Should I scratch my itch to switch?

[element]

I have 2k miles on my Honda Element. Instructions were to wait until the first scheduled service interval to change oil (5k for severe, 10k for normal) because of the additives Honda used to 'seat' the rings? valves? In any event, I drive up and down hills and frequently drive less than 10 miles per trip, so I figure I fall under the severe category.

I am concerned with the wear metals floating in my engine and how this 5W20 dino is going to hold up in this Southern California summer. I am ready to switch to M1 0W20 but I'm concerned with this warning of the rings/valves not seating properly if I switch to soon.

Any opinions/advise?

Second question: Given my severe condition, should I change at 5k with M1 or do 7.5k? And should I switch my oil filter (I use Honda OEM -- factory recommends switching filter every other oil change).

My rational tells me to do what the factory says. Wait 5k for 1st oil change. Change oil every 5k afterwards and oil filter every 10k.

I have the itch to switch to M1 now. Change oil AND filter every 6k miles thereafter.

Cost is not really an issue.

 

[CoosBayDave]

NO
But it wouldn't hurt to do an oc with some more of the same wt dino oil. In most cases synthetic oil is too slippery.... so that rings and things don't seat properly. Also read what Marvel Mystery Oil says about adding it to your gas to assist your rings in breaking in. Go to synth after a couple of thousand miles.

 

[element]

I already have 2000 miles on this car. Your recommendation is to just do a straight OC? But then I'll be draining the Honda break-in additives -- I'm concerned this will do more harm than good if the 0W20 is indeed as good as what people are seeing.

Just to clarify, go to synth after a couple thousand miles, do you mean 4,000 in my case then? Or did you simply missed the fact I already have 2k miles on the car.

 

[wn1998]

I would just wait the 5k honda says to. It won't hurt your car and than you will be sure everything is properly broken in. I can't see any positives of switching before the 5k mark they reccomend.

 

[SWS]

I have an '03 Honda Civic. I decided when I bought it new that I wanted to use Synth oil. Like you, I have a rather short 6 mile commute to work, and at that rate it would take a very long time to get to ~4K miles. Here is what I decided:

1) I was going to keep the original oil in the car until at least 3750 miles. The dealer strongly advised this.

2) I was going to try to ensure that I got the engine up to full temperature on every drive, even if that meant driving farther. Note - I bought this car in early February & I live in Tennessee.

3) Several times per week I would get it out on the highway and run it at those speeds for a while.

4) I was going to accumulate at least 3750 miles in 5 months, before the hottest part of the summer.

I was able to do all of those things and really enjoy some nice rides in the hilly country in East TN.

When the oil was changed at the dealer at 3900 miles, I saw the oil draining and it looked pretty good! I am no mechanic, but I have changed oil in most of my cars for 30 years, so my eyes are finely calibrated to inspect used oil running out of a hole and render instant judgement!

It now has accumulated ~700 miles on M1 in ~2.5 months. The oil level is still right on full and the oil is still very clear, even with a lot of in-town stop-and-go driving, idling, with many start-ups. My current thought is to go ~6 months on this oil.

I think that you should just drive & enjoy your very NICE car, get the oil & filter changed at ~4000 miles, use Synth, and continue to enjoy! I know what you mean about metal particles in the initial batch of oil - there are probably other assembly "contaminates" in there too! However, I think that you will do best to follow what Honda tells you. There are probably fewer metal particles in there than what we both imagine!

The Civic is my second new Honda - my other Honda is a '00 Odyssey - I left the first batch of oil in there for 3750 miles also.

Hope this helps.

Best Wishes as you motor along!

 

[GreenElixer]

element,
I, like sws, couldn't bear waiting until 5k on my '03 Honda Civic EX. I changed out factory fill with a good 5w-20 dino at 3k. Ran that until 5k. Switched to M1 0w-20 / Amsoil s2k 0w-30 synthetic home brew. Engine is clean, smooth, and I've actually recorded 48 mpg @ 56-57 mph on a 250 mile round trip (o.k. I babied it to see how good of gas mileage I could get!) but still get low 40 mpg on highway trips @ 65-70 mph. Changed oil at 14k w/ M1 0w-20 and SLX (GC)0w-30 home brew. The butt dyno says the M1/Amsoil brew runs in engine better...so I'll switch out back to M1/Amsoil brew at 20k to begin my 15k or 20k Oil Change Intervals. I may consider running a 5w-20 Royal Purple or Redline just for fun to see how UOA would come out running those oils before I lock down on M1/Amsoil mix. Anyway, my engine has 15k on it and it runs like the day off showroom floor. Hope this helps. I personally think it would be hard to mess it up if you go either way...3k, 4k, or 5k oc. Good Luck w/your Honda!

 

[JohnnyO]

I agree with wn1998, I would go the 5000 miles and then switch to Mobil 1.

 

[MikeR]

I'd dump it now, but I'm just like that. Wouldn't hurt.

You can change to synth anytime - the rings have long since seated by now.

MR

 

[element]

First of all, thank you for all your responses.

Does the Civic recommend 3,750 OCI for severe driving?

 

[KJA426]

I never put much stock in that waiting for a few thousand miles stuff. I've always switched after five or six hundred miles and never had a problem with any engine. I never run the engine any different while it is "breaking in" either.

 

[element]

Okay, let me re-phrase the question then. Is there any drawback in leaving this factory fill Honda oil with its special additives to help seat the rings for 5k miles (severe condition) or 10k miles (normal condition) like the factory recommends?

I am somehow not entirely comfortable with Honda recommending 10k OCI with dino, but I can still accept 5k.

On a side note, the sales person recommends doing the first oil change at 2,500 miles. Though I tend to discount opinions of the sales staff just because I am never sure where they are coming from or what they are trying to achieve.

I do like Porsche's instructions much better. My Boxster with its 2.7L engine takes 9 qts of Mobil 1 0W-40. Factory recommends OCI of 15k or one year, whichever comes first. I change it every year because I never drive more than 15k a year.

 

[VTEC01EX]

Your rings have already seated - I wouldn't worry about that. I'd run the oil another thousand miles and change it out. I ran the factory fill on my 01 Civic EX (**** , the D17 is popular in here) for 4K, then ran an assortment of 5w20 dinos up till 30K, when I finally changed to M1 0w20. Obviously, with only 35k on the car everything is still squeaky clean in there, but I just don't think it really matters. Change the fact fill by 5k, and change dino every 5k, synth every 7.5k or so, and the thing will still last forever. You really can't go wrong with a Honda 4cyl. **** , it'd probably run a few thousand miles with nothing but good intentions in the crankcase.

 

[element]

I think I've decided on leaving the Honda factory fill in for at least 4k miles (a nice middle point between the old 3k OCI and the recommended 5k). I'm planning on doing it somewhere between 4-5k -- whenever I can no longer stand to not scratch my itch.

I've convinced myself there shouldn't be any seal leak issue with the M1, thus I will go with the M1 0W-20. Bottom line is that it will only cost an extra $15 over dino for that peace of mind.

This car is subject to a lot of short trips (see last paragraph), and the heat of the Southern California summer (I'm not concerned at all with the Southern California winter -- or as some call it, the San Francisco summer). Thus, the factory puts it in a severe 5k miles scheduled maintenance. Factory also recommends oil filter to be changed every OTHER oil change.

I am debating going to a 7.5k OCI with M1. Factory's normal scheduled maintenance is at 10k. I figured with M1, I should be able to split the severe (5k) and normal (10k) OCI at 7.5k. I haven't gotten fully comfortable with changing oil filter every 15k though (every other 7.5k). If I follow the 5k OCI with M1, then I would definitely do a 10k OFCI instead of 5k.

There were some discussions on how some oil filters only become fully effective after 3k or so miles. Any thoughts on a 10k or 15k OFCI -- using OEM Honda oil filters by Filtech?

The following paragraph is a side note and has nothing to do with oil change, just a car nut's rant...

The dilemma of being a car lover and a dog lover. I bought the car to take my dogs everywhere, especially the park. I use to take them in my wife's minivan, that's why we got a minivan even though we have no children. We woiuld have gotten a manly, gas guzzling SUV, but it was easier for them to jump into a minivan rather than a tall SUV. Over the past 12 months, my in-laws began visiting a lot (due to medical reasons). It was a pain cleaning dog hair out of the minivan, it stuck all over the place -- and me, being a car nut, once I clean, it has to be clean. Needless to say, everytime my in-laws come, I spend HOURS cleaning the car. First I wash it, then, I might as well wax it, then vacuum all the dog hair out of the interior, use lint remover, etc etc. Once the car is spotless, my wife remembered how nice it was to go out and not have to remove dog hair from your attire (I thought about using shirts and pants, but then some of you will ask me why my wife doesn't wear skirts. I thought about saying shirts, skirts and pants, then some of you would ask why I am wearing skirts, so attire would be a safer route, I think, I hope). Anyhow, now my wife prefers to keep her minivan clean. I had my best friend's Xterra at my disposal. He doesn't care about cars nor is he around much (1 month out of the year). So I was using that, but then, the SUV problem being so tall, sometimes, my dogs miss the jump. I started lifting them up on the car, but they still like to try to jump. Finally, I couldn't take it anymore, so I got them an Element, easy for them to jump in through the side door. I should have bought a stripped 5 speed, but I really like cars, so since I'll be driving the car - not the dogs, I figure I should get what I want. So the dogs ended up with a brand new fully loaded Element. (Trust me, I realize how crazy this sounds to a non-dog lover, but I figure some of you might be amused) Now, I love my dogs, so off to the park every opportunity I get. But I love my car, and the closest park is 0.5 miles away. Now that's a really short trip, and really bad for the engine. So I ended up going to the park that's 4 miles away just so I don't take short trips in the car -- sigh! The situation I put myself into.

 

[SWS]

I also have the concern about driving short distances & shutting down. IMO, not fully warming up the engine is bad, so in our family we combine errands, use the car that has already been started that day (not the others that are stone cold), etc. I prefer to push the car out of the garage rather than starting it if I only need the garage for a project.

However, I decided that with 3 cars and 4 drivers in my family now, I am just going to have to get over it, and that is one reason I switched to Synth. Compared to Conventional oil, Synth oil clings to the engine internals better when the engine is off, pump-up is faster on start-up, and it has a more robust additive pack that will resist contamination.

Maybe I am getting old (at 48?), but I suggest that you let your very nice cars serve you rather than you serving them. Yes, highly maintain them, etc, but go to the park of YOUR choice with your dogs, not to one that satisfies the temp gauge!