Shaeffers #132 Moly EP with Amsoil Synthetic.

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I am using Amsoil 5w-30 synthetic in my 2003 corolla. Is it a good idea for me to add some Shaeffers #132 EP?. My reason for asking is I want to limit cold start wear to a minimum-even though I live in North Florida. But, more importantly, I don't want to cause harm to my engine by adding something to the Amsoil that would decrease its effectivness (Amsoil says to not add additives). I like what I have read about #132 EP and Moly additives and the fact that it provides startup and extra engine protection in case of oil failure. I would use Shaeffers blended motor oil, but I have 9 bottles of Amsoil to use first-I'm not knocking Amsoil. This is probably a non issue for my car, but, I am intrigued by this topic of motor oils and the best protection offered. I would appreciate any comments.
 

MolaKule

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Are you using the ASL or the HDD version? I am not sure you are going to see any cold start wear in SF, but I like the idea of two additional AW/EP additives as insurance. 4oz. to 8 oz. of #132 should be sufficient.
 
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Why not go with M1 SS after you run through your Amsoil? I have a 01 Corolla with 100,000 miles on it and have been running Amsoil 0w-30. After comming across this website, I most likely will go no further then 6-7K miles before changes and then go back to M1 for cost reasons. M1 also has Moly. I'm not an expert like many on this site, but after reading the analysis results, don't go to far with Amsoil or any other oil. Off Topic: do you have a manual trans? If so what rpms to you find yourself shifting at? 1st to 2nd gear etc. I have been having some hesitation problems and find shifting is much smoother at 3,000 on up. These cars are built like tanks. [ December 09, 2002, 08:13 PM: Message edited by: buster ]
 
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Although adding a little #132 should help overall, I don't believe it will specifically reduce cold start wear. The primary benefit in using the 132 is viscosity stability in situations where oil sheer occurs....or with a thin starting oil like M1. Addition of the organometalic friction modifiers (Moly and Antimony) is certainly beneficial but most of the information I've come across indicates that Moly and Anti work most effectively at higher temperatures than the ZDDP which your Amsoil is loaded with giving better protection over a wider temperature range. There was an article worth checking out recently posted in 'Interesting Articles' that covered FM's. [ December 09, 2002, 09:40 PM: Message edited by: mormit ]
 

MolaKule

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The #132 also acts as an Anti-Wear/EP additive in case a high load is experienced. Assuming #132 has been added, the base oil oil has already carried that additive to the parts that might need the added boundary lube.
 
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Why not just use one oil and never mind mixing and matching? Seems to me any good quality synthetic will keep the car going for many years and fooling around blending different oils and additves may not be good. After all this fooling around, something will happen to car later on and you will blame it all on Amsoil, forgetting you played chemist and experimented. just my 2 cents. I suppposed I will catch hell for this???
 

MolaKule

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Mike, I agree with most of what you say. However, I have tested #132 and have done at least 4 analyses using 132 and using different UAO companies. Wear was reduced, tbn stabilized, and oxidation buildup was slower using #132. Engine operation was smoother as well. I only wish it had 150 ppm of moly instead of 24 ppm of moly. But it does have Antimony (another AW/EP additive) and a great surfactant that also acts as a lubricant.
 
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Toycor7, The oil will work fine "as is" - I would not mess with it. IMHO, it is stupid to use your personal vehicle as a "testbed" unless you don't mind replacing the engine if you ruin it by playing organic chemist in your garage. Can somebody step in off the street and do your job better than you can with NO training? Well, by adding some snake oil to your crankcase, you are essentially saying you know more about oil formulation than the team of chemical engineers and organic chemists who developed it. Most of whom have graduate degrees and decades of experience in the field. The chances are that you won't do any major damage doing this, but you can get adverse reactions. Try adding a quart of Marvel Mystery Oil to four quarts of Amsoil sometime. Heat it up and it turns to a nice gel after a while - a local guy at an auto parts store actually did this and then whined about it. If you want something better, the Series 2000, 0w-30 is a better, abeit more expensive, formulation than the regular 5w-30. It will hold up better for drain intervals >12,000 miles ....It'll cost you about $10.00-$12.00 more per oil change, depending on the size of the sump. I think folks who use these snake oil additives should also operate on themselves when they need open heart surgery - just watch "ER" for a few weeks and you should be good to go ... [Eek!]
 
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Is it a snake oil if used while under warranty ? Then if out of warranty it is a useful additive ? Bottom line is that there is Chemistry, IF you have identified the components of the formulation then tested for compatibility and examined a oil after use through analysis and it does well you can reasonably assess the "snake Oil" nature of a given additive. Case in point, Chlorinated Paraffins in specific products DO reduce friction and increase fuel economy, and power. They also at some point become uninhibited and break down contributing to increased acid formation eating soft metals, all aspects detectable and observed by the average gear head with a oil analysis kit. [ December 15, 2002, 11:12 PM: Message edited by: Terry ]
 

MolaKule

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TooSlick, "Well, by adding some snake oil to your crankcase, you are essentially saying you know more about oil formulation than the team of chemical engineers and organic chemists who developed it. Most of whom have graduate degrees and decades of experience in the field." I assume you know for a fact that there are no people on this board with said qualifications?
 

MolaKule

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Toy, I beleive that #132 should be more appropriately called a "supplement." A supplement adds-to the oil something that wasn't there in the first place, such as moly and Antimony.
 
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To all the naysayers of some of us using the 132 to ones advantage take a look below at the analysis results I had when using the 132 Schaeffers.There it is in black and white. If the car had not been stop and go'ed umpteen times a day and seen more hiway use it is looking like it compares with the precious synlubes for much less money . It was noted to show one of the best hiway gas milaege average ever with this BREW. So tell me,is Phillips a good oil or is the 132 the maker of this good analysis ? I think it is synergistic because there was 131 Nuetra in every tank of gas and the motor oil and two additives worked well for me,,at 5 bucks less per quart than some synlubes. Is 4 quarts of this BREW at the same price of one quart of Amsoil scary for some who sell the synlubes? [Razz] There is only 3 additves out there I would put in my oil,the 132 is one of them. Disclaimer,,ask your Mom or Attorney before BREWING oils that make a better end product than higher cost formulated oils [LOL!] Just my opinion to not brew like I do, I think you should follow you owners manual and sleep well with less money under your pillow [Razz] ANA Laboratories ran the Analysis 1992 Cavalier 3122 miles on oil,166k on car the car was driven primarily in town by my Daughter,ambient from mid 80's to high 60's,no a/c use- two days before it was pulled I ran it to TX,400 or so miles round trip 4 quart system,Supertech filter "oversized" make up oil,,none.Was still full. Schaeffers 131 Nuetra was used every tank full at 2 ounces per 10 gallon treat rate Phillips Trop Artic 5/30 SL GF3 94cents a quart Titanium< 1 Silver< 1 Copper 1 Lead< 1 Tin 4 Aluminum 4 Nickel<1 Iron <1 Chromium <1 Cd<1 Sodium<1 Boron<1 Silicon<1- new airfilter Pepboys Proline was a bit oily Water< .05 Soot<.05 Glycol Negative Fuel <.05 ISO Grade 530 VIS @ 100C 11.63 Mo 24 MG <1 Ca 1061 Ba <1 Phosphorus 667 Zinc 727 The additive you wonder I am betting? 4 ounces of 132 Schaeffers
 
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I would like to personally and publically thank Molakule for taking his time to post on this forum. He is not the type that needs to come here to learn . I think we are graced by his presence here but most don't aknowledge it. Ya never know what you have till it's gone. If he gets bored with the Data Sheet guys'Naysayers and moves on he will be missed much [Frown]
 
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quote:
Originally posted by MolaKule: Toy, I beleive that #132 should be more appropriately called a "supplement." A supplement adds-to the oil something that wasn't there in the first place, such as moly and Antimony.
Very well put. [bowdown]
 
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quote:
Originally posted by BOBISTHEOILGUY:
quote:
Originally posted by MolaKule: Toy, I beleive that #132 should be more appropriately called a "supplement." A supplement adds-to the oil something that wasn't there in the first place, such as moly and Antimony.
Very well put. [bowdown]

And obviously there is more to the 132 than just Moly, the Antimony is a studly and desirable product in the 132 [Cool] I was told months ago the 132 was just about the same thing as STP and not to use it. [Roll Eyes] Then afterwords Molakule explained me what it really was and how it functioned it made sense. When messing with formulations a guy is playing with fire. I can point to 3 analysis with other products that obviously hurt the motor oils ability to work as it was made to do,,guess I am saying some work,others don't but the forum leaders or it's members cannot be held responsible for anything posted here that might hurt a motor in certain circumstances,,if the motor goes down,it might have been headed that direction anyway or other contributing factors. There always has been and always will be a interest in making a forumlated oil a tad bit better with a dab of something else,,this is bit one way to do it with certain oils,motors and usage imo. If you want this Mo and Antimony in a formulated proven oil,the Schaeffers has it already mixed for you in 32 ounce bottles. [Wink] So you can play it safe or play around . It's up to the consumer and liability lays with the consumer imo. But to denounce something you have never tried? [No no] To denounce something you have not tried wisely is a double [No no] [No no] I in the past did not like Broccoli mostly because others said they did not like it. Now Broccoli is one of my favorites whether others like it or not [Razz]
 
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