Student loans to hit 1 trillion this year.

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: JOD
Originally Posted By: wallyuwl


I want to know who these "average" professors are that are making $140k.


They aren't. This is simply more inflammatory lies propagated by those who seem to think that secondary education is evil, and that somehow we're going to be more competitive in a global marketplace with a society that is less educated. Good luck with that...

The median college professor's salary nationwide is about 60K. Average vary pretty widely depending on geographic location and the field of specialty. There are some professors who are paid incredibly well, and these are generally in the medical field--and they're working physicians who bring in a lot more than they are paid. That's why universities fight for them, and why they're paid so well. Other professors are paid incredibly well because they have large private research grants, which makes them attractive to the university (again, since they're a net gain to the university). Is easy though to just ignore this and talk about how we're wasting money paying these people all of this money.


Im not evil and against advnced education. I have advanced degrees.

Take a look at this:

http://www1.salary.com/Professor-Chemical-Engineering-Salary.html

That's median. What happens to the better/older ones? Where do they fall?

 

[Mr Nice]

1 trillion dollars is a small price to pay for having the world's most brightest and educated students.

All colleges and universities have become degree mills. Students loans should NOT be dischargeable. They took out the loan and them must repay it back.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
1 trillion dollars is a small price to pay for having the world's most brightest and educated students.

All colleges and universities have become degree mills. Students loans should NOT be dischargeable. They took out the loan and them must repay it back.




+1. Breaking of legs like a loan shark would do would influence the payment of debts versus fleece of a new luxury car.

 

[CivicFan]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Originally Posted By: JOD
Originally Posted By: wallyuwl


I want to know who these "average" professors are that are making $140k.


They aren't. This is simply more inflammatory lies propagated by those who seem to think that secondary education is evil, and that somehow we're going to be more competitive in a global marketplace with a society that is less educated. Good luck with that...

The median college professor's salary nationwide is about 60K. Average vary pretty widely depending on geographic location and the field of specialty. There are some professors who are paid incredibly well, and these are generally in the medical field--and they're working physicians who bring in a lot more than they are paid. That's why universities fight for them, and why they're paid so well. Other professors are paid incredibly well because they have large private research grants, which makes them attractive to the university (again, since they're a net gain to the university). Is easy though to just ignore this and talk about how we're wasting money paying these people all of this money.


Im not evil and against advnced education. I have advanced degrees.

Take a look at this:

http://www1.salary.com/Professor-Chemical-Engineering-Salary.html

That's median. What happens to the better/older ones? Where do they fall?


A lot depends on the discipline. My suggestion of a $140k/year was skewed - I was using medicine, IT and business related schools for my analysis.

Then I pulled the data for Indiana University, adjusted for the FTE (10 month versus 12 month of teaching, part time or full time) and the average, across all fields comes to $71k/year for an FTE.

 

[Hollow]

What happens to those of us who accrue great debt to go into a low paying environment? I'll be lucky to ever pay off the student debt that seminary is running me, considering the pay I will be getting as a pastor or chaplain.

Entirely my fault?

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette

Students loans should NOT be dischargeable. They took out the loan and them must repay it back.




By that reasoning no loans should be dischargable.

 

[wallyuwl]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Take a look at this:

http://www1.salary.com/Professor-Chemical-Engineering-Salary.html

That's median. What happens to the better/older ones? Where do they fall?


Chemical engineering is one of the highest paying fields for both graduates of programs, and professorships.

You conveniently listed the average full professor salary for one of the highest paying professorship fields. As I said, most professorship positions are not at the full professor rank - in fact, based on being in academia for a long tiem, I'd guess no more than 25% are. With another 25% being associate, and 50% assistant. And the median is still $121k for these full professors in chemical engineering, a far cry from the inclusive (i.e.: all fields combined) $140k average that was originally quoted for "professors" of all fields.

Now look at this, which is assistant professors in this same highly-paid field:

http://www1.salary.com/Asst-Professor-Chemical-Engineering-salary.html


The median, inclusive, salary of professorships being around $60k as JOD said is much closer to the truth, especially when junior and technical colleges are included.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: CivicFan
Originally Posted By: JHZR2

Im not evil and against advnced education. I have advanced degrees.

Take a look at this:

http://www1.salary.com/Professor-Chemical-Engineering-Salary.html

That's median. What happens to the better/older ones? Where do they fall?


A lot depends on the discipline. My suggestion of a $140k/year was skewed - I was using medicine, IT and business related schools for my analysis.

Then I pulled the data for Indiana University, adjusted for the FTE (10 month versus 12 month of teaching, part time or full time) and the average, across all fields comes to $71k/year for an FTE.


But that likely includes assistand and associate profs and other things.

Average over all the admin and support staff, and it likely still comes out about the same.

Fully burdened rate != pay

 

[CivicFan]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Originally Posted By: CivicFan
Originally Posted By: JHZR2

Im not evil and against advnced education. I have advanced degrees.

Take a look at this:

http://www1.salary.com/Professor-Chemical-Engineering-Salary.html

That's median. What happens to the better/older ones? Where do they fall?


A lot depends on the discipline. My suggestion of a $140k/year was skewed - I was using medicine, IT and business related schools for my analysis.

Then I pulled the data for Indiana University, adjusted for the FTE (10 month versus 12 month of teaching, part time or full time) and the average, across all fields comes to $71k/year for an FTE.


But that likely includes assistand and associate profs and other things.

Average over all the admin and support staff, and it likely still comes out about the same.

Fully burdened rate != pay


Yes, it's the SALARY of all the professors. Full professors average $90k/year SALARY (a much smaller population). You can then do the additions for the benefits and overhead to come up with the full, burdened cost.

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2


You couldnt be more wrong. Great, youre looking at football and basketball. Ever think of title IX?

Take USC Football:

48 Univ of Southern California (Football)

Rev:$29,080,117
Exp:$20,820,468
Profit:$8,259,649

But what about the "equivalent" budgeted women's sports that hve to be funded to the level of this program? Add an "equivalent" $20M in for that, and sports are in the red.


You are, of course, 100% incorrect in your understanding of Title IX. Expenses are not required to be equal. The only place this "requirement" exists is in your own mind.

Sure, let's look at USC athletic program. Here's the most recent year for which I can find complete data:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/allthingstrojan/2008/10/usc-makes-milli.html

55 million of the total 75 million in expenses is men's football, men's basketball, and the general fund (the general funding comprises things like stadium overhead and the payment to the university's general fund). Total income is.....75 million dollars. The reason the department operates at a net zero is because the payment to academic services varies depending on the income of the department.

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
I was in a club sport in college, because it was not allowed to be varsity due to budget. The women's team was varsity, and most all had a full ride (though they werent very good), because it offset the football budget.


So what? We aren't talking about that. If you want to argue about the evils of Title IX, then go ahead. But you said what made you mad was that the general student populace was funding scholarships, and that's simply not true in most instances. And using your USC example, the department MAKES money for the university--a LOT of money. Even with the football team under suspension it's making money!

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Look at the costs of the athletic budget, quota/diversity/non-scholarly scholarships, financial aid, out of state subsidization for in state students, etc. and the numbers change from your narrow view.


What on earth does financial aid and in-state tuition have to do with your original point that 'sports and other scholarships' are being subsidized by the general student populace'? My view is hardly narrow, and I'm intimately familiar with the university budgets and how they fund scholarships. Overwhelmingly, scholarships are paid with private dollars, even at public institutions, or they're funded by athletic programs.

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
1 trillion dollars is a small price to pay for having the world's most brightest and educated students.

That's a moot point when multi-national corporations will hire immigrants or people in other countries with advanced degrees for less money than US citizens.

 

[Mr Nice]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette

Students loans should NOT be dischargeable. They took out the loan and them must repay it back.

By that reasoning no loans should be dischargable.

Whats wrong with paying back money that you signed for and borrowed (that goes for any loan) ?

Nobody held a gun to your head.

My oldest sister hired a Rutgers law school grad to work at her law firm for $20 an hour and the guy wasn't to happy about having $100,000+ in student loans and working for peanuts. My sister told him if he wanted pay, power and prestige in life he should have gone to medical school and become a doctor......

not some dime a dozen ambulance chasing wannabe lawyer.

 

[wallyuwl]

I don't know about other major college programs, but at the University of Kentucky the sports are entirely self-sufficient regarding their annual budgets. This includes coaches salaries, strength coaches, weight training equipment, etc. I'm not sure how it works with upgrading buildings, stadiums, practice fields, etc. I think that is all covered by private/booster/tickets money as well.

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: needsducktape
I'm not sure everyone needs to go to college anyway.

1. My friend BARELY passed high school, now he manages a small chain of service stations. -Owns his house, owns his boat & car and ZERO debt.

2. Just about everyone I went to college with (except a doctor and lawyer friend of mine) : Paying on a car, paying student loans (usually between $30-150k) rents an apartment.

College -Especially the University of phoenix for profit types ARE MONEY MAKING MACHINES
-Students: OFTEN little return on that investment. -aka working the same jobs that you could work without a degree.

NPR has been doing major in depth coverage of his issue and I encourage people to listen in- As OUR gov't (Left AND + Right) are sinking money into FOR PROFIT schools which are poven to be not so good for the students.


This is THE most spot on post in this thread. Our system is now set up to push EVERY student into higher education, using debt, that is backstopped by the federal government. It's nothing but a racket.

So many kids who end up as debt ridden college drop outs would have been far better off pursuing a skilled trade, or just getting a job and living within their means. Instead, they end up getting a job (if they're lucky these days) and can't live within their means because of school loans that are worthless to them.

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2


Take a look at this:

http://www1.salary.com/Professor-Chemical-Engineering-Salary.html

That's median. What happens to the better/older ones? Where do they fall?


How much money do you think the better ones actually bring into the university in the form of grant money. I can pretty much guarantee you that it exceeds what they're being paid. That's why universities are in competition for them, and that's why they make those big salaries.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: HollowEyes
What happens to those of us who accrue great debt to go into a low paying environment? I'll be lucky to ever pay off the student debt that seminary is running me, considering the pay I will be getting as a pastor or chaplain.

Entirely my fault?

Of course its your fault, who else's? It sure isn't mine or joe taxpayers fault people choose a low paying profession and then decide to borrow the money.

IMO if someone wants a paid education then give the taxpayers something in return for it. Military service is a fine option and they always need pastors.
I see these protesters want their loans forgiven, no way i would do that i would hound like they were on the 10 most wanted list and hunt them till they die or pay up.

 

[Drew99GT]

Meanwhile, while all this debt piles up, this is where we end up:

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/f...20Day%20IMF.png

 

[chubbs1]

Trust me the board of directors make a lot more than the teachers, it is greed and education is in high demand. They will get rich at the expense of the middle class and poor, there is a country north of us I hear that has education available to almost every citizen, even medical care! I wonder how that place makes it. It must be a total wasteland. I've never been there but there must be a big wall and electrified fence to keep the people in, they are socialists....scary place. Maybe some people from there can chime in on how oppressive the regime is (just don't get caught). It is called Canadia or something.

 

[buster]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
Originally Posted By: needsducktape
I'm not sure everyone needs to go to college anyway.

1. My friend BARELY passed high school, now he manages a small chain of service stations. -Owns his house, owns his boat & car and ZERO debt.

2. Just about everyone I went to college with (except a doctor and lawyer friend of mine) : Paying on a car, paying student loans (usually between $30-150k) rents an apartment.

College -Especially the University of phoenix for profit types ARE MONEY MAKING MACHINES
-Students: OFTEN little return on that investment. -aka working the same jobs that you could work without a degree.

NPR has been doing major in depth coverage of his issue and I encourage people to listen in- As OUR gov't (Left AND + Right) are sinking money into FOR PROFIT schools which are poven to be not so good for the students.


This is THE most spot on post in this thread. Our system is now set up to push EVERY student into higher education, using debt, that is backstopped by the federal government. It's nothing but a racket.

So many kids who end up as debt ridden college drop outs would have been far better off pursuing a skilled trade, or just getting a job and living within their means. Instead, they end up getting a job (if they're lucky these days) and can't live within their means because of school loans that are worthless to them.


I agree.

 

[Mr Nice]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
So many kids who end up as debt ridden college drop outs would have been far better off pursuing a skilled trade, or just getting a job and living within their means. Instead, they end up getting a job (if they're lucky these days) and can't live within their means because of school loans that are worthless to them.


Thats because American society looks down on people that make a living getting greasy and dirty such as a mechanic.

No doubt, you and your wife will both earn more income per year with a college education compared to 90% of people that have no education past high school.
True or False ?