Someone at Valvoline has been taking lessons from Amsoil

[G-MAN]

I just got back from Advance Auto getting a pair of Bosch wiper blades for my Olds minivan. I didn't see any Redline oil, but I did take a look at a bottle of the Maxlife full synthetic. Contrary to what has been posted, this oil does NOT meet any European ACEA or OEM specs. It states on the back "Recommended for applications requiring..." and then lists the ACEA, MB, and BMW specs.

Looks like someone at Valvoline has been reading Amsoil's manual entitled "How To Sound Like You Meet Certain Specs But Really Don't."

 

[buster]

I've been to 4 Advance Auto Parts and all four had all grades of Redline, except the 5w-40. Regarding the specs. I just noticed that today bc I was just at Advance Auto Parts. ACEA what? A1, A3...It's a joke. Problem is 99% of the population doesn't take oil as serious as we do so they NEVER here complaints about this stuff.

[ April 10, 2004, 02:09 PM: Message edited by: buster ]

 

[Road Rage]

quote:

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Originally posted by G-Man II:
I just got back from Advance Auto getting a pair of Bosch wiper blades for my Olds minivan. I didn't see any Redline oil, but I did take a look at a bottle of the Maxlife full synthetic. Contrary to what has been posted, this oil does NOT meet any European ACEA or OEM specs. It states on the back "Recommended for applications requiring..." and then lists the ACEA, MB, and BMW specs.

Looks like someone at Valvoline has been reading Amsoil's manual entitled "How To Sound Like You Meet Certain Specs But Really Don't."

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I can only go with what Valvoline posted in their product info on their website - are you saying they lied about that, or are you basing you displeasure on what was on the bottle?

 

[Mystic]

I am going to take a look myself and see what is written on the bottle, even if I don't actually buy the oil.

Before I came to this web site I did try Valvoline MaxLife. It did seem to run really good in my car, although it did not stop a seal leak (Auto-RX stopped the leak).

Of course, that was the conventional Valvoline MaxLife. It would be nice to see Valvoline advancing in quality. For one thing, Valvoline is easier to find-you can find it at any NAPA Store or CarQuest Store.

I have some misgivings about Valvoline. Before I use the oil I would like to see some VOAs or UOAs.

 

[Pablo]

G-man, whatever makes you happy.

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

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Originally posted by Road Rage:
I can only go with what Valvoline posted in their product info on their website - are you saying they lied about that, or are you basing you displeasure on what was on the bottle?

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Here is what is on the Valvoline web site. Same language as on the bottle. Total BS which doesn't mean a thing. I could bottle baby oil and "recommend" it. Doesn't mean it meets the specs.

quote:

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MaxLife Synthetic is safe for new and rebuilt engines and will not void new car warranties. Recommended for engines specifying API SL/SJ, ACEA A3/B3/B4, BMW LL01/98, VW502.00/505.00, MB229.3/229.1. See owners manual for appropriate viscosity.

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[Bobert]

****, Valvoline doesn't recommend it for applications requiring the 229.4 spec.

What an inferior oil!

quote:

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Originally posted by G-Man II:
I could bottle baby oil and "recommend" it. Doesn't mean it meets the specs.

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LOL!

I agree with you G-ManII, the careful wording is misleading. "Recommended", is basically saying we haven't tested it. They could have just as easily said-- "Recommended for door hinge applications".

 

[Pablo]

quote:

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"Recommended", is basically saying we haven't tested it.

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I can't speak for Valvoline. This is NOT true when speaking of Amsoil.

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

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Originally posted by Pablo:

quote:

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"Recommended", is basically saying we haven't tested it.

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I can't speak for Valvoline. This is NOT true when speaking of Amsoil.

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No offense Pablo, but how do we know this? Amsoil on virutally all of its oils uses this wishy-washy "Recommended for..." language rather than stating flat out that the oil "meets" the specs in question. I find that highly suspect myself.

 

[Mystic]

We will only find out about this oil after some people here use it and do VOAs and UOAs. I am kind of leery myself about using Valvoline. I think I will stick with Chevron (or Halvoline, probably the same oil).

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,

at various locations here this is a live issue with denials that warranties are jeopardised etc.
The other conversation is under the new Amsoil 5w-40 heading

In various replies from marketers here NO acceptances were made that engine manufacturers are serious over the words meets, is certified or is "Approved" and etc!

The following extract from Detroit Diesel's "Lubricating Oil, Fuel and Filters" 7SE270 booklet leave no doubts and when engines like I use cost $A40k+ you learn "THE RULES" real quick

Extract from "API Symbol" (page 6 ):
Starts;

".....A marketer is required to license his oil with API in order to display the symbol.
Beware that some marketers may indicate that their products "meet" API requirements.
This is not adequate.
Only oils licenced by API should be used in Detroit Diesel engines.

Ends

So commercial users like me will NOT use products that may cause any conflict with suppliers particularly when extended warranty periods are involved

Regards

 

[Jiao]

Yup, meets is not adequate. As for me, I always used 'exceed' and check out the API website for API license.

 

[Audi Junkie]

...but it smelled good.

 

[buster]

I understand most of this is a money issue regarding testing. I can see where some would be turned off by the language being used.

For instance, how can Amsoil 0w-30 be A3 rated if it's HT/HS is 3.4? This is really nit picking here but if they can get a way with that, how many others could/will follow this?

Amsoil TSO 0w-30

[ April 11, 2004, 11:22 AM: Message edited by: buster ]

 

[SSDude]

No one hate false advertising more than I do. However, before condeming this oil I would like to know what is in it. It is currently on sale at Kragen for $3.99. It might be a sleeper.

 

[yannis]

Holy Moly

it is not A-1 , B-1 ... but A1 ,B1 or A1-02 or A1-98 or A1-96..

[ April 11, 2004, 11:59 AM: Message edited by: yannis ]

 

[MolaKule]

This language with the word "Meets" in it usually infers that the oil's additive package is "suitable" or "proper" for the applications/specifications listed on the label.

It does not mean that the oil was tested against every conceivable test required by the specifications or was tested by an epensive API series of test, but that the additive company is supplying an add pack that has been tested against those qualifications.

In lieu of actual engine testing and UOA's, one has to assume the formulator has packaged this oil/add combo according to the "state of the art."

 

[Last_Z]

quote:

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Originally posted by Donald:
Amsoil warranties the engine if their oil (and filter) causes damage. No one else does that, whether they are API certified of not. What more would you like Amsoil to do?

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Quaker State has the same type of warranty.

EDIT: BTW, with all due respect to the Amsoil dealers here, but my feeling is that in order for Amsoil to pay for damages to an engine as a result of Amsoil's oil, one would have to prove time travel is possible. Amsoil is a very good oil, but I think we have established on this board that Amsoil's claim of 25-35k mile oil changes is nothing but the marketing department earning their money. You could certainly go a long time on such oils between intervals, but not without a filter change plus make up and most definitely not 25-35k miles. Even if you could go 25k miles, the highly contaminated oil is likely to cause extra wear and leave deposits behind.
Just my opinion!

[ April 11, 2004, 05:18 PM: Message edited by: Last_Z ]

 

[jthorner]

quote:

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I understand most of this is a money issue regarding testing

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A weasels argument if there ever was one. If you can't pay, don't play.

quote:

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Amsoil warranties the engine if their oil (and filter) causes damage

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A promise made by marketers and lawyers ... which they fully intend to never pay a dime on. How many Toyota owners ended up with sludged engines when running Amsoil's recommended extended drain intervals? Amsoil says it is Toyota's fault and does nothing to help. The fact of the matter is that those car owners would not have had a problem with their engines if they had used *any* API licensed oil and changed it every 3,000 miles just like the much derided Jiffy Lube recommends. However, these people paid top dollar for a "reliable" Toyota and paid top dollar for a specialty oil ... and ended up with a blown engine and big repair costs. Toyota is off the hook because the owner didn't follow the factory minimum oil change interval. Amsoil is off the hook because the oil didn't "fail". The lawyers are all happy, but the consumer is screwed.

Amsoil's double speak marketing methods turn my stomach.

John

 

[Last_Z]

jthorner,
I think we essentially said (wrote) the exact same thing!