Sludgy 1990 F150 5.0

OVERKILL said:
I'd think you'd need to do Kreen + a toothbrush to scrub that stuff off, that lacquer is difficult to remove, flow with it mixed into the oil isn't going to touch it, as you discovered.
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I suppose this was not directed towards me but could apply. :LOL: Sort of a pain and have to replace gaskets to get to both valve covers on this guy. Way back in this thread someone asked if we were going to open it back up and I thought many might be interested to see the affects after all the short oil changes with full synthetics from Pennzoil, M-1, Castrol, and Semi Chevron. Most were bought very cheaply but seems to reinforce the fact that they cannot clean but were just carriers moving the basically loose debris.

The plan after the Castrol Edge was to use some M1-0-40 we have. Maybe the site sponsor would be willing to send us some HPL EC? We could run it with the Edge for another 4k miles and we will open the valve covers back up and post the pictures. :unsure:
 
gfh77665 said:
I am not generally an advocate for additives, although a few are definitely effective and have their place in certain applications. MMO has been around for a very long time with demonstrable results. MMO would, as I said, be a simple, economical, effective treatment for sludging in a 1990 truck engine. It cleans, cheaply.
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The problem with that is the demonstrable results are largely anecdotal which is highly susceptible to bias (you paid money for it, you want it to work, so you easily convince yourself it does). Even if bias isn't a factor, it's still only as reliable as the knowledge of the person observing the results. Even among car enthusiasts, very few have even a basic understanding of oil chemistry.

Say it turns the oil black. Did it do so because it's cleaning... or because it compromised the oil's detergents and accelerated oxidation? (hint... it's the later)
 
RDY4WAR said:
The problem with that is the demonstrable results are largely anecdotal which is highly susceptible to bias (you paid money for it, you want it to work, so you easily convince yourself it does). Even if bias isn't a factor, it's still only as reliable as the knowledge of the person observing the results. Even among car enthusiasts, very few have even a basic understanding of oil chemistry.

Say it turns the oil black. Did it do so because it's cleaning... or because it compromised the oil's detergents and accelerated oxidation? (hint... it's the later)
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Yes, I believe @MolaKule has written on the (lack of) cleaning ability of MMO in the past.
 
DuckRyder said:
If @High Performance Lubricants won't pm me a shipping address and i'll send you some if you promise to keep posting follow ups.
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Of course, we will! (I have been a member here for about 20 years, but my old user/pass would not work I suppose after a site upgrade) It is evident in the pictures that 15000 miles of short changes has not made any difference in the top end. I asked my son what he thought looking at it and he said he saw no difference under the valve covers. I was thinking this would be a good advertisement for HP to prove it works with eyes and pictures.

We have a little over 1000 miles on Castrol Edge 5w-30 currently and could be added to it by draining a bit. out, it holds 6 quarts. Can take pictures of the magic elixir being poured in and get a snap of the odometer. Anyone have any thoughts?
 
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RDY4WAR said:
The problem with that is the demonstrable results are largely anecdotal which is highly susceptible to bias (you paid money for it, you want it to work, so you easily convince yourself it does). Even if bias isn't a factor, it's still only as reliable as the knowledge of the person observing the results. Even among car enthusiasts, very few have even a basic understanding of oil chemistry.

Say it turns the oil black. Did it do so because it's cleaning... or because it compromised the oil's detergents and accelerated oxidation? (hint... it's the later)
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This reminds me of the recent oil filter discussion. Do we really need an in depth analytical study based on GC Mass Spectrometry results and PhD Chemist on hand to see if the internals of an engine is clean? MMO has been well liked for decades for a reason.
 
gfh77665 said:
This reminds me of the recent oil filter discussion. Do we really need an in depth analytical study based on GC Mass Spectrometry results and PhD Chemist on hand to see if the internals of an engine is clean? MMO has been well liked for decades for a reason.
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Yes, and that reason is people are gullible and will believe anything you slap on a label.
 
RDY4WAR said:
Yes, and that reason is people are gullible and will believe anything you slap on a label.
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A ton of gee-wiz additives have come and quickly went, because they really were useless junk. (Slick 50, prolong, etc.) They are basically gone, MMO is not. It has endured for decades. It won't go away because the demostrable results of MMO are real wether you like it or not. It has its place, and a 1990 sludged truck is one of them. Cheap, effective, and simple. No PhD chemistry degree required.

Gullible people are people are those who won't open their eyes, who insist on doubling down determind to believe what they want to believe.
 
gfh77665 said:
A ton of gee-wiz additives have come and quickly went, because they really were useless junk. (Slick 50, prolong, etc.) They are basically gone, MMO is not. It has endured for decades. It won't go away because the demostrable results of MMO are real wether you like it or not. It has its place, and a 1990 sludged truck is one of them. Cheap, effective, and simple. No PhD chemistry degree required.

Gullible people are people are those who won't open their eyes, who insist on doubling down determind to believe what they want to believe.
Click to expand...

Slick 50 is still around, as is Prolong. Slick 50, Lucas Oil Stabilizer, and Motor Honey are all the same polymer with no additives in them. They're still around. Same deal with MMO. Marketing works. That's all there is to it.
 
RDY4WAR said:
Slick 50 is still around, as is Prolong. Slick 50, Lucas Oil Stabilizer, and Motor Honey are all the same polymer with no additives in them. They're still around. Same deal with MMO. Marketing works. That's all there is to it.
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Was going to mention Lucas, it has a cult-like following but it's capable of literally nothing it claims to be able to do.
 
OVERKILL said:
Was going to mention Lucas, it has a cult-like following but it's capable of literally nothing it claims to be able to do.
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It's cringeworthy the things some people claim a supplement will do despite their anecdote defying laws of chemistry. It's like someone claiming they added soy sauce to a steak and made it less salty.
 
RDY4WAR said:
It's cringeworthy the things some people claim a supplement will do despite their anecdote defying laws of chemistry. It's like someone claiming they added soy sauce to a steak and made it less salty.
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"Bro, I dip my rounds in bullet-saver 9000, some forum dorks tell me it's just cat piss, but my rifle now shoots 1/8th MOA and can go through 4" plate at 20,000 yards".

Lucas.
 
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