Syntec 10W-40 in 3800 Series II

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Well I just put Syntec in the Buick. I'm sure the General would be appalled, but no warranty at 80K anyway. I'm impressed with the spec's of this oil enough to try it. I've never bought the argument that this engine like a thicker oil, but this is a very thin 40wt. and I like the add pak. I wanted to see how it compares with M1 10-30 for me.
 

haley10

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Originally posted by John in the ATL: Based on summer ambient temp in the deep south, you should be fine. [Off Topic!] Where are you in Tennessee?
Right in the middle. (Warren County) I have 10-30 ATM, and M1, but I kinda promised Motorbike, I'd give this stuff a shot.
 
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I have the same engine and using Amsoil 10W30 with some Schaeffer #132 and Lube Control after about 12,000 miles it drains at a very high 30W or low 40W. These engines are very easy on oil, can easily go the 10-12,000 mile OCI with no problem. You should be okay with the 10W40 but the 10w30 has been working fine for me
 

haley10

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Yep, easy on oil, but I was seeing that I was probably going to have to use LC at least to extend any drains with M1. I guess Amsoil needs it too or you wouldn't be going to the expense. I don't think anything but, a 10-30 is needed here, but this oil is only 13.1 @ 100C.
 
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I have the same engine in my car too, and I've been running Schaeffer's in it for some time now, up until yesterday when I dumped in Pennzoil high mileage 10W30 because I couldn't get any Schaeffer's due to my distributor being closed for the holiday. I'm not a big one on long OCIs, and at ~6000 miles, the Schaeffer's was pretty nasty looking. I don't think a 10W40 is really necessary in this engine. 10W30 is more than sufficient. Edit: This Pennzoil H.M. 10W30 is 12.1 @ 100C. Pretty thick for a 30 wt.
 
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Is not Syntec 10W40 Group III? If it is for that price I would opt for a real synthetic. Ever consider Delvac I/Mobil 1 Truck SUV? At keast your getting a 40 weight plus a real synthetic for the same price. Food for thought- I just hate to see another person shammed into thinking that Syntec(except GC 0W30) and Mobil 1 are on the same playing field.
 
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except from what ive been reading and based on what ive seen here the syntec 5w40 and 10w40 are looking like a very good oil, much better than their 30wt syntec oil, namely in their additive pack and that its thin for a 40wt. It is for this same reason im considering putting the 5w40 or 10w40 into my jeep.
 
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My 3.8L just broke 100K miles and instead of using the normal Schaeffer's 10W-30 Blend, I used their 15W-40 Blend and will perform a UOA here soon and compare it to my older one running 10W-30. It might be all in my head but I swear it runs quieter on the thicker oil.
 
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The Syntec 10W-40 is definitely a nice oil, I wouldn't think twice about using it in your engine, go for it, I'm sure you and your engine will like it.
 

haley10

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Originally posted by outrun: Is not Syntec 10W40 Group III? If it is for that price I would opt for a real synthetic. Ever consider Delvac I/Mobil 1 Truck SUV? At keast your getting a 40 weight plus a real synthetic for the same price. Food for thought- I just hate to see another person shammed into thinking that Syntec(except GC 0W30) and Mobil 1 are on the same playing field.
No, I have not considered Delvac. 40wt.s are not needed in this engine. This Syntec is unique in that it is an ultra-thin 40, [email protected] The majority of 40's are way too much, imho. I have not been shammed. This a Group III with some PAO and Shell XHVI 5.2, so I know what I'm getting. I use Mobil 1 and if I didn't expect equivalent or superior performance, I wouldn't be trying it. There's more than one way to skin a cat when it comes to formulating a great oil. I like the data, I have seen on this oil. I have not been duped by Castrol's evil empire. [Big Grin] [ July 05, 2004, 10:40 AM: Message edited by: haley10 ]
 
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quote:
Originally posted by haley10: Yep, easy on oil, but I was seeing that I was probably going to have to use LC at least to extend any drains with M1. I guess Amsoil needs it too or you wouldn't be going to the expense.
Actually, I ran the 10W30 for 40,000 miles without LC at 12,000 mile OCI and the results were fine. The LC along with the Schaeffers #132 improved the UOA slightly over plain ole Amsoil but it was still good without the additives. INteresting though, I just purchased another Buick Regal with the 3800 SC engine with only 25,000 miles and after the changeover to the Amsoil 10W30 I hear a ticking/clicking sound, after warm up, push rods clicking away??? I don't recall having this sound with the previous one. Same year engine but 35,000 fewer miles. Maybe something to be said for the 10W40 to remove this sound?
 

haley10

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No Spector, I have no noises to quiet. Engine was very quiet with Syntec 10-30 and M1. I'm kinda just playing. Maybe the Amsoil quieted things so much you are hearing a noisy injector(s) or something. I'd check further. My engine sounds no different with the current oil and I would not recommend a 40wt. to anyone. In fact, I may dispell the theory that thicker is better in this one. [I dont know] The Syntec is barely a 40wt. I haven't used the ATM yet, but it should be ideal. I would not expect to hear any lifter type noise. I used to think I had some lifter noise until I learned to stop running Shell gasolines. Some Ford and GM V-6 will develop a "ticking" when warm with it.
 
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quote:
Originally posted by haley10: No Spector, I have no noises to quiet. Engine was very quiet with Syntec 10-30 and M1. I'm kinda just playing. Maybe the Amsoil quieted things so much you are hearing a noisy injector(s) or something. I'd check further. My engine sounds no different with the current oil and I would not recommend a 40wt. to anyone. In fact, I may dispell the theory that thicker is better in this one. [I dont know] The Syntec is barely a 40wt. I haven't used the ATM yet, but it should be ideal. I would not expect to hear any lifter type noise. I used to think I had some lifter noise until I learned to stop running Shell gasolines. Some Ford and GM V-6 will develop a "ticking" when warm with it.
So whats wrong with GC 0W-30? It is right on the border of being a 40W and a better basestock. It is the same price. It is very stable. Works well for extended drains. How can oil be thick enough at operating temp yet to thin at starting temp? Nothing wrong with the 10W-40. I just fail to see what advantage it has over the 0W-30. [I dont know] Gene
 
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Originally posted by outrun: Is not Syntec 10W40 Group III? I just hate to see another person shammed into thinking that Syntec(except GC 0W30) and Mobil 1 are on the same playing field.
outrun, I'm not picking on you; you just happen to be the last person to say it. I wish everyone would just get over this... [Roll Eyes] ...unless someone has the production cost figures to back up the accusations (and I don't mean just the cost of the base oil, I mean the production costs to produce this specific formulation). I'm sorry, while I don't claim that the people that run Castrol are on the list to be canonized, I believe there are cost/formulation aspects here to which all the "experts" on this board aren't privy. Either do the research or stop the accusations...PLEASE. [Cheers!] PS ...and why does no one point out that Castrol is giving us in NA €19/litre SLX for $4.79/qt? I'll save some of you the trouble, "Well when you are dumping oil you can't sell anywhere else, you'll accept the lower price just to get rid of it." Who has the research to show that is true and what does it mean, then, if they are still producing new batches of it, they like selling at a "loss?" [ July 05, 2004, 02:01 PM: Message edited by: pscholte ]
 
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Originally posted by pscholte: PS ...and why does no one point out that Castrol is giving us in NA €19/litre SLX for $4.79/qt? I'll save some of you the trouble, "Well when you are dumping oil you can't sell anywhere else, you'll accept the lower price just to get rid of it." Who has the research to show that is true and what does it mean, then, if they are still producing new batches of it, they like selling at a "loss?"
I actually believe it is because the market for 0W-30 oils is in the European Manufatures who require this grade. The US 0W-30 could not meet the requirements. Because of the low-volume for this market (Compared to say 5W-20) it was cheaper to ship SLX to the US than make a US Formula that met A3/B3/B4-98, BMW LL-01, VW 502.00/503.01/505.00,MB 229.1/229.3 and Porsche Requirements. I believe if the US market gets big enough in this grade production will return to the US. This is the same reason we get the Belgium 5W-40 instead of making it here. Gene [ July 05, 2004, 03:28 PM: Message edited by: Gene K ]
 
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Originally posted by Gene K:
quote:
Originally posted by pscholte: PS ...and why does no one point out that Castrol is giving us in NA €19/litre SLX for $4.79/qt? I'll save some of you the trouble, "Well when you are dumping oil you can't sell anywhere else, you'll accept the lower price just to get rid of it." Who has the research to show that is true and what does it mean, then, if they are still producing new batches of it, they like selling at a "loss?"
I actually believe it is because the market for 0W-30 oils is in the European Manufatures who require this grade. The US 0W-30 could not meet the requirements. Because of the low-volume for this market (Compared to say 5W-20) it was cheaper to ship SLX to the US than make a US Formula that met A3/B3/B4-98, BMW LL-01, VW 502.00/503.01/505.00,MB 229.1/229.3 and Porsche Requirements. I believe if the US market gets big enough in this grade production will return to the US. This is the same reason we get the Belgium 5W-40 instead of making it here. Gene

Gene, Your explanation makes consummately good sense!...now I have to admit that if part of the explanation were that there are these guys in lederhösen in the Black Forest pouring German magic into SLX, that would be great too! (and neither of these explanations point to wickedness on the part of the evil Castrol empire!) [Wink] [Cheers!] [ July 05, 2004, 04:15 PM: Message edited by: pscholte ]
 
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pscholte, There is a point a man has to stand his ground. I no longer can sit back and see throngs of innocent lambs being shammed into Castrol's devious North American scheme. The average Joe "sees synthetic" and he buys the Castrol stuff under the presumption it is just that. Mobil 1 suffers the chief shaft...in my opinion unfairly. My analogy do not sell 14kt gold and market as real gold its diluted garbage again in my opinion. Or in Castrols case do not market 14kt gold as if its some 22kt stuff. Notice to Amsoils credit how they even write PAO formulation on there cases?? There even Amsoil has to re-assert its product is against Castrols treachery. That is why if I want GroupIII I would go with Series 7500 any day of the week. In my opinion again, I see that as honest stuff.
 
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quote:
Originally posted by outrun: pscholte, There is a point a man has to stand his ground. I no longer can sit back and see throngs of innocent lambs being shammed into Castrol's devious North American scheme. The average Joe "sees synthetic" and he buys the Castrol stuff under the presumption it is just that. Mobil 1 suffers the chief shaft...in my opinion unfairly. My analogy do not sell 14kt gold and market as real gold its diluted garbage again in my opinion. Or in Castrols case do not market 14kt gold as if its some 22kt stuff. Notice to Amsoils credit how they even write PAO formulation on there cases?? There even Amsoil has to re-assert its product is against Castrols treachery. That is why if I want GroupIII I would go with Series 7500 any day of the week. In my opinion again, I see that as honest stuff.
outrun, I believe you that you are standing on principle and I respect that...but...I honestly don't believe we have the whole story. I can't accept that the whole world sits idly by while a major international company robs the uninformed. I'm not any more prepared to trust Mobil's business practices, or their motives in "the synthetic showdown," than you are to trust Castrol's. I think there is more to this than any of us know. Again, I DO respect your stand for what you believe is the real story. I'm just not sure you or I know it. [Cheers!]
 
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quote:
Originally posted by pscholte:
quote:
Originally posted by outrun: pscholte, There is a point a man has to stand his ground. I no longer can sit back and see throngs of innocent lambs being shammed into Castrol's devious North American scheme. The average Joe "sees synthetic" and he buys the Castrol stuff under the presumption it is just that. Mobil 1 suffers the chief shaft...in my opinion unfairly. My analogy do not sell 14kt gold and market as real gold its diluted garbage again in my opinion. Or in Castrols case do not market 14kt gold as if its some 22kt stuff. Notice to Amsoils credit how they even write PAO formulation on there cases?? There even Amsoil has to re-assert its product is against Castrols treachery. That is why if I want GroupIII I would go with Series 7500 any day of the week. In my opinion again, I see that as honest stuff.
outrun, I believe you that you are standing on principle and I respect that...but...I honestly don't believe we have the whole story. I can't accept that the whole world sits idly by while a major international company robs the uninformed. I'm not any more prepared to trust Mobil's business practices, or their motives in "the synthetic showdown," than you are to trust Castrol's. I think there is more to this than any of us know. Again, I DO respect your stand for what you believe is the real story. I'm just not sure you or I know it. [Cheers!]

[Off Topic!] There is indeed more to the story. The Mobil-Castrol Lawsuit was more a result of bad blood between the the two than anything to do with Group III. I personally do not feel that Group III produced using Petroleum Feedstocks should be able to be called synthetic at this time. However I believe Group III oils produced with Slack-Wax Feedstock should be able to be called Synthetic. Motor Oils should be required to list the Group(s) and percentages on the can. Also a Group III+ category should be introduced for Slack-Wax Group III's. This way people would know they are paying double the price for Semi-Synthetics that are sometimes 89% Group II and 11% Hydrocracked Petroleum Feedstock Group III. Castrol did nothing wrong. In their opinion the term Synthetic was a marketing term. The courts agreed. There was a accepted definition in the past that meant oil produced in a certain way. With advances in technology it is time for a new definition. If a Group III can be produced that is functionally equal to a Group IV why should the Synthetic name not be required? Synthetic means man-made. If you want to get technical ever bottle of oil on the shelf is Semi-Synthetic since ever single bottle started with some natural component and was then made by man into its current form. Gene
 
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