99% of people don't keep a car long enough for this to matter one bit. I'd be more concerned with variable valve timing, cam phasers, oil pumps etc that were designed around thinner oils. Thinner oils also dissipate heat better and give better gas mileage. Wear is here nor there if you change your oil and filter frequently. This is a practice for people like me to consider who still drives and plans to keep an old school Ford Cologne 4.0L ohv with no modern tech and approaching 275k miles (still running 5w-30 or 0w-30 btw) where 2 decades of wear may have opened some tolerances enough to warrant slightly thicker oil.
Thicker is better in my opinion.
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Originally Posted by stanlee
I'd be more concerned with variable valve timing, cam phasers, oil pumps etc that were designed around thinner oils..
I'm not concerned, because, with all respect, I honestly think that is not true.
Toyota say I can use 0W16, 0W20, 5W20, 5W30, 10W30 or 15W40 in their modern VVT-I Hybrid, so how can it be designed around 0W16 and 15W40 at the same time?
I'd be more concerned with variable valve timing, cam phasers, oil pumps etc that were designed around thinner oils..
I'm not concerned, because, with all respect, I honestly think that is not true.
Toyota say I can use 0W16, 0W20, 5W20, 5W30, 10W30 or 15W40 in their modern VVT-I Hybrid, so how can it be designed around 0W16 and 15W40 at the same time?
Originally Posted by SR5
Originally Posted by stanlee
I'd be more concerned with variable valve timing, cam phasers, oil pumps etc that were designed around thinner oils..
I'm not concerned, because, with all respect, I honestly think that is not true.
Toyota say I can use 0W16, 0W20, 5W20, 5W30, 10W30 or 15W40 in their modern VVT-I Hybrid, so how can it be designed around 0W16 and 15W40 at the same time?
Because we are really debating about the difference of thickness of human hairs.
Originally Posted by stanlee
I'd be more concerned with variable valve timing, cam phasers, oil pumps etc that were designed around thinner oils..
I'm not concerned, because, with all respect, I honestly think that is not true.
Toyota say I can use 0W16, 0W20, 5W20, 5W30, 10W30 or 15W40 in their modern VVT-I Hybrid, so how can it be designed around 0W16 and 15W40 at the same time?
Because we are really debating about the difference of thickness of human hairs.
And if they say 15W-40 is ok....then I can push it to 20W-50 with no problems.
Originally Posted by Silk
And if they say 15W-40 is ok....then I can push it to 20W-50 with no problems.
Well if the 20W50 was free, and it never gets below freezing here ....
How are you Silk ? I hope you had a good Christmas.
And if they say 15W-40 is ok....then I can push it to 20W-50 with no problems.
Well if the 20W50 was free, and it never gets below freezing here ....
How are you Silk ? I hope you had a good Christmas.
Originally Posted by Starman2112
I use what the owner's manual says to use. I'll take my chances that the engineers who designed the vehicle and did countless hours of research and testing might know what's best.
The engineers that design our vehicles are known to make mistakes: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/5298476/stupidest-designs#Post5298476
I use what the owner's manual says to use. I'll take my chances that the engineers who designed the vehicle and did countless hours of research and testing might know what's best.
The engineers that design our vehicles are known to make mistakes: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/5298476/stupidest-designs#Post5298476
Originally Posted by tig1
Yes, best to stick with oil cap advise.
What if we cannot find the oil specified on our oil caps?
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Yes, best to stick with oil cap advise.
What if we cannot find the oil specified on our oil caps?
Originally Posted by The_Nuke
Originally Posted by Starman2112
I use what the owner's manual says to use. I'll take my chances that the engineers who designed the vehicle and did countless hours of research and testing might know what's best.
The engineers that design our vehicles are known to make mistakes: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/5298476/stupidest-designs#Post5298476
Yes on occasion they do. It's also possible their screw up shortens the life of an engine, and the owner finds out years later after the warranty ended.
Originally Posted by Starman2112
I use what the owner's manual says to use. I'll take my chances that the engineers who designed the vehicle and did countless hours of research and testing might know what's best.
The engineers that design our vehicles are known to make mistakes: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/5298476/stupidest-designs#Post5298476
Yes on occasion they do. It's also possible their screw up shortens the life of an engine, and the owner finds out years later after the warranty ended.
And yet going thicker added how much to any engine's life span?
Originally Posted by dave1251
And yet going thicker added how much to any engine's life span?
Good question. Why not PM Trav and ask him about a Honda motorcycle he owned originally spec'd for a 30 grade oil IIRC, which was a mistake. He had a warranty and followed the owner's manual, against his better judgement, after all the engineers know best. His engine blew, shortly after Honda ate several of them because they spec'd the wrong oil, too "thin," they changed the spec. There's one example. I'm sure there are others, Ford did it I think, maybe someone else will weigh in. Does it happen all the time? No, but it does happen, and that's the point I'm trying to make.
And yet going thicker added how much to any engine's life span?
Good question. Why not PM Trav and ask him about a Honda motorcycle he owned originally spec'd for a 30 grade oil IIRC, which was a mistake. He had a warranty and followed the owner's manual, against his better judgement, after all the engineers know best. His engine blew, shortly after Honda ate several of them because they spec'd the wrong oil, too "thin," they changed the spec. There's one example. I'm sure there are others, Ford did it I think, maybe someone else will weigh in. Does it happen all the time? No, but it does happen, and that's the point I'm trying to make.
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Originally Posted by The_Nuke
Originally Posted by tig1
Yes, best to stick with oil cap advise.
What if we cannot find the oil specified on our oil caps?
Is Yo Mama thin or thick ?
Originally Posted by tig1
Yes, best to stick with oil cap advise.
What if we cannot find the oil specified on our oil caps?
Is Yo Mama thin or thick ?
And yet not all of the engines failed what was the rate of failure before the grade recommendation change and after?
Also passing the buck to the consumer for a design or manufacture failure is rather low.
Also passing the buck to the consumer for a design or manufacture failure is rather low.
Originally Posted by The_Nuke
Originally Posted by tig1
Yes, best to stick with oil cap advise.
What if we cannot find the oil specified on our oil caps?
Then I would recommend the following link as a resource for anyone with " Yo Mama" on the oil fill cap. I've found it to be a very reliable resource for all vehicle specific information including oil spec. I prefer the older version linked. https://www.amsoil.com/AmsoilGarage/internal/vehiclelookuppage.aspx
I am wondering though if there's another vehicle in that same ownership family that says, "Yo Daddy Too (or 2)" on the cap?
Originally Posted by tig1
Yes, best to stick with oil cap advise.
What if we cannot find the oil specified on our oil caps?
Then I would recommend the following link as a resource for anyone with " Yo Mama" on the oil fill cap. I've found it to be a very reliable resource for all vehicle specific information including oil spec. I prefer the older version linked. https://www.amsoil.com/AmsoilGarage/internal/vehiclelookuppage.aspx
I am wondering though if there's another vehicle in that same ownership family that says, "Yo Daddy Too (or 2)" on the cap?
Engine main/rod clearances remain pretty consistant over the years while piston shape(bye bye skirts) and materials have varied and may have different lube and clearance requirements. We see oil squirters to help with the heat effects of the boosted engines. Oil coolers help, but it's a tougher environment. As to engineering-in the 1960's the Buick engineers would use a drive from Michigan to the GM desert proving grounds to test the new 'lightweight' 400-430 engines replacing the 401-425 nailheads. It seems that the new cast crankshafts failed under severe conditions whereas the smaller diameter journal forged nailhead shafts had been just fine for years. The fix was to incrementally increase the main journals diameters until the engine survived. 3.000"=fail 3.125"=fail 3.250"=PASS The actual root cause of the failing cranks was flexing of the smaller and lighter blocks. I still chuckle at the thought of a component of the rotating assembly stabilizing the weak block and high power blasts up Ute Pass finally ended up not at the side of the road. Of course, that wasn't really the complete story as the oiling was even more important with such and the aluminum oil pump housing 'up front' in these new engines wasn't up to the task as miles added up. Later band aids helped with that.
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Yeah, just a few threads regarding this debate …
Going to be more likely to bump up a notch past warranty of 60k on the V8's …
or at 100k as I did on my two 4 bangers …
Going to be more likely to bump up a notch past warranty of 60k on the V8's …
or at 100k as I did on my two 4 bangers …
Originally Posted by The_Nuke
Originally Posted by tig1
Yes, best to stick with oil cap advise.
What if we cannot find the oil specified on our oil caps?
I think the owner wanted to write "YO MAMA SEWS SOCKS THAT SMELL!" on there, but ran out of room...
;^)
Originally Posted by tig1
Yes, best to stick with oil cap advise.
What if we cannot find the oil specified on our oil caps?
I think the owner wanted to write "YO MAMA SEWS SOCKS THAT SMELL!" on there, but ran out of room...
;^)
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