oil chemistry, the thicker the oil the less the power and fuel economy. And the video you referenced is totally unscientific with no standardized controls consequently it proves nothing Since you're running a 10W-40 now you may want to consider a 5W-30 next time if your current oil pressure is above the test spec' at normal operating temp's.
 
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10,146
Location
Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: dparm
Dogan, What oil does Ford recommend for that engine?
My first car as a kid was a Ford Capri with the same 2L engine. All grades were recommended based on ambient temp's: 20W-20 up to 70F 10W-30 up to 70F 30 grade up to 90F 10W-40 up to 90F 40 grade 50F to 120F 10W/20W-50 up to 120F. The minimum hot OP spec' was 45 psi @ 2,000 rpm.
 
Messages
197
Location
Transylvania, Romania, EU
Tell your mechanic to stick with screwing and unscrewing things. That would be what he does. Other things he should go to school for before feeling too important. Compression is not worse. It's actually expanding the piston more because of the higher piston to block temperature difference. Now, that isn't more compression per se but in will help some not to mention piston slap. Speaking of higher temps, in some cases a C3 oil is advisable if you have a 3-way cat converter just to be on the safe side with phosphorus volatility in these situations. With LPG (or Europaen gasoline) you don't need the high TBN anyways. That video is [censored]. The noise difference is likely that so go for it if that's your priority.
 
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17,301
Location
OH
No. While I'd bet that 20W-50 was among the grades recommended in Germany back in the day, simply because that's what they recommended for everything back in the day in Germany, this engine would be fine on any thirty or forty grade oil. 5W-30, 10W-30, 10W-40 or 15W-40, take your pick. A 10W-60 wouldn't hurt it, but it's really way beyond what the engine needs. The Motul 10W-40 you're using is fine and probably about as good as it gets for this machine. No reason to use a thicker grade and you'd likely be fine with a thinner one.
 
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2,400
Location
In The Region Between
I don't know where you are in Turkey, but if you are anywhere any time of year near the coast, or inland on the Asian side during the summer, what you are using is probably fine. The same applies to anywhere in the European parts of your nation. In winter if you go to inland places like Erzurum a 5W-30 is far better as Erzurum sees very low temperatures then, but check your pressure as Catherham suggests.
 

Dogan

Thread starter
Messages
48
Location
Turkey
thank you all for answers. i'm living in Yalova which never see -10 in winter and never above than 37C in summer. i realized no need for 60grade oil, my car can turn 6k rpms at max and rarely see this value, while climbing hill car have stress but 40grade oil is thick enough to protect. fuel economy and performance VS wear protection. thin oil will result performance and economy thick oil protects better. and 10w-40 is balanced it think. Last question; i know motul is good brand and im sure with it's quality but when check shell's and Motul's value, shell seems better. in 40C viscosity its more flowable and at 100C almost same value. can you realize only with this numbers anti-friction and protection ? which oil you will choice if you were me.
 
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Messages
1,800
Location
Rijeka, EU
Last question; i know motul is good brand and im sure with it's quality but when check shell's and Motul's value, shell seems better. in 40C viscosity its more flowable and at 100C almost same value. can you realize only with this numbers anti-friction and protection ? which oil you will choice if you were me. [/quote] Hi Dogan. Since Motul is no doubt more expensive i would use cheaper Shell or whatever you find on cheap.Any major oil brand will be fine, just watch for ACEA A3 specification. French Elf and Total tend to be among cheapest, but good quality. If you get high sulphur content fuel there do not go over 6k km without oil change. Cheers
 
Messages
10,146
Location
Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Thicker oil grades do not provide "greater protection" unless you are seeing very high oil temp's greater than 125C and with the way you drive I doubt you're even getting you oil Temp's up to 100C. If your engine in good condition it doesn't require a 40 multigrade oil. Even a 0W-40 or 5W-40 will be heavier than necessary. Anyway, you're running a 10W-40 now, if you want to know how much thicker than necessary it is simply have your oil pressure checked, it's very easy to do. Since it summer now is the time to do it. Once you know what your hot oil pressure is you can make an educated informed decision on what oil grade to use. And yes the lower the KV40 spec' the better when comparing different oils.
 
Messages
429
Location
Florida, USA
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Thicker oil grades do not provide "greater protection" unless you are seeing very high oil temp's greater than 125C and with the way you drive I doubt you're even getting you oil Temp's up to 100C. If your engine in good condition it doesn't require a 40 multigrade oil. Even a 0W-40 or 5W-40 will be heavier than necessary. Anyway, you're running a 10W-40 now, if you want to know how much thicker than necessary it is simply have your oil pressure checked, it's very easy to do. Since it summer now is the time to do it. Once you know what your hot oil pressure is you can make an educated informed decision on what oil grade to use. And yes the lower the KV40 spec' the better when comparing different oils.
Slightly off-topic here, but in last year's Peking to Paris rally our 1970 air-cooled (obviously) Beetle regularly saw engine oil temp at 250 C. We were using locally obtained 15W40 diesel oil.
 
Messages
1,800
Location
Rijeka, EU
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
I agree with all the above posters. All other factors like oil chemistry, the thicker the oil the less the power and fuel economy. And the video you referenced is totally unscientific with no standardized controls consequently it proves nothing Since you're running a 10W-40 now you may want to consider a 5W-30 next time if your current oil pressure is above the test spec' at normal operating temp's.
So what is your recommendation for this old car? 5w30 A1/A5 or 5w30 A3? First is no doubt to thin even for your standards and second is not common so would be probably more expensive. No need to go any thinner then 5w40 or 10w40 in Turkey.
 
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Messages
10,146
Location
Burlington, Ontario, Canada
chrisri I hear what you're saying and appreciate this is Europe and light A1/A5 0W/5W-30 oils are not always readily available or cost effective. What I am suggesting since the OP likely doesn't have an oil pressure gauge in this old car is to simply get it checked when the engine is good and hot this summer. That information will tell him where he is at now in terms of operational viscosity. If his hot oil pressure is well above the test minimum of 45 psi, say in the 55-65 psi range, the oil he is running is clearly heavier than necessary and yes I'd suggest he run a 5W-30 even a light A1/A5 oil if he can find one at a reasonable price. If not at the very least an A3/B4 5W/10W-30, even an inexpensive mineral 5W/10W-30. If his oil pressure is around 50 psi on this 10W-40 he is running now it's already in the right ball park and there is little benefit to running anything much lighter. The point is, we don't have enough info' to make a definitive oil grade recommendation. A simply OP test will give us that info'.
 
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43,670
Location
'Stralia
How would he get such a test done CATERHAM ? As you've pointed out me before, simply pulling off the road/track changes the oil temperature markedly, so by the time he gets to a shop, has the gear installed, and engine restarted, he's running a completely different oil viscosity to that he'd see in normal service.
 
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