Taking the Fusion to the dealership (again)
- Thread starter Klutch9
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Originally Posted By: dwcopple
Lemon Law baby! that or Ford buyback. GM does it.
+1 for Lemon Law
Lemon Law baby! that or Ford buyback. GM does it.
+1 for Lemon Law
Stopped back by the dealer today. Drove around for twenty minutes. Didn't act up ONE time. I know the tech, real cool guy. Was telling about the tons of 6F35's they had to pull in the Escapes. He said mine is the first 12 they've had any complaints on. He said they might of had a couple of 11's, but the trans seems sorted out now. Known him for like 5+yrs, don't know whether to believe him or not. Having did the lemon law on a 2007 Focus I wouldn't do it again. It was 8 months of torture.
I feel bad for you guys. Over the summer I traded my 2011 Fusion 3.0 and got a 2002 Honda Accord with manual trans.
All the local dealers kept blowing me off (over the course of a year and 25,000 miles) and saying the flaring/slamming into gear was normal. Got tired of that and finally lost all confidence in the car so got rid of it. Sorry but I'm not going to drive myself or my family around in a car I do not trust. Great car with a pos transmission.
Driving the manual Accord is wonderful.
All the local dealers kept blowing me off (over the course of a year and 25,000 miles) and saying the flaring/slamming into gear was normal. Got tired of that and finally lost all confidence in the car so got rid of it. Sorry but I'm not going to drive myself or my family around in a car I do not trust. Great car with a pos transmission.
Driving the manual Accord is wonderful.
I have two words for all those with the 6F35 transmissions to cure your woes - Redline D6.
Now for the supporting data - I am also an owner of a 2012 Fusion, 2.5l, with the 6F35 transmission. I have had this car a little over a year now and have 21,000 miles on it now. I have not had ANY programming updates since I bought the car.
After buying the car, I went to the fusion forum and found out these trans were finicky. I also had the hard 1-2 shift when the trans was cold and the occasional flare on 3-4 shifts. If I drive it more aggressively, this happened less, but still on occasion occurred.
I decided to try out a top notch trans fluid as I was concerned with the longevity of this trans and I intend to keep this car a very long time. So at 10k miles, I substituted 3.7 quarts of trans fluid (using a Pela extractor) and put in Redline D6 (this is the most you can get out of the sump at one time).
I noticed and immediate difference, even though I only replaced about 1/3 of the total fluid. The whole trans was smoother. After running a few hundred miles to allow the programming to adjust, I had no more hard shifts or flares. At 20k, I did the same, and the trans has gotten even better - I have not had a hard shift or flare for over 10k miles since I put in the D6.
While Ford keeps attributing this to programming, I actually think it is more fluid related. This trans is very hard on fluids as you can tell by how quickly it dirties it up and shear it down in a very short period of time. RL D6 is an ester formula that starts at 6.4 cst and will not shear down below 6.1 cst during its life (Ford spec for Mercon LV is not less that 5.5). I think that while MLV is a good fluid, it is not near as good as RL D6, and thus the much better performance of my transmission.
I intend to keep replacing 3.7 qts every 10k miles and expect a long life and very good trans performance on out. If you have a problem now, you might consider doing 2 -3.7 qt fluid changes (with a short drive in between to mix the fluids) and see what it does for you - I bet it will surprise you the difference it makes.
In the FWIW department, I am also using RL 5W20 in the sump (started at 5k miles and doing 5k OCIs) and this engine is much quieter and smoother than it was on the motorcraft 5W20 (still using MC filters though).
This is not a sales pitch and I am a veteran of this site that has used many different oils over the years, but have to say that I switched to RL about 2 years ago (it took me years to try it as I did not believe all the hype) and it has far exceeded what I have seen in ANY other brands I have used, which if you look back through posts you will see a lot of them.
Hope this helps out any 6F35 owners as it sure worked for me.
Now for the supporting data - I am also an owner of a 2012 Fusion, 2.5l, with the 6F35 transmission. I have had this car a little over a year now and have 21,000 miles on it now. I have not had ANY programming updates since I bought the car.
After buying the car, I went to the fusion forum and found out these trans were finicky. I also had the hard 1-2 shift when the trans was cold and the occasional flare on 3-4 shifts. If I drive it more aggressively, this happened less, but still on occasion occurred.
I decided to try out a top notch trans fluid as I was concerned with the longevity of this trans and I intend to keep this car a very long time. So at 10k miles, I substituted 3.7 quarts of trans fluid (using a Pela extractor) and put in Redline D6 (this is the most you can get out of the sump at one time).
I noticed and immediate difference, even though I only replaced about 1/3 of the total fluid. The whole trans was smoother. After running a few hundred miles to allow the programming to adjust, I had no more hard shifts or flares. At 20k, I did the same, and the trans has gotten even better - I have not had a hard shift or flare for over 10k miles since I put in the D6.
While Ford keeps attributing this to programming, I actually think it is more fluid related. This trans is very hard on fluids as you can tell by how quickly it dirties it up and shear it down in a very short period of time. RL D6 is an ester formula that starts at 6.4 cst and will not shear down below 6.1 cst during its life (Ford spec for Mercon LV is not less that 5.5). I think that while MLV is a good fluid, it is not near as good as RL D6, and thus the much better performance of my transmission.
I intend to keep replacing 3.7 qts every 10k miles and expect a long life and very good trans performance on out. If you have a problem now, you might consider doing 2 -3.7 qt fluid changes (with a short drive in between to mix the fluids) and see what it does for you - I bet it will surprise you the difference it makes.
In the FWIW department, I am also using RL 5W20 in the sump (started at 5k miles and doing 5k OCIs) and this engine is much quieter and smoother than it was on the motorcraft 5W20 (still using MC filters though).
This is not a sales pitch and I am a veteran of this site that has used many different oils over the years, but have to say that I switched to RL about 2 years ago (it took me years to try it as I did not believe all the hype) and it has far exceeded what I have seen in ANY other brands I have used, which if you look back through posts you will see a lot of them.
Hope this helps out any 6F35 owners as it sure worked for me.
and to add, that was after fighting Ford for 8 months. They would NOT settle unless I allowed them to buy back my Focus, and then had to agree to repurchase another Ford product. Otherwise would have been another year til I could have gotten a court date. You are required by law to continue to use the vehicle and continue to take it back to the dealer to repeatedly have them tell you nothing is wrong with it. I have about 3" thick of paperwork, and there were 16 visits to the dealership which I was not compensated for. Not worth it.
That's great feedback on the Red Line D6. I've never used the D4 or D6 before but it's nice to hear good news.
I can say that I've also noticed a smoother running engine when using a 50% mix or 100% Red Line engine oil. No data to prove it other than for the last 20 years it's the only time I've stopped to wonder what had happened to make the engine feel smoother/quieter.
I can say that I've also noticed a smoother running engine when using a 50% mix or 100% Red Line engine oil. No data to prove it other than for the last 20 years it's the only time I've stopped to wonder what had happened to make the engine feel smoother/quieter.
Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
I have two words for all those with the 6F35 transmissions to cure your woes - Redline D6.
Now for the supporting data - I am also an owner of a 2012 Fusion, 2.5l, with the 6F35 transmission. I have had this car a little over a year now and have 21,000 miles on it now. I have not had ANY programming updates since I bought the car.
After buying the car, I went to the fusion forum and found out these trans were finicky. I also had the hard 1-2 shift when the trans was cold and the occasional flare on 3-4 shifts. If I drive it more aggressively, this happened less, but still on occasion occurred.
I decided to try out a top notch trans fluid as I was concerned with the longevity of this trans and I intend to keep this car a very long time. So at 10k miles, I substituted 3.7 quarts of trans fluid (using a Pela extractor) and put in Redline D6 (this is the most you can get out of the sump at one time).
I noticed and immediate difference, even though I only replaced about 1/3 of the total fluid. The whole trans was smoother. After running a few hundred miles to allow the programming to adjust, I had no more hard shifts or flares. At 20k, I did the same, and the trans has gotten even better - I have not had a hard shift or flare for over 10k miles since I put in the D6.
While Ford keeps attributing this to programming, I actually think it is more fluid related. This trans is very hard on fluids as you can tell by how quickly it dirties it up and shear it down in a very short period of time. RL D6 is an ester formula that starts at 6.4 cst and will not shear down below 6.1 cst during its life (Ford spec for Mercon LV is not less that 5.5). I think that while MLV is a good fluid, it is not near as good as RL D6, and thus the much better performance of my transmission.
I intend to keep replacing 3.7 qts every 10k miles and expect a long life and very good trans performance on out. If you have a problem now, you might consider doing 2 -3.7 qt fluid changes (with a short drive in between to mix the fluids) and see what it does for you - I bet it will surprise you the difference it makes.
In the FWIW department, I am also using RL 5W20 in the sump (started at 5k miles and doing 5k OCIs) and this engine is much quieter and smoother than it was on the motorcraft 5W20 (still using MC filters though).
This is not a sales pitch and I am a veteran of this site that has used many different oils over the years, but have to say that I switched to RL about 2 years ago (it took me years to try it as I did not believe all the hype) and it has far exceeded what I have seen in ANY other brands I have used, which if you look back through posts you will see a lot of them.
Hope this helps out any 6F35 owners as it sure worked for me.
This is great advice. I may just do this. The only downside is that RL D6 is quite pricey, but if it works, it'd definitely be worthwhile to do.
I have two words for all those with the 6F35 transmissions to cure your woes - Redline D6.
Now for the supporting data - I am also an owner of a 2012 Fusion, 2.5l, with the 6F35 transmission. I have had this car a little over a year now and have 21,000 miles on it now. I have not had ANY programming updates since I bought the car.
After buying the car, I went to the fusion forum and found out these trans were finicky. I also had the hard 1-2 shift when the trans was cold and the occasional flare on 3-4 shifts. If I drive it more aggressively, this happened less, but still on occasion occurred.
I decided to try out a top notch trans fluid as I was concerned with the longevity of this trans and I intend to keep this car a very long time. So at 10k miles, I substituted 3.7 quarts of trans fluid (using a Pela extractor) and put in Redline D6 (this is the most you can get out of the sump at one time).
I noticed and immediate difference, even though I only replaced about 1/3 of the total fluid. The whole trans was smoother. After running a few hundred miles to allow the programming to adjust, I had no more hard shifts or flares. At 20k, I did the same, and the trans has gotten even better - I have not had a hard shift or flare for over 10k miles since I put in the D6.
While Ford keeps attributing this to programming, I actually think it is more fluid related. This trans is very hard on fluids as you can tell by how quickly it dirties it up and shear it down in a very short period of time. RL D6 is an ester formula that starts at 6.4 cst and will not shear down below 6.1 cst during its life (Ford spec for Mercon LV is not less that 5.5). I think that while MLV is a good fluid, it is not near as good as RL D6, and thus the much better performance of my transmission.
I intend to keep replacing 3.7 qts every 10k miles and expect a long life and very good trans performance on out. If you have a problem now, you might consider doing 2 -3.7 qt fluid changes (with a short drive in between to mix the fluids) and see what it does for you - I bet it will surprise you the difference it makes.
In the FWIW department, I am also using RL 5W20 in the sump (started at 5k miles and doing 5k OCIs) and this engine is much quieter and smoother than it was on the motorcraft 5W20 (still using MC filters though).
This is not a sales pitch and I am a veteran of this site that has used many different oils over the years, but have to say that I switched to RL about 2 years ago (it took me years to try it as I did not believe all the hype) and it has far exceeded what I have seen in ANY other brands I have used, which if you look back through posts you will see a lot of them.
Hope this helps out any 6F35 owners as it sure worked for me.
This is great advice. I may just do this. The only downside is that RL D6 is quite pricey, but if it works, it'd definitely be worthwhile to do.
My only thoughts on this are my trans had issues @ 3000 miles, do not believe the fluid was toast by then. Not saying the RL wouldn't be a good choice, but I don't think it would make a difference in my case. Had a shift flare 2-3 yesterday, that is the first time since the original reflash.
Originally Posted By: Klutch9
This is great advice. I may just do this. The only downside is that RL D6 is quite pricey, but if it works, it'd definitely be worthwhile to do.
Agree it is pricey - about $44/gallon, but I do think it is worth it for the difference I could observe.
This is great advice. I may just do this. The only downside is that RL D6 is quite pricey, but if it works, it'd definitely be worthwhile to do.
Agree it is pricey - about $44/gallon, but I do think it is worth it for the difference I could observe.
Originally Posted By: PTBH04
My only thoughts on this are my trans had issues @ 3000 miles, do not believe the fluid was toast by then. Not saying the RL wouldn't be a good choice, but I don't think it would make a difference in my case. Had a shift flare 2-3 yesterday, that is the first time since the original reflash.
Agree - a few of these trans have had some defects out of the box that no fluid is going to solve.
I would add though, that the RL trans fluid made a big difference in how the trans worked, so it is not just that the new trans could have burnt up the original fluid, but that the characteristics of the RL just supports better operation against even new MC LV (in addition to it holding up better).
My only thoughts on this are my trans had issues @ 3000 miles, do not believe the fluid was toast by then. Not saying the RL wouldn't be a good choice, but I don't think it would make a difference in my case. Had a shift flare 2-3 yesterday, that is the first time since the original reflash.
Agree - a few of these trans have had some defects out of the box that no fluid is going to solve.
I would add though, that the RL trans fluid made a big difference in how the trans worked, so it is not just that the new trans could have burnt up the original fluid, but that the characteristics of the RL just supports better operation against even new MC LV (in addition to it holding up better).
Originally Posted By: dwcopple
Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
Agree it is pricey - about $44/gallon
I think I'm gonna bite the bullet and buy 4 qts, and do one drain/refill when I change the oil next at the start of spring. All of the fluid is brand new as of 5 weeks ago when the transmission was torn apart and repaired. It is much better, but still quirky sometimes. I drove the car for 2 days straight last weekend, and after it adapted to my driving style, the shifts were pretty good and precise, but still not 100% perfect. Maybe a higher-quality fluid will help the trans operate better. For around $55 with shipping and all, I figure it's a worthwhile experiment if it ends up doing some good. Maybe I won't wait til spring... I do have to rotate the tires before winter, so maybe I'll change the fluid while I have the car up on stands. Whatever I do, I'll report on the results.
Originally Posted By: Jax_RX8
Agree it is pricey - about $44/gallon
I think I'm gonna bite the bullet and buy 4 qts, and do one drain/refill when I change the oil next at the start of spring. All of the fluid is brand new as of 5 weeks ago when the transmission was torn apart and repaired. It is much better, but still quirky sometimes. I drove the car for 2 days straight last weekend, and after it adapted to my driving style, the shifts were pretty good and precise, but still not 100% perfect. Maybe a higher-quality fluid will help the trans operate better. For around $55 with shipping and all, I figure it's a worthwhile experiment if it ends up doing some good. Maybe I won't wait til spring... I do have to rotate the tires before winter, so maybe I'll change the fluid while I have the car up on stands. Whatever I do, I'll report on the results.
I hear you on this issue Klutch9. We ended up getting rid of our '10 Fusion because of this issue and a lack of getting it corrected by Ford.
It's absolutely frustrating that a new car does things like this. Ours had 44K at time of trade in. I also used the LG red in ours with 2 or 3 drain fills in those 44K miles.
It's absolutely frustrating that a new car does things like this. Ours had 44K at time of trade in. I also used the LG red in ours with 2 or 3 drain fills in those 44K miles.
UPDATE: Because of Jax RX8's great experience, I ordered 4 quarts of the Redline D6 ATF. I have heard that when you pull the drain plug on this transmission, you get about 3.7 quarts to drain out. However, some say only 3, while one member on a Fusion forum stated that he got over 5 quarts out
Either way, I think that 4 quarts should be plenty, since 3.7 quarts is generally agreed upon as the typical drain capacity. I will do the drain/fill the next time I change the oil, which will be early spring.
On another note, I did end up adding a bottle of LGR about a month and a half ago as PM. I didn't really notice any change. Overall, the transmission performs much better since the rebuild. It still has the hard 1-2 shift most of the time, but every other shift is smooth (2-3 is soft and drawn out usually, but smooth). I do get the occasional 3-4 flare, but usually only when the drivetrain isn't fully warm and I just took over driving the car after my wife has driven it for a few days; we have very different acceleration styles, and the PCM picks up on this I'm assuming. I'm guessing it takes awhile to get used to different driving habits. We'll see how it performs in the months and years to come!
On another note, I did end up adding a bottle of LGR about a month and a half ago as PM. I didn't really notice any change. Overall, the transmission performs much better since the rebuild. It still has the hard 1-2 shift most of the time, but every other shift is smooth (2-3 is soft and drawn out usually, but smooth). I do get the occasional 3-4 flare, but usually only when the drivetrain isn't fully warm and I just took over driving the car after my wife has driven it for a few days; we have very different acceleration styles, and the PCM picks up on this I'm assuming. I'm guessing it takes awhile to get used to different driving habits. We'll see how it performs in the months and years to come!
Thanks for the update. Eager to hear how the D6 does.
The D6 I ordered is supposed to be delivered this Wednesday, so I may just do the drain/fill on Thursday, since I have some free time and it's not supposed to be too cold - a balmy 39 degrees F!
I noticed something interesting just now... I just took the Fusion for a 10 minute drive, and checked the trans fluid. The trans wasn't fully warmed up, so if anything, the fluid should've read a bit on the low side. But to my surprise, it was way high! Like to the top of the plastic portion of the dipstick, almost an inch high. I have added a 10oz bottle of LGR, so I could see the fluid being a little high once fully warmed up. But man, it was high. I'm gonna measure the fluid on the dipstick again tomorrow when I get to work, which will be about a 30 minute drive, so the fluid should be fully warmed up. When I do the drain/fill this week, I'm going to measure exactly how much I get out of the tranny. No doubt, I'm expecting it to be a lot. From what I hear, 3.7 qts is what comes out on the average drain. So I might start with adding that amount back in, regardless of how much comes out. I'll get the trans up to temp, measure, and then add/subtract fluid accordingly. Maybe some of the finnickiness of this trans is because of the overfilled fluid, who knows. When it was rebuilt a few months back, there was an item line on the receipt for 9 quarts of Mercon LV (which is the total capacity of this trans), so I know that they did do a complete fluid exchange. Maybe they overfilled?
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