Synthetic?

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Are there any readily available oils that are true synthetics?
Oils produced with out the use of dino petroleum. I understand that "Synthetic oil" is just a marketing term now.
 
Amsoil and Redline.

Synthetic oil is not really a marketing term now, you are reading into something without knowing the facts.
 
Originally Posted By: LILGUY
Are there any readily available oils that are true synthetics?

Oh lord, here we go again... seems like this question gets asked at least once every week.

My advice: focus on performance/specs rather than what it's made of.
 
Originally Posted By: LILGUY
Are there any readily available oils that are true synthetics? Oils produced with out the use of dino petroleum.

Green Earth Technologies G-OIL. Available at your local Walmart. $26 for a 5-quart jug. But check out GET's web site for a $20 rebate.
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: LILGUY
Are there any readily available oils that are true synthetics?

Oh lord, here we go again... seems like this question gets asked at least once every week.

My advice: focus on performance/specs rather than what it's made of.

I know the question does get asked pretty often, but formulas do change. Although Gp.III oils are "severely" hydrocracked, I have wondered if they are processed such that all of the "impurities" are fractioned out...at least with the early synthetics that were created without mineral oils there was some assurance that the gunk in those oils were never IN synthetic oils to begin with; which was one of the main marketing claims coming from Mobil and Casteroil about 20 years ago. That one point, which I believe was a valuable point and a valid claim, convinced me to use it, and I have used Mobil 1 or Pennzoil Platinum or Ultra ever since. I also don't recall any oil company making that point or claim since Grp III oils came to market, which makes me wonder all the more--of what is really in there these days.

I can see why the question gets asked because I wonder about the same question almost everytime I come on here. Since the definition of "full synthetic" has been so corrupted and misunderstood that I doubt that I would completely trust an answer even from an oil company! The former KGB could have taken lessons in dis/misinformation from oil industry marketers! Few people, myself included, can hardly tell which oils are which just by looking at UOA/VOA, which still begs the question about what species of molecules might be left in there to gunk-up an engine over time.
 
Originally Posted By: LILGUY
Are there any readily available oils that are true synthetics?
Oils produced with out the use of dino petroleum. I understand that "Synthetic oil" is just a marketing term now.


If your referring to the Group IV and Group V Base stocks that used to be used prior to the popularity of modern Group III base stocks most of those were produced from petroleum too.

Amsoil (above OE and XL) and Redline are likely to be the easiest to find that use exclusively Group IV and Group V Base stocks.

PS Be aware that you can not tell how an oil can perform simply by base stock. For instance the oil used in Ferrari Formula 1 Engines is reported to have a significant amount of Group III.
 
Originally Posted By: barlowc
Originally Posted By: LILGUY
Are there any readily available oils that are true synthetics? Oils produced with out the use of dino petroleum.

Green Earth Technologies G-OIL. Available at your local Walmart. $26 for a 5-quart jug. But check out GET's web site for a $20 rebate.


Most evidence seems to indicate this is a Group III based oil.
 
Originally Posted By: OldCowboy
I'm not saying you're wrong, but can you produce a Group III oil from "domestically sourced beef tallow"?


Lets just say it seems to have the characteristics of a GIII Oil and leave it at that.
 
Originally Posted By: SaturnIonVue
at least with the early synthetics that were created without mineral oils there was some assurance that the gunk in those oils were never IN synthetic oils to begin with; which was one of the main marketing claims coming from Mobil and Casteroil about 20 years ago. That one point, which I believe was a valuable point and a valid claim, convinced me to use it, and I have used Mobil 1 or Pennzoil Platinum or Ultra ever since.

And that's just it. Group IV/V may have had an advantage 20+ years ago. Nowadays, it's not necessarily the case. Even Mobil1 is substituting Group III/III+ bases (VISOM) these days.

The reason I suggested to focus on performance/specs instead of oil groups is fairly simple. Take MB 229.5 spec for example, which is one of the more stringent passenger gasoline engine specs out there today. Oils carrying this spec are expected to run cleanly for as long as 15K miles. But interestingly, the list of approved MB 229.5 oils includes both group III as well as group IV/V products. To me, this means that for all practical purposes, there isn't much difference between them.
 
Originally Posted By: Gene K
Originally Posted By: barlowc
Originally Posted By: LILGUY
Are there any readily available oils that are true synthetics? Oils produced with out the use of dino petroleum.

Green Earth Technologies G-OIL. Available at your local Walmart. $26 for a 5-quart jug. But check out GET's web site for a $20 rebate.

Most evidence seems to indicate this is a Group III based oil.

Originally Posted By: Gene K
Originally Posted By: OldCowboy
I'm not saying you're wrong, but can you produce a Group III oil from "domestically sourced beef tallow"?

Lets just say it seems to have the characteristics of a GIII Oil and leave it at that.

Gene K, I don't understand. What evidence? By definition, how can G-OIL, which contains no petroleum, be considered Group III? I'm having a problem leaving your statements "at that" as you suggest.
 
You do know that Plat and Ultra are Grp III oils?
SOPUS has been forthcoming in stating that they are.
With M1, it will depend upon the grade, so other than drawing inferences based upon PDSs and VOAs/UOAs, nobody here really knows.
XOM isn't telling.
To me, there is a dividing line between oils suited to long drain intervals, and those that aren't, regardless of the blenders' claims.
Pennzoil does not promote either PP or PU as extended drain oils, but both seem to hold up well on long runs, judging by how the oil looked in various UOAs.
If you check out the UOA section, there are some good UOAs with PP, PU, old Edge and M1 in various flavors out to 10K+.
OTOH, Synpower does not seem suited to long drains, although it holds up just fine on shorter ones.
Syntec does come in at least one long drain flavor, and vanilla Syntec seems to hold up better than Synpower, although there aren't that many Syntec UOAs
The jury is still out on G-Oil.
There is one very good 10K UOA of this oil in that forum, as well as two mediocre ones on shorter runs.
 
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Synpower does not seem suited to long drains, although it holds up just fine on shorter ones.

I'll have a UOA w/ TBN for SynPower 5W-20 in early December. It'll come from our Saturn which has a 3.5-liter Honda V6 and will have been from an 8K OCI. As I do with all my UOAs, I will post for all to see.
 
How many people actually run their oils for 10K or more in the USA with a high quality synthetic oil?

There are very few, from looking at the UOA board. So running a long, EP syntheic motor oil is not necessary for most people. It might be a great idea for people who forget to change their oil or others who never change their oil.


Originally Posted By: barlowc
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Synpower does not seem suited to long drains, although it holds up just fine on shorter ones.

I'll have a UOA w/ TBN for SynPower 5W-20 in early December. It'll come from our Saturn which has a 3.5-liter Honda V6 and will have been from an 8K OCI. As I do with all my UOAs, I will post for all to see.
 
It doesn't bother me either way. I started to use Mobil 1 in my Taurus but until finances allow had to switch back to regular oil. Besides "creating" jobs, Govt should get the oil/gas/diesel prices down.
 
I'll be curious to see it.
Will you pay the extra to have TBN checked?
Synpower usually shows really pretty UOAs on 5-6K drains, but low residual TBN.
 
mongo,

The whole point of synthetic is that you should be able to run long drains using it.
Now, it can usually be picked up cheaper than most dino after promotional pricing and MIRs.
As our cars are driven now, I find 5-6K plenty long, even though they are typically driven far enough on each start to reach full operating temperature.
If, however, I find myself having to triple my commute or more to keep a job, a real possibility, I'd be all over UOAs to find out exactly how long I could safely run an oil.
I'd probably settle on PP, since I have ~35 qts of it remaining in my stash, along with three jugs of Ultra, figuring anything PP could do Ultra could do a little longer.
 
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