TGMO 0w20 has a pour point of -27c????!!!

[BlazerLT]

To everyone that knows this oil, is this true? It has a viscosity index over 210 but has such a warm pour point of -27c????

Is it a typo?

As a person who lives in a climate that goes down to -40c, I am concerned. PP 5w20 has a pour point of -51c.

 

[BlazerLT]

Just for reference, this is the document I am referring to.

https://physics.usc.edu/Undergraduate/temporary/toyota_0W-20_msdn_vrd_0004740940mfv_0005160165.pdf

 

[demarpaint]

The sheet is almost 5 years old. God only know how many times the formulation might have changed since then. It could have been a typo, it could be anything.

 

[Shannow]

It's a material safety data sheet...and I would suggest that the pour point is incorrect.

There's no way a 0W could get the MRV required at -35 and not pour at -27.

 

[BlazerLT]

I really wish I knew its pour point though. Unnerving to not know seeing it gets so cold here.

 

[demarpaint]

Why not use AFE 0W20 instead? The pour point is very good, as well as the overall product.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: BlazerLT
I really wish I knew its pour point though. Unnerving to not know seeing it gets so cold here.


Why? The measure of cold temp pumpability is MRV and the effect it has on cranking speed is measured through CCS. The oil carries the 0w-xx designation that guarantees it pumps at -40C as Shannow already mentioned, that's all that is really important here.

IMHO, the "best" cold temp performance in this grade should be had in M1 EP 0w-20, with its 70% PAO base, guaranteeing exceptional cold temp performance, but we can't get that up here at this time.

 

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Why? The measure of cold temp pumpability is MRV and the effect it has on cranking speed is measured through CCS. The oil carries the 0w-xx designation that guarantees it pumps at -40C as Shannow already mentioned, that's all that is really important here.

IMHO, the "best" cold temp performance in this grade should be had in M1 EP 0w-20, with its 70% PAO base, guaranteeing exceptional cold temp performance, but we can't get that up here at this time.

We're lucky to have it at Walmart for the same price as regular M1, plus some rebate from Mobil to bring it down to about $3/qt.

It's hard to get a better oil than M1 EP 0w-20 for less than $3/qt.

Back to TGMO 0W20, I don't see any good reason to pay extra for it, also you have to go to Toyota dealer which I don't care for. Why not just buy full synthetic 0W20 from reputable brands.

 

[BlazerLT]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: BlazerLT
I really wish I knew its pour point though. Unnerving to not know seeing it gets so cold here.


Why? The measure of cold temp pumpability is MRV and the effect it has on cranking speed is measured through CCS. The oil carries the 0w-xx designation that guarantees it pumps at -40C as Shannow already mentioned, that's all that is really important here.

IMHO, the "best" cold temp performance in this grade should be had in M1 EP 0w-20, with its 70% PAO base, guaranteeing exceptional cold temp performance, but we can't get that up here at this time.


Very very interesting.

100C vis .... 8.8 cSt
40C vis .....39.3 cSt
VI .......... 214
Flash Pt .... >200C
HTHS ...... 2.6 cP
CCS @ -35C ..... 5,700 cP
MRV @ -40 .... 18,000 cP

This is the latest information I have seen which is 6 years old.

Is a MRV @ -40 at 18000cP poor? -40c would be the lowest extent of temperatures here. I know this winter it did pretty well and always started very well.

Just want to make sure I don't have my head in the sand.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR


Back to TGMO 0W20, I don't see any good reason to pay extra for it, also you have to go to Toyota dealer which I don't care for. Why not just buy full synthetic 0W20 from reputable brands.


Exactly.

 

[BlazerLT]

It was because I was having my oil changes done at the dealer. That is stopping now seeing I can't trust the bulk oil they were putting in.

I have heard such good things about TGMO.

 

[Shannow]

The "good things" about TGMO are speculation...the only things that are REALLY known are that it's SN/GF-5 (the label), and the MSDS data (which as you've found is possibly flawed), and some comprehensive VOA/UOAs.

Nobody knows for certain that it has "trinuclear" moly...it's an educated guess...much more than the advice that it "would meet Ford's testing requirements, so go ahead and use it".

We've also come across dealers not putting that particular oil in the vehicles at service time.

Pick a reputable product that DOES have some credentials, and provide it at service time.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: BlazerLT
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: BlazerLT
I really wish I knew its pour point though. Unnerving to not know seeing it gets so cold here.


Why? The measure of cold temp pumpability is MRV and the effect it has on cranking speed is measured through CCS. The oil carries the 0w-xx designation that guarantees it pumps at -40C as Shannow already mentioned, that's all that is really important here.

IMHO, the "best" cold temp performance in this grade should be had in M1 EP 0w-20, with its 70% PAO base, guaranteeing exceptional cold temp performance, but we can't get that up here at this time.


Very very interesting.

100C vis .... 8.8 cSt
40C vis .....39.3 cSt
VI .......... 214
Flash Pt .... >200C
HTHS ...... 2.6 cP
CCS @ -35C ..... 5,700 cP
MRV @ -40 .... 18,000 cP

This is the latest information I have seen which is 6 years old.

Is a MRV @ -40 at 18000cP poor? -40c would be the lowest extent of temperatures here. I know this winter it did pretty well and always started very well.

Just want to make sure I don't have my head in the sand.


Well, in comparison, M1 AFE 0w-20 that you can buy anywhere has an MRV of basically half that at 9,200cP. Pour point is -48C. Mobil doesn't list MRV for the EP version, but the pour point is -54C.

 

[zeng]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: BlazerLT
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Why? The measure of cold temp pumpability is MRV and the effect it has on cranking speed is measured through CCS. The oil carries the 0w-xx designation that guarantees it pumps at -40C as Shannow already mentioned, that's all that is really important here.
IMHO, the "best" cold temp performance in this grade should be had in M1 EP 0w-20, with its 70% PAO base, guaranteeing exceptional cold temp performance, but we can't get that up here at this time.

Very very interesting.
100C vis .... 8.8 cSt
40C vis .....39.3 cSt
VI .......... 214
Flash Pt .... >200C
HTHS ...... 2.6 cP
CCS @ -35C ..... 5,700 cP
MRV @ -40 .... 18,000 cP
This is the latest information I have seen which is 6 years old.
Is a MRV @ -40 at 18000cP poor? -40c would be the lowest extent of temperatures here. I know this winter it did pretty well and always started very well.
Just want to make sure I don't have my head in the sand.

Well, in comparison, M1 AFE 0w-20 that you can buy anywhere has an MRV of basically half that at 9,200cP. Pour point is -48C. Mobil doesn't list MRV for the EP version, but the pour point is -54C.


With its low pour points, could both M1 AFE/EP 0W20 be having MRV of SAE?

 

[BlazerLT]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
The "good things" about TGMO are speculation...the only things that are REALLY known are that it's SN/GF-5 (the label), and the MSDS data (which as you've found is possibly flawed), and some comprehensive VOA/UOAs.

Nobody knows for certain that it has "trinuclear" moly...it's an educated guess...much more than the advice that it "would meet Ford's testing requirements, so go ahead and use it".

We've also come across dealers not putting that particular oil in the vehicles at service time.

Pick a reputable product that DOES have some credentials, and provide it at service time.


I am trying to find something reputable that won't cost me a fortune. I have two cases of PP 5w20 in the garage, but Toyota won't support it as an alternative even though on paper it does better in the cold then there TGMO 0w20.

Other 0w20s are 10-12 bucks a bottle.

 

[Uregina09]

Watch for sales at Canadian Tire. Last week Mobil 1, including 0W20, was on sale for $29 for 4.4 litres.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: BlazerLT
I really wish I knew its pour point though. Unnerving to not know seeing it gets so cold here.

Any certified 0w-XX is sufficient for the weather you'll find anywhere here. Ignore the MSDS. Heck, that could be the pour point of a base oil.