small engine break in
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50!!! hours? Granted my newest Kohler is old enough that I don't remember the recommended break-in. But the 28-horse B&S we started using this summer spec'd a 5 (FIVE) hour break-in and then normal OCIs afterward.
As to the difference w/ generators, maybe the generator div does a long pre-delivery test since a genny is a little more critical than a lawn tractor?
As to the difference w/ generators, maybe the generator div does a long pre-delivery test since a genny is a little more critical than a lawn tractor?
I have read that my 20 HP B&S required a 5 hour breakin. Ed
use motorcycle oil (or ATV) without friction modifiers.
Castrol or Valvoline 4T. ILASC oil or PREMIUM SYN MAY EXTEND BREAK IN.
Castrol or Valvoline 4T. ILASC oil or PREMIUM SYN MAY EXTEND BREAK IN.
A lot of manufacturers will cite periods of just a few hours 2-5 for break-in. I go longer and say about 12-15 hours before full break-in.
50 hours sounds a bit crazy to me.
Also, I don't believe there is a world of difference in coefficient of friction between mineral and synthetic oils.
50 hours sounds a bit crazy to me.
Also, I don't believe there is a world of difference in coefficient of friction between mineral and synthetic oils.
I suppose you will plan to use a single oil. i say use whatever oil is planned to be used after break-in.
I usually fill engine with oil and fuel. check fasteners. start and run upto temp(15minute bench test). Checl for leaks. install engine. Do a 15minute rest run veried load and speeds. recheck engine and equipment. run engine under load at veried speeds. for half hour, let engine cool. Run for 45minutes at moderate to internitet heavy load at varied load.
change oil out. Run second fill around 2-3hrs.
Followed by 5hr oci of moderate to heavy load.
call break-in wear donee.
Go to oem or uoa oci's.
ken
I usually fill engine with oil and fuel. check fasteners. start and run upto temp(15minute bench test). Checl for leaks. install engine. Do a 15minute rest run veried load and speeds. recheck engine and equipment. run engine under load at veried speeds. for half hour, let engine cool. Run for 45minutes at moderate to internitet heavy load at varied load.
change oil out. Run second fill around 2-3hrs.
Followed by 5hr oci of moderate to heavy load.
call break-in wear donee.
Go to oem or uoa oci's.
ken
JR, I suggest you proof your posts a bit more. I'm not sure what you are saying in a few spots.
I assume you are recommending 3 oil changes in the first 10 hours? That's right about where I am.
I'd say after the first 1 1/2 - 2/ 1/2 hours.
Again at the 5-6 hour mark.
3rd time at the 10-12 hour mark and then every 20-25 hours thereafter depending on use, conditions, etc ...
I assume you are recommending 3 oil changes in the first 10 hours? That's right about where I am.
I'd say after the first 1 1/2 - 2/ 1/2 hours.
Again at the 5-6 hour mark.
3rd time at the 10-12 hour mark and then every 20-25 hours thereafter depending on use, conditions, etc ...
Originally Posted By: michaelh
Any ideas as to why Kohler would recommend a 50 hour break in with mineral oil on ther command engines,while their generator division recommends synthetic and ships them out with syn in them,same command series engines?
Initial oil change is 50 hours, there after 100 hours with an oil filter. The Kohler factory fill was changed at 10 hours you could see some glitter in the oil. Delo400 straight 30wt was added for 50 hours...oil still look like new when drained. There after 100 hours OC with Delo400 30wt for 600 hours. Presently using Delo400 15w-40 due to economic reason since Costco has it on sale at a good price. Only grade sold is the Delo400 15w-40. Always stock it up when on sale.
The Kohler presently runs like new. Air filter always checked cleaned and replaced. Proper hourly maintenance according to the manual has been performed.
Any ideas as to why Kohler would recommend a 50 hour break in with mineral oil on ther command engines,while their generator division recommends synthetic and ships them out with syn in them,same command series engines?
Initial oil change is 50 hours, there after 100 hours with an oil filter. The Kohler factory fill was changed at 10 hours you could see some glitter in the oil. Delo400 straight 30wt was added for 50 hours...oil still look like new when drained. There after 100 hours OC with Delo400 30wt for 600 hours. Presently using Delo400 15w-40 due to economic reason since Costco has it on sale at a good price. Only grade sold is the Delo400 15w-40. Always stock it up when on sale.
The Kohler presently runs like new. Air filter always checked cleaned and replaced. Proper hourly maintenance according to the manual has been performed.
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My B&S generator called for a 5 hour break in using their included oil (some kind of xW-30, IIRC). Splash lube engine, no filter, FWIW.
50 hours doesn't seem right.
How much oil does it take? My genset calls for less than a quart, and an oil change is incredibly simple, I use a roasting pan under the frame.
I know someone will say "the engineers know what they're doing", however, maybe I'm just cynical, but I do not trust that bean counters and marketers have not exerted influence on maintenance guidelines.
50 hours doesn't seem right.
How much oil does it take? My genset calls for less than a quart, and an oil change is incredibly simple, I use a roasting pan under the frame.
I know someone will say "the engineers know what they're doing", however, maybe I'm just cynical, but I do not trust that bean counters and marketers have not exerted influence on maintenance guidelines.
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Originally Posted By: strat81
My B&S generator called for a 5 hour break in using their included oil (some kind of xW-30, IIRC). Splash lube engine, no filter, FWIW.
50 hours doesn't seem right.
How much oil does it take? My genset calls for less than a quart, and an oil change is incredibly simple, I use a roasting pan under the frame.
I know someone will say "the engineers know what they're doing", however, maybe I'm just cynical, but I do not trust that bean counters and marketers have not exerted influence on maintenance guidelines.
Different lube system non-splash with oil filter, little over 2 qts capacity.
My B&S generator called for a 5 hour break in using their included oil (some kind of xW-30, IIRC). Splash lube engine, no filter, FWIW.
50 hours doesn't seem right.
How much oil does it take? My genset calls for less than a quart, and an oil change is incredibly simple, I use a roasting pan under the frame.
I know someone will say "the engineers know what they're doing", however, maybe I'm just cynical, but I do not trust that bean counters and marketers have not exerted influence on maintenance guidelines.
Different lube system non-splash with oil filter, little over 2 qts capacity.
I should add that my very conservative (or is it liberal?) break-in procedure above (2 oil changes in the first 10-12 hours) is for a splash lubricated engine only ... one without a full-flow filter.
If your OPE engine (regardless of the application) has a pressurized lubrication system with a full flow filter, I'd swap out the oil and filter at about HALF the recommended interval.
If the manual says an oil change every 50 hours, I'd perform the first one around 25.
The biggest difference is the filter. A full-flow filter will capture the vast majority of abrasive break-in debris the first time it is passed through the filter.
For those with strong stomachs, you might want to take a gander at this that came out of my Ariens snowblower (B&S motor - splash lubed) after about 1.5 hours of run time:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee149...zps40854167.jpg
If your OPE engine (regardless of the application) has a pressurized lubrication system with a full flow filter, I'd swap out the oil and filter at about HALF the recommended interval.
If the manual says an oil change every 50 hours, I'd perform the first one around 25.
The biggest difference is the filter. A full-flow filter will capture the vast majority of abrasive break-in debris the first time it is passed through the filter.
For those with strong stomachs, you might want to take a gander at this that came out of my Ariens snowblower (B&S motor - splash lubed) after about 1.5 hours of run time:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee149...zps40854167.jpg
Originally Posted By: Bror Jace
I should add that my very conservative (or is it liberal?) break-in procedure above (2 oil changes in the first 10-12 hours) is for a splash lubricated engine only ... one without a full-flow filter.
If your OPE engine (regardless of the application) has a pressurized lubrication system with a full flow filter, I'd swap out the oil and filter at about HALF the recommended interval.
If the manual says an oil change every 50 hours, I'd perform the first one around 25.
The biggest difference is the filter. A full-flow filter will capture the vast majority of abrasive break-in debris the first time it is passed through the filter.
For those with strong stomachs, you might want to take a gander at this that came out of my Ariens snowblower (B&S motor - splash lubed) after about 1.5 hours of run time:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee149...zps40854167.jpg
I have a Briggs and Stratton 5500 watt generator with the 342cc engine. After a 2 1/2 hour break in run on the oil supplied it looked like yours. It was very black and "sparkly". I replaced it with Briggs and Stratton synthetic 5W-30 oil and after 6 hours the oil is still a light golden color. I'll most likely change it next at 25 hours instead of the suggested 50 hours. I'll see what it looks like. If there is no visible metal in the oil I'll most likely extend the following OCI. I don't believe the cylinder has a liner. The piston is riding against the aluminum alloy cylinder.
Whimsey
I should add that my very conservative (or is it liberal?) break-in procedure above (2 oil changes in the first 10-12 hours) is for a splash lubricated engine only ... one without a full-flow filter.
If your OPE engine (regardless of the application) has a pressurized lubrication system with a full flow filter, I'd swap out the oil and filter at about HALF the recommended interval.
If the manual says an oil change every 50 hours, I'd perform the first one around 25.
The biggest difference is the filter. A full-flow filter will capture the vast majority of abrasive break-in debris the first time it is passed through the filter.
For those with strong stomachs, you might want to take a gander at this that came out of my Ariens snowblower (B&S motor - splash lubed) after about 1.5 hours of run time:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee149...zps40854167.jpg
I have a Briggs and Stratton 5500 watt generator with the 342cc engine. After a 2 1/2 hour break in run on the oil supplied it looked like yours. It was very black and "sparkly". I replaced it with Briggs and Stratton synthetic 5W-30 oil and after 6 hours the oil is still a light golden color. I'll most likely change it next at 25 hours instead of the suggested 50 hours. I'll see what it looks like. If there is no visible metal in the oil I'll most likely extend the following OCI. I don't believe the cylinder has a liner. The piston is riding against the aluminum alloy cylinder.
Whimsey
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Originally Posted By: Bror Jace
I should add that my very conservative (or is it liberal?) break-in procedure above (2 oil changes in the first 10-12 hours) is for a splash lubricated engine only ... one without a full-flow filter.
If your OPE engine (regardless of the application) has a pressurized lubrication system with a full flow filter, I'd swap out the oil and filter at about HALF the recommended interval.
If the manual says an oil change every 50 hours, I'd perform the first one around 25.
The biggest difference is the filter. A full-flow filter will capture the vast majority of abrasive break-in debris the first time it is passed through the filter.
For those with strong stomachs, you might want to take a gander at this that came out of my Ariens snowblower (B&S motor - splash lubed) after about 1.5 hours of run time:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee149...zps40854167.jpg
Should of stated my application is with a Kohler V-Twin easy on oil, OP was subjecting the Kohler Command splash lube.
Two Kohler(15+ years) splash lube initial factory was changed at 5 hours. There after 25 hour OC per manual. Oil used Delo400. The older Kohler still runs strong believe it was a 1991 model. The other a 1998 a factory defect still going strong after adjustments but runs much hotter versus the older model, hasn't slowed down. Oil capacity is 0.6 qt of oil. Commercial applications.
Oil used the Delo400, never considered any synthetic oil but did for the Kohler V-Twin maybe 200 hours. From my observations the Delo400 on the V-twin after 100 hours trended rather quickly not on a linear scale for the first 100 hours. I believe why Kohler recommends the 100 hour interval. The V-Twin has 850 hours and runs like new a very clean engine.
I should add that my very conservative (or is it liberal?) break-in procedure above (2 oil changes in the first 10-12 hours) is for a splash lubricated engine only ... one without a full-flow filter.
If your OPE engine (regardless of the application) has a pressurized lubrication system with a full flow filter, I'd swap out the oil and filter at about HALF the recommended interval.
If the manual says an oil change every 50 hours, I'd perform the first one around 25.
The biggest difference is the filter. A full-flow filter will capture the vast majority of abrasive break-in debris the first time it is passed through the filter.
For those with strong stomachs, you might want to take a gander at this that came out of my Ariens snowblower (B&S motor - splash lubed) after about 1.5 hours of run time:
http://i229.photobucket.com/albums/ee149...zps40854167.jpg
Should of stated my application is with a Kohler V-Twin easy on oil, OP was subjecting the Kohler Command splash lube.
Two Kohler(15+ years) splash lube initial factory was changed at 5 hours. There after 25 hour OC per manual. Oil used Delo400. The older Kohler still runs strong believe it was a 1991 model. The other a 1998 a factory defect still going strong after adjustments but runs much hotter versus the older model, hasn't slowed down. Oil capacity is 0.6 qt of oil. Commercial applications.
Oil used the Delo400, never considered any synthetic oil but did for the Kohler V-Twin maybe 200 hours. From my observations the Delo400 on the V-twin after 100 hours trended rather quickly not on a linear scale for the first 100 hours. I believe why Kohler recommends the 100 hour interval. The V-Twin has 850 hours and runs like new a very clean engine.
Originally Posted By: michaelh
Any ideas as to why Kohler would recommend a 50 hour break in with mineral oil on ther command engines,while their generator division recommends synthetic and ships them out with syn in them,same command series engines?
I don't believe anyone has addressed the original question: In one instance why does Kohler recommend a minimum of 50 hours break in with conventional oil before switching to synthetic, yet with the same engine in a generator they ship them with synthetic?
Mamala Bay, I don't see anywhere that he said his question applied to splash lube vs. pressurized. Many of the Command series are pressurized.
Michaelh, I am stumped as much as you are. I don't even see any break-in procedure at all on the various Kohler manuals (i.e.- no early oil change).
You should write them and see what they say. I think my Kawasaki commercial engines recommend an early change (at least the equip. mfg. they are mounted on does).
Any ideas as to why Kohler would recommend a 50 hour break in with mineral oil on ther command engines,while their generator division recommends synthetic and ships them out with syn in them,same command series engines?
I don't believe anyone has addressed the original question: In one instance why does Kohler recommend a minimum of 50 hours break in with conventional oil before switching to synthetic, yet with the same engine in a generator they ship them with synthetic?
Mamala Bay, I don't see anywhere that he said his question applied to splash lube vs. pressurized. Many of the Command series are pressurized.
Michaelh, I am stumped as much as you are. I don't even see any break-in procedure at all on the various Kohler manuals (i.e.- no early oil change).
You should write them and see what they say. I think my Kawasaki commercial engines recommend an early change (at least the equip. mfg. they are mounted on does).
I think the conventional vs. synthetic thing is just an old, urban myth now institutionalized in an owner's manual. The myth was that an engine, filled with ultra=slippery synthetic, won't break-in properly.
I don't buy it. The difference between mineral oils and synthetics was never as great as that (coefficient of friction) and has shrunk quite a bit in the last 15 years with the introduction of Group II+ and Group III base stocks as well as soluble moly and other advanced anti-wear additives available in both "kinds" of oil.
So, why the inconsistency? Some folks in the company are more backward than others. That's about all I can say.
I don't buy it. The difference between mineral oils and synthetics was never as great as that (coefficient of friction) and has shrunk quite a bit in the last 15 years with the introduction of Group II+ and Group III base stocks as well as soluble moly and other advanced anti-wear additives available in both "kinds" of oil.
So, why the inconsistency? Some folks in the company are more backward than others. That's about all I can say.
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