Stop Playing Chemist
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An engine needs to be properly broken-in before using synthetic oil. A high zinc, conventional oil is recommended to break-in the cam, lifters and piston rings. Not all break-in oils are the same. Choose a break-in oil that does not contain Molybdenum or other friction modifiers.
These additives can slow down the time it takes for the rings to seat. High zinc, low detergent and no friction modifiers is the best way to break-in a new or re-built engine and get it ready for synthetic oil.
I can't say this is not true but it begs a question. ZDDP and MoDTC can reduce wear rates, so why would ZDDP allow the rings to seat as desired but MoDTC make them too slow to seat? Maybe high ZDDP and no MoDTC causes an ideal wear rate during break-in but high ZDDP along with MoDTC makes it take longer than ideal; in other words, the combination is too effective at reducing wear rate.
An engine needs to be properly broken-in before using synthetic oil. A high zinc, conventional oil is recommended to break-in the cam, lifters and piston rings. Not all break-in oils are the same. Choose a break-in oil that does not contain Molybdenum or other friction modifiers.
These additives can slow down the time it takes for the rings to seat. High zinc, low detergent and no friction modifiers is the best way to break-in a new or re-built engine and get it ready for synthetic oil.
I can't say this is not true but it begs a question. ZDDP and MoDTC can reduce wear rates, so why would ZDDP allow the rings to seat as desired but MoDTC make them too slow to seat? Maybe high ZDDP and no MoDTC causes an ideal wear rate during break-in but high ZDDP along with MoDTC makes it take longer than ideal; in other words, the combination is too effective at reducing wear rate.
Originally Posted By: buster
http://www.drivenracingoil.com/dro/synthetic-mistakes
#3.
Some good truth to the article, with perhaps a little bit of bias if you consider the source of the article.
While I will not argue any of the points, I'm sure Joe Gibbs would like to sell you their high dollar oil for flat tappets instead of you mixing your own elixir from several sources.
http://www.drivenracingoil.com/dro/synthetic-mistakes
#3.
Some good truth to the article, with perhaps a little bit of bias if you consider the source of the article.
While I will not argue any of the points, I'm sure Joe Gibbs would like to sell you their high dollar oil for flat tappets instead of you mixing your own elixir from several sources.
JG Driven has a system of high-zddp assembly paste and break-in oil that zddp that is formulated to rapidly form its tribological film on wear surfaces. It's always seemed to me that they have things pretty well figured out within their system. But I think we should keep in mind that they're formulating primarily for race engines that have extremely high contact loads.
Great line of oils, mostly for racing applications. If I had a high performance car, like a Vette, I'd probably use their oil.
Point is though, just because oils are compatible doesn't mean mixing them will give you superior results. That is extremely naive.
Point is though, just because oils are compatible doesn't mean mixing them will give you superior results. That is extremely naive.
tig1 better read this. He's been going 10k for 100k since new.. uh oh..
ZDDP ONLY comes into play at high contact pressures and is a sacrificial additive.
I don't think most molybdenum based additives work that way, they're "always working" at any contact pressure and I'm not sure they break down in the process of working. Apples and oranges.
I don't think most molybdenum based additives work that way, they're "always working" at any contact pressure and I'm not sure they break down in the process of working. Apples and oranges.
Originally Posted By: buster
Great line of oils, mostly for racing applications. If I had a high performance car, like a Vette, I'd probably use their oil.
I wouldn't use their stuff in a high performance modern production car like my SRT-8 or a Corvette that's going to see well over 100k miles of use, I'd use M1 or PP, maybe Redline or RP. I WOULD use JG or similar products in a purpose-built racing engine.
Great line of oils, mostly for racing applications. If I had a high performance car, like a Vette, I'd probably use their oil.
I wouldn't use their stuff in a high performance modern production car like my SRT-8 or a Corvette that's going to see well over 100k miles of use, I'd use M1 or PP, maybe Redline or RP. I WOULD use JG or similar products in a purpose-built racing engine.
They need to get on the phone with Honda the ff has a boat load of moly.
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Also interesting is point #4, where they say don't use oils containing Moly during break-in.
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Also interesting is point #4, where they say don't use oils containing Moly during break-in.
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JHZR2
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... But I am one...
This website is dedicated to racing engines. I would not use the info for real world use. This comment stood out as evidence.
"For example, using the system of Engine Assembly Grease followed by the BR Break-In oil and then using XP1 Synthetic Racing Oil, allowed Joe Gibbs Racing to double flat-tappet lifter life from 600 miles to 1200 miles!"
"For example, using the system of Engine Assembly Grease followed by the BR Break-In oil and then using XP1 Synthetic Racing Oil, allowed Joe Gibbs Racing to double flat-tappet lifter life from 600 miles to 1200 miles!"
Originally Posted By: buster
Great line of oils, mostly for racing applications.
But they did forget this:
5th Trap - Don't Overpay for your Oil
$10.99 a quart and up is too much for synthetic "street engine oils" in the United States, and $43.96 for a quart of synthetic HDEO is way too much.
If it's a racing application, I can see it. For anything else, well, their prices would make a Canadian retailer blush. In fact, if it's sold anywhere in Canada, I'd bet that the single quart price is more than a 5 quart jug of PP.
Great line of oils, mostly for racing applications.
But they did forget this:
5th Trap - Don't Overpay for your Oil
$10.99 a quart and up is too much for synthetic "street engine oils" in the United States, and $43.96 for a quart of synthetic HDEO is way too much.
If it's a racing application, I can see it. For anything else, well, their prices would make a Canadian retailer blush. In fact, if it's sold anywhere in Canada, I'd bet that the single quart price is more than a 5 quart jug of PP.
Wouldn't a Xw30 synthetic and Xw30 traditional oil both fall in the 30 grade viscosity range at the prescribed temp? I know it takes more additives to make a dino oil cover a greater range, but saying you should treat a synthetic graded oil as "heavier grade" because of a higher VI doesn't make sense to me... Maybe I'm reading #1 wrong.
I think they are making a specific reference to Redline oils without spelling it out by name. Redline's entire line has HTHS values in the range of the next grade up, and they even advertise their 5w30 and 10w30 as being "thicker than petroleum 10w40 at operating temperature."
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