SS and Medicare in big Trouble!

[ZZman]

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=5326078&page=1

**I agree that their insurance should be reasonable also. But that means reeling in the whole lawsuit system and making judgements/settlements fair and not outrageuos.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
If those people had been allowed to invest their money in the market all that time, they would have been far in front of S/S, recession or not.


No, they would not. That's the fallacy of "investment". It's an exercise in reduced losses.

Tell me what would have occurred if everyone had abandoned SS and contributed the exact same amount in an IRA. You would have legions of millionaires retiring. Do you have the foolish notion that they would all be served by illegals as they sip martinis with Dr. Haas in Sarasota?

You kill me.

What happened to everyone's pension that was "in the market" after the market crash. They sure got a banging ROI ..how about what those same "mega growth investments" today??

They're going to figure a way to get your wealth, Tempest. Home equity lines of credit did most of it, the last economic fad did the rest.

 

[Tempest]

Originally Posted By: ZZman
Tempest: I think the medical community would disagree. More doctors have dropped out of it and they always complain that it doesn't pay enough.

**I do agree that these medical doctors, hospitals and insurance providers need to get real and keep their increases at inflationary rates and not double digit rate increases.

If the government mandated that the industry you are in provide products to people that can't pay for them, how much do you think the cost of those products would inflate?

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
What happened to everyone's pension that was "in the market" after the market crash. They sure got a banging ROI ..how about what those same "mega growth investments" today??

How much ROI are the people that are currently paying SS going to get out of SS?

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
If those people had been allowed to invest their money in the market all that time, they would have been far in front of S/S, recession or not.


You are joking right?

By the same token, why would any one buy insurance or gamble? When you know you will lose money in the long run the more insurance you buy, and the house always win.

You unfortunately have no sense of how much risk someone can tolerate, especially in emergency funds and medical service fund for the nation, like social security and medicare.

Any investment adviser worth their grain of salt knows that you need to reduce your investment the closer you reach retirement, and you should always keep an emergency fund of some sort. What you are recommending is to invest the emergency fund in the higher risk area, that the price will reduce when you need to draw them the most. What you advocate is a buy high sell low strategy.

 

[Tempest]

SS and medicare are not "emergency funds". They are entitlement programs paid for by current workers. When the economy takes a dump, you get less workers and what the OP article said.

You can't have an "emergency fund" that is ~$100 trillion in the hole.

Stock market historically provides ~10% yield per year. Does SS provide that?

 

[ZZman]

That would be an average return. For people that needed to retire during down times it would be a killer....or you would have to postpone retirement until who knows when.

SS was really not made to make life comfortable in retirement but to get people by.

 

[ZZman]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
[If the government mandated that the industry you are in provide products to people that can't pay for them, how much do you think the cost of those products would inflate?


Depends on how greedy I am I guess.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
What happened to everyone's pension that was "in the market" after the market crash. They sure got a banging ROI ..how about what those same "mega growth investments" today??

How much ROI are the people that are currently paying SS going to get out of SS?

Kindly answer the question.

The bottom line is that there is no solution, in total, when you're in a net loss economy. I really think you can't grasp the concept. You're not alone. Most of the population can't see it either.

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
SS was really not made to make life comfortable in retirement but to get people by.

Then what is the point?
Quote:
Depends on how greedy I am I guess.

How telling it is that the people being forced to provide a product for nothing are considered the greedy ones, but the people expecting things for free are not.

This attitude explains much in our entitlement laden society.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: ZZman
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=5326078&page=1

**I agree that their insurance should be reasonable also. But that means reeling in the whole lawsuit system and making judgements/settlements fair and not outrageuos.


Careful what you wish for.

Oz took that path, now if doctors leave equipment in you after an operation, the ONLY thing that you are entitled to is a free operation to remove it.

To get any form of compensation, you need to be physically damaged to the value of 15% of your total body...then you are entitled to actual costs only...never pain and suffereing or any of that.

Guess what it did to insurance premiums and doctor's bills ?

 

[ZZman]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
SS was really not made to make life comfortable in retirement but to get people by.

Then what is the point?
How telling it is that the people being forced to provide a product for nothing are considered the greedy ones, but the people expecting things for free are not.

This attitude explains much in our entitlement laden society.


The point is getting by is better than not getting by.

Where do you get they are not getting anything. They get paid, just not as much as they would like. (Maybe the Medicare people need to pay defense contractors too!)

There are many things that I don't necessarily agree like Welfare for many people, but a blessed and rich country like ours should not have people suffering from lack of reasonable healthcare.

 

[Tempest]

How much of your paycheck are you donating to help the "suffering" people in this country?

 

[ZZman]

Shannow: My point was people shouldn't be able to win multi-million dollar lawsuits to just win them. What formula are they using to figure these out?

I would think a lawsuit should do something like pay the bills you incurred and then have a set amount charged for pain or suffering or as a lesson to punish the doctor or hospital. If a death occurs then you could take that person's yearly salary x life expectancy figuring in inflation over those years and that is the settlement.

One person getting 1 million and another 30 million is ridiculous.

 

[ZZman]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
How much of your paycheck are you donating to help the "suffering" people in this country?


Actually I do give to the United Way out of my paycheck. I also give blood at the Red Cross and donate items to Goodwill.

And when and if the government decides to start a Universal Healthcare or something else I along with you will help the suffering people.............

What are your contributions?

 

[Tempest]

UW is a good organization, but it is not a direct health care provider. I also donate whatever I can. They won't take my blood due to health issues.

My main contribution is to have a job and pay my own way. That is the best contribution anyone can make.

Yes, if they pass uni-care, then they will indeed be forcing money out of people's pockets to pay for other people's bills. You also assume they will actually get care, which is far from set.
http://www.rollcall.com/news/34276-1.html

This is the same as someone needing surgery going around his neighborhood with a gun and forcing people to give them money. I call this robbery, you call it compassion.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
How much of your paycheck are you donating to help the "suffering" people in this country?



How much of our paychecks are you willing to pay to people who aren't suffering?

Ask a hospital or doctor's group how much they're suffering ..and how much more you should give them to make sure that they don't.

 

[firemachine69]

If docs want a raise, take on more patients.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Yes, if they pass uni-care, then they will indeed be forcing money out of people's pockets to pay for other people's bills. You also assume they will actually get care, which is far from set.
http://www.rollcall.com/news/34276-1.html


You are paying for those who cannot afford their medical bill one way or the other. Right now it is through higher insurance cost to the higher medical cost that pays for the uncollected bill run up by the uninsured. In the future it could be armed robbery or higher crime rate in your neighborhood, or unlicensed medical facilities and illegal pharmacy, lack of emergency services (due to abuse of ER), etc.

Not sure if you ever plan to rely on Medicare, if so, well, do you plan for it to be insolvent when you need it?

 

[ryansride2017]

Originally Posted By: Steve S
say ponzi scheme.


The biggest joke is how certain investors are prosecuted for Ponzi Schemes and the government is running the biggest one known to man.