Been away from the forum for a long time, so I'm not up to speed with the goings on here. Are people around here still into the the LCD product line like they used to be (i.e. FP Plus, LC20)? I've been approaching the end of my supply, and trying to determine if it's worth replenishing.
My Mazda6 has been given both of these products for the majority of it's life thus far. 110k on the odo right now. Knock on wood, the car still runs very nicely, and I've never even had a check engine light. Granted I do take excellent care of it. The only difference is that my average fuel mileage has slowly tapered off from its peak of 28mpg down to 24mpg. It peaked around 60,000 miles.
I attribute the decline in performance to the age of my vehicle. Otherwise it runs very smoothly, and seemingly still has all of its power. What I like to believe is that these products have helped keep my engine healthy. Although sometimes I wonder, but that's the natural born skeptic in me.
So now that my car has accumulated some age, I'm wondering if I have reached the point of diminishing returns with the LCD products. I'm not even sure how I can determine the usefulness of the products anymore other than by tabulating fuel consumption. What I really want is to maintain the condition of my engine as best as possible, and get at least 200,000 miles out of the engine.
Should I Continue Using LCD Products?
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when the last time u tuned it up such as spark plugs and wires? in terms of miles and most o2 sensors recommend interval replacement around 60-80k miles. Im told nothing last forever.....
A good fuel system cleaner might help....suggest either Redline SL-1 or Chevron Techron.
Using those products seemed to help my vehicle and tweak up the mpg some.
One other thing...you didn't mention if your running on conventional (dino) or synthetic oil. If your doing conventional, a change to a good synthetic might help as well.
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2003 Ford Focus SE (2.3L) / 82K
Valvoline Maxlife Syn 5w30 / OCI 7000+/-
Purolator PureOne 10241
Redline SL-1 Complete Fuel System Cleaner
02 sensors and plugs.....milage will comeback. 110k time for both.
I agree on a bottle of SL-1
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V1, there are no better products to maintain an engine than the LC and FP combination. The older your engine gets the more important LC and FP become. Using a fuel system cleaner once every now and then only treats the symptoms not the underlying problem. Keep the carbon build up and varnish to a minimum an there will never be a need to shock treat it with one time cleaners.
Originally Posted By: LCD
V1, there are no better products to maintain an engine than the LC and FP combination. The older your engine gets the more important LC and FP become. Using a fuel system cleaner once every now and then only treats the symptoms not the underlying problem. Keep the carbon build up and varnish to a minimum an there will never be a need to shock treat it with one time cleaners.
I'm looking at the same situation with 175k on a diesel and 125k on a sludger. Thought about it a while, and came up with the same question.
Why wouldn't I just replenish my supply?
So I did.
If I have enough good reasons to keep buying the stuff, then chances are I will do so. Clearly it is a trusted product around here, and I've felt good about using it all along. At some point, the car is not worth it anymore, but I'm not exactly sure when that is yet.
As far as the maintenance, like I said, it has been excellent all around! The spark plugs were replaced at 70k. The wires are coil-on-plug. So I do not believe that those get replaced unless one of them fails. O2 sensors are original, and probably getting tired. Should I replace them all? Or let one fail before replacing the entire set? Now I'm curious to see if I can squeeze out some better mileage out of my car again.
If you replace one O2 sensor, replace them all. It's not mandatory if you're short on money, but it's a good idea. It's not cheap to remove the head and adjust the valves, but I also like to do this at 100,000 miles. Personal preference. I'm the preventive maintenance type, not "drive it until it breaks."
I used FP60 for over 100,000 miles in a '97 Camry, which never required fuel injection cleaning. Previously, the injectors had to be cleaned every 25,000 miles. I currently use FP Plus in a '09 Civic Hybrid. If it ever did stop working, I wouldn't hesitate to dump it, but I don't expect that to happen.
You will probably notice an improvement with new O2 sensors. I used LCD products, then switched over to the mystery oil in the fuel and oil. Recent emissions testing gave similar results except for NOx which was where I thought I would be having a problem because of the previous elevated levels, but NOx had dropped significantly.
Originally Posted By: ediamiam
You will probably notice an improvement with new O2 sensors. I used LCD products, then switched over to the mystery oil in the fuel and oil. Recent emissions testing gave similar results except for NOx which was where I thought I would be having a problem because of the previous elevated levels, but NOx had dropped significantly.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: ediamiam
You will probably notice an improvement with new O2 sensors. I used LCD products, then switched over to the mystery oil in the fuel and oil. Recent emissions testing gave similar results except for NOx which was where I thought I would be having a problem because of the previous elevated levels, but NOx had dropped significantly.
Sorry, but I think you guys are crazy, spending probably a couple of hundred dollars on O2 sensors that work just fine, I mean OP's car passes emissions right, just to save a couple of bucks on fuel? The cost will never be returned, because the new O2 sensors will probably get "tired" again before the cost is recouped, and that's assuming that the fuel mileage will actually go up, which i highly doubt.
The change in fuel mileage is really insignificant in this case, and can be attributed to things line new tires, colder temps, lower tire pressure, maybe worn transmission fluid, a sticky brake caliper or slider pin etc. I would definitely not change the O2 sensors unless you get a CEL or emissions start to go up, besides there is absolutely no guarantee that the new sensors will get the fuel mileage improved.
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KrisZ, chances are that installing new O2 sensors will not restore the 4mpg I once had, but 4mpg is nothing to scoff at. I'd love to get it back if I could. Whether my car lost 4mpg from age, or O2 sensors or whatever, I really don't know.
All those other possible factors you pointed out are valid, but probably not in my case. I take care of all that stuff very diligently. So I'm running out of ideas.
Btw, my Frontier has 115k miles. I like to think that I am just as diligent on staying on top of potential problems. Mileage this winter has been consistent with what I was getting over the summer, 24-28 city/hwy, even w/ winter fuel, and only difference again is with the mystery oil. Am I a convert, not necessarily.
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
Sorry, but I think you guys are crazy, spending probably a couple of hundred dollars on O2 sensors that work just fine, I mean OP's car passes emissions right, just to save a couple of bucks on fuel? The cost will never be returned, because the new O2 sensors will probably get "tired" again before the cost is recouped, and that's assuming that the fuel mileage will actually go up, which i highly doubt.
The coils mazda uses on the 6 aren't very strong. It is a fairly common problem for older, high mileage 6's with the coils to start dropping MPG's because the coils aren't outputting like they are supposed to. They've also been known to be the cause of misfire CEL's while at high rpm's.
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V1,
I too am a very satisfied user of Lube Control's products. I have been using them since mid-2004 and will continue to do so as long as the products are made. However, I do not believe they will keep my car in like new condition without a little help from Auto-rx. Have you ever heard about Auto-Rx on this forum?
In my Honda Civic that is rated for 38 mpg on the highway, I can get in the mid-forties during the summer using Auto-Rx, FP Plus, and LC20. One of the ways I can tell it is time to use Auto-Rx again is when the mileage consistently drops to about 39-40 mpg. Once it does this, I stop using Lube Control's products and intall Auto-Rx. Once the Auto-Rx's clean and rinse phases are done, then I will begin to use LC20 and FP Plus again. The mileage then jumps back up to the mid-forties with some tank averages getting as high as 48 mpg in the first few thousand miles.
So, to answer your question, most definitely YES. However, use Auto-Rx every twenty to thirty thousand miles to help give LC20 and FP Plus an additional "kick." I have been doing this for five "cycles" and ever time I see my fuel economy jump, I am more convinced than ever that I am doing the right thing for my car.
By the way, I just finished an Auto-Rx clean and rinse phase. Am now on my first thousand miles with the new oil and LC20. So far, it looks like my fuel economy has gone from an average of 37-38 mpg to 42-43. I expect it to climb even further when the weather warms up here in Indiana. I know it may be difficult for some people to believe what I am typing. To be honest, I don't really care what other people think, V1. I have done these "cycles" too many times to doubt the results. I am telling you all this because you are a fellow Lube Control user and I want you see you get the most from their products.
Bobby
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